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Thread: weapons not allowed in a bank?

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    weapons not allowed in a bank?

    Ok so I was cc carring into a bank but it was obvious cc since I had a shirt over my paddle holster/Glock 17. As I entered a man ...who I assumed had to be the Wells Fargo people greeter told me "no weapons are allowed in banks" thou he didn't ask me to leave directly, I chose to leave and most likely I will be switching banks. Guys, should I seek clarifications from WF or just dump them all together?

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    Regular Member JustaShooter's Avatar
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    Clarify it with Wells Fargo, there is no Federal or (as far as I can find) Colorado law against carrying in banks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lukaszu View Post
    Ok so I was cc carring into a bank but it was obvious cc since I had a shirt over my paddle holster/Glock 17. As I entered a man ...who I assumed had to be the Wells Fargo people greeter told me "no weapons are allowed in banks" thou he didn't ask me to leave directly, I chose to leave and most likely I will be switching banks. Guys, should I seek clarifications from WF or just dump them all together?


    Why did you not just withdraw all your money right then and there? Heck now these guys will want to charge us for holding our money and the feds won't let us get our money out ....
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 11-27-2013 at 01:28 PM.

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    Regular Member mobiushky's Avatar
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    There is no such statute in CO. However, it may be Wells Fargo policy. I don't recall that being the case, but it might be worth verifying. Above all, don't push the issue while carrying or to the point that you upset the branch manager. If you get asked to leave, leave. Don't want to end up fighting a trespass.

    You can be polite and simply ask to speak to the manager. Ask plainly, is it Wells Fargo policy to not allow law abiding citizens to legally carry protection in their branches. If the answer is yes, then tell them you would like to close your accounts immediately.

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    The man was lying. I OC into my credit union frequently during summer months. The bank is not a prohibited place, the man is expressing his uninfiormed opinion on what the law is.

    Do switch banks, or better still get in a credit union. I got out of banks years ago, they are rapacious.

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    Wells Fargo has always been known as the bandit bank. They nickle and dime you for everything. Their profitability has always been at the top of the pack of public banks - partly because they don't do stupid things like Chase, BofA, Citibank, but underlying it is always to see customers as profit centers no matter how small the account. I agree that Credit Unions are much more accomodating to normal customers.
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    Regular Member F350's Avatar
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    I OC in Wells Fargo here in Grand Junction all the time, even had a nice conversation with the branch manager a couple of weeks ago (non-gun related but I was open carrying a 5" double stack 1911, hard to have missed).


    Quote Originally Posted by HPmatt View Post
    Wells Fargo has always been known as the bandit bank. They nickle and dime you for everything. Their profitability has always been at the top of the pack of public banks - partly because they don't do stupid things like Chase, BofA, Citibank, but underlying it is always to see customers as profit centers no matter how small the account. I agree that Credit Unions are much more accomodating to normal customers.
    I agree, I am now looking to move to a Credit Union. When a used car lot can beat the interest rate your bank offers you; it is time to move!!!
    Last edited by F350; 11-27-2013 at 03:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    ... Heck now these guys will want to charge us for holding our money and the feds won't let us get our money out ....
    http://www.businessinsider.com/in-th...-money-2013-11

    Business Insider - ‎Nov 25, 2013‎ Now, it is considering a policy change that could lead banks to charge depositors negative interest rates. The Fed has control of short-term interest rates. During recessions, it cuts those rates to bring about greater investment and growth.
    G00gle Real Time coverage URL (I didn't expect G00gle to set one)

    https://news.google.com/news/rtc?ncl...dad664f6bc54ef
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    Regular Member rushcreek2's Avatar
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    I'm more than just a little confused. You were CC'ing but .......IT WAS OBVIOUS because you had a shirt over your paddle holster......? Therefore you were OC'ing.....? NO. You were not DISPLAYING ....so you were not OC'ing. What you wear under your clothing is YOUR business.

    " I beg your pardon...?" followed by ....simply proceeding about your banking business would be in order.

    Was this guy " Superman" meaning X-Ray vision....?

    I hope this "Barney Fife" realizes that when he pulls this on a bank robber ..he will likely be shot.
    Last edited by rushcreek2; 11-27-2013 at 03:55 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rushcreek2 View Post
    I'm more than just a little confused. You were CC'ing but .......IT WAS OBVIOUS because you had a shirt over your paddle holster......? Therefore you were OC'ing.....? NO. You were not DISPLAYING ....so you were not OC'ing. What you wear under your clothing is YOUR business.

    " I beg your pardon...?" followed by ....simply proceeding about your banking business would be in order.

    Was this guy " Superman" meaning X-Ray vision....?

    I hope this "Barney Fife" realizes that when he pulls this on a bank robber ..he will likely be shot.
    I am 5"7 150 lbs so It's easy to tell if I have something on my hip. By law I was cc since my pistol was covered from all sides. But there was a nice big outline that I guess screams Glock!
    I did leave out the part where he asked me .. sir, do you gun?
    I didn't really push the issue, I just turned and went to do other things. My 6 year old was with me at the time and my baby was at home with mom So I didn't want to press it. Till I get some good advice.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    While I agree with the above, an obvious hidden gun is naturally more cause for alarm than an openly carried one. No legal difference most of the time, with proper documents, but a natural one as hiding guns (when not already in the hands) is the method of the bad guy, which is why most states first started making concealing illegal without making carrying illegal; which then led to where most states are now, needing a license to do an otherwise illegal act.

    So while I agree that you did nothing legally wrong, it is my instinct to wonder why you would obviously conceal a gun.

    As a guard, I wouldn't take my eyes off you, whereas if you were openly carrying, I'd have better things to do than care.
    Last edited by MAC702; 11-27-2013 at 04:24 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Banks start charging interest to hold cash ... expect those banks to go belly up pretty quick !

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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    While I agree with the above, an obvious hidden gun is naturally more cause for alarm than an openly carried one. No legal difference most of the time, with proper documents, but a natural one as hiding guns (when not already in the hands) is the method of the bad guy, which is why most states first started making concealing illegal without making carrying illegal; which then led to where most states are now, needing a license to do an otherwise illegal act.

    So while I agree that you did nothing legally wrong, it is my instinct to wonder why you would obviously conceal a gun.

    As a guard, I wouldn't take my eyes off you, whereas if you were openly carrying, I'd have better things to do than care.
    I see your point, I dnt like doing business in Thornton I still remember what happen to that guy at the Thornton movie theater.

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    lukaszu,

    I OC into any business I don't see a "No Guns" sign. Including Wells Fargo.

    The Wells Fargo branch I frequent most [here in Colorado Springs] is @ N. Powers & Briargate Pkwy. Next is the one on Research & N. Union. And once I went to the Wells Fargo @ N. Academy & Austin Bluffs. No problems at any of them (some customers occasionally looked at gun but no one said anything). I was in the Wells Fargo on N. Academy (7473) once but was not OCing at the time, so don't know how they'd be.

    Not only were there no unpleasant experiences, 1-2 of the tellers @ the Powers & Briargate location seem very pro-carry and 2nd Amendment oriented (one reason it's my preferred branch). IIRC, they have a CC permit themselves and at least CC if they do not OC. The last time I was there I was getting a money-order and cashier's check (needed for my application/appointment to apply for my CC permit @ the Sheriff's Office) and of course, they noted to whom the checks were made -- and guessed I was going for my CC permit.

    Still, every time they see me in there, I am OCing. Have not, however, noticed anyone else OCing though [@ Wells Fargo]. But that's not surprising, as most people don't OC anyway...

    The only OTHER OCer I've seen here in COS was soon after I arrived: At the Village Inn @ Woodmen & Duryea. We talked for a bit, but frankly I didn't even NOTICE he was OCing right away...so much for people being observant! I've seen no other OCers since...

    My OCing up in Parker brought some comments, but none were negative. I guess they don't see people OC much in Parker...

    :-(

    -- cloudcroft (formerly of Galveston, TX)
    Last edited by cloudcroft; 11-29-2013 at 02:02 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lukaszu View Post
    I see your point, I dnt like doing business in Thornton I still remember what happen to that guy at the Thornton movie theater.
    Well it was certainly a dire hassle, but the shoe is on the other foot now. The charges on him were dropped 9no crime committed) and there is a lawsuit against the city over it. Similar incidents have resulted in payouts by the Constitution hating authorities in Longmont etc so its likely they will get spanked to some degree for it.

    Still you have a point, not everyone has time to spend a few hours having their rights violated.

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    I went to a Wells Fargo branch here to get a cashier's check to make a purchase on gunbroker. My banker saw the payee name and asked what I was buying. I said a Kimber 1911. He said sweet, bring it in when you get it. So pistols definitely allowed in my bank.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anubis View Post
    I went to a Wells Fargo branch here to get a cashier's check to make a purchase on gunbroker. My banker saw the payee name and asked what I was buying. I said a Kimber 1911. He said sweet, bring it in when you get it. So pistols definitely allowed in my bank.
    Stepped into a Wells Fargo to make a payment, no issues. But then again... I wasn't OC. Remembering all this, I did do a quick scan for signs and saw none.

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    The guy was wrong in that he implied that weapons are not allowed in banks.

    However his statement could very easily be construed to meet Colorado's requirement for an employee telling you to disarm or leave so pushing the issue with him would have gotten you nowhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bomber View Post
    However his statement could very easily be construed to meet Colorado's requirement for an employee telling you to disarm or leave so pushing the issue with him would have gotten you nowhere.
    Can any ol' employee tell you to leave, or can you insist that the manager/owner do it? Like, if I'm grocery shopping, can a stocker or bagboy tell me to leave, or does the manager on-duty have that power?

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    Quote Originally Posted by meadowsr View Post
    Can any ol' employee tell you to leave, or can you insist that the manager/owner do it? Like, if I'm grocery shopping, can a stocker or bagboy tell me to leave, or does the manager on-duty have that power?
    You'll get other answers, but here is my take: even the lowliest stock boy/girl can tell you to leave. You heard that right. They CAN (as in, have the ability to) tell you to leave, just like I can ask everyone I meet to do the Macarena while jumping around on one foot.

    Whether they have the authority to do so is another matter, which you can now use to your advantage, and to further defend our RKBA when you:

    • Leave the store peaceably and without spending a dime (if you've just bought something, ask for a refund on the spot),

    • Calmly walk out of the store while maintaining a polite demeanor,

    • Then proceed to contact either corporate (preferred method as the slap-down that will be dealt to the manager of the store in question will likely inspire a b****-slap of mighty proportions to the lying cretin who enforced his own policy over that of the store when he asked you to leave), or call the store and ask for the manager (roughly same effect as previous method, but less enthusiasm in the b****-slap to the anti-freedom worker).


    If nothing else, this could help the store manager and employees remember that we are Law-Abiding Citizens (LACs) armed with knowledge, patience, and virtue, besides the obvious gun.

    Another route would be to ask to speak to the manager on the spot (great if you need a laugh that day, as the overzealous anti-freedom employee will likely do their best impersonation of a deer caught in some headlights; if you are video recording, it could make for a great holiday card or meme)
    Last edited by Rusty Young Man; 12-02-2013 at 10:14 PM.
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    If you disregard a lower employee telling you to leave, you'd better be darn sure the manager is going to side with you. Because barring any pre-knowledge, you should assume the employee has been given the authority by his management to do whatever it is he is doing for the store.

    Leave, then call the manager. The manager will either confirm it, or profusely apologize. Either way, it makes the better impression.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Quote Originally Posted by meadowsr View Post
    Can any ol' employee tell you to leave, or can you insist that the manager/owner do it? Like, if I'm grocery shopping, can a stocker or bagboy tell me to leave, or does the manager on-duty have that power?
    Legally, anyone who works there can tell you to leave or disarm and you can either leave, disarm, or face a trespassing charge.

    C.R.S. 18-12-214-5

    (5) Nothing in this part 2 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of a private property owner, private tenant, private employer, or private business entity.

    Part of what makes Colorado's gun laws better than other states, in my opinion, is that they are vague and the interpretation is generally taken widely instead of narrowly. What this means for the statute above is that because the line does not exclude employees in the business who are not managers, owners, etc, then the rights of the employee to enforce a no gun policy within the business are valid under existing property rights laws.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bomber View Post
    Legally, anyone who works there can tell you to leave or disarm and you can either leave, disarm, or face a trespassing charge.

    C.R.S. 18-12-214-5

    (5) Nothing in this part 2 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of a private property owner, private tenant, private employer, or private business entity.

    Part of what makes Colorado's gun laws better than other states, in my opinion, is that they are vague and the interpretation is generally taken widely instead of narrowly. What this means for the statute above is that because the line does not exclude employees in the business who are not managers, owners, etc, then the rights of the employee to enforce a no gun policy within the business are valid under existing property rights laws.
    Also,

    C.R.S. 18-4-201 (3)
    A person “enters unlawfully” or “remains unlawfully” in or upon premises when the person is not licensed, invited, or otherwise privileged to do so. A person who, regardless of his or her intent, enters or remains in or upon premises that are at the time open to the public does so with license and privilege unless the person defies a lawful order not to enter or remain, personally communicated to him or her by the owner of the premises or some other authorized person.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dario View Post
    Also,

    C.R.S. 18-4-201 (3)
    A person “enters unlawfully” or “remains unlawfully” in or upon premises when the person is not licensed, invited, or otherwise privileged to do so. A person who, regardless of his or her intent, enters or remains in or upon premises that are at the time open to the public does so with license and privilege unless the person defies a lawful order not to enter or remain, personally communicated to him or her by the owner of the premises or some other authorized person.
    Yes, thank you

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    AWESOME post

    Quote Originally Posted by Anubis View Post
    asked what I was buying. I said a Kimber 1911. He said sweet, bring it in when you get it. .
    HAHAHAHAHA LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

    My advice, from experience, is not to get mad, but get MORE than even.

    Idiots like that guard need a lesson. Dont try to educate them, put the Management on the spot and him in risk of losing his job, hell "see the light" REAL fast.

    Tell Management, not defending yourself but putting the burden of proof on them to cite the applicable law, and that they are there to serve YOU. They will either "help" him see the light in a mystical, cloud parting beams of light from
    the Heavens sort of revelation, or lose your business, and this is NOT the time a Bank wants to either or both lose a depositor or get bad press.

    Banks, deservedly, have lots of bad press.

    I OC or CC in my bank, they are all too glad. They all know it. it helps having money on deposit too.

    PS its not a "weapon" its a firearm. BIG difference. "Weapon" is a use. "Firearm" is a tangible piece of personal property you are "bearing"

    Using the word "weapon" gives the gun grabbers traction against you. "Firearm I own" puts the burden on them to prove theres some reason you shouldnt be able to posess your lawful
    got property (and they are trying)
    Last edited by Capn Camo; 12-10-2013 at 04:45 PM.

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