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Thread: Tales of tyranny

  1. #1
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Tales of tyranny

    This is becoming more and more the norm.....this is why I say the whole barrel is rotten......the local cops, prosecutor and judge all colluded in this disgusting display of tyranny.

    Really makes me mad because this very close to me both in location and because I work in the building industry and have seen property rights destroyed in this state.

    FUQ
    “The justification for using a criminal search warrant was (that) we denied them (government officials) access,” Errol Speed said. “They never asked for access.”
    http://myfreedomfoundation.com/blog/...-the-san-juans

    Sheriff Rob Nou, Prosecutor Randy Gaylord and judge Stewart Andrew, you are the reasons why I despise the state, I have ran into your types you are the criminals. Any deputies that partook in this you are just as liable. Any jury who willfully convicted you are criminals, you don't have to obey the judges instructions it is not law.

    I'd definitely say these actors in this (government officials) created a victim, had mens rea (evil mind, intent), and actus reus ( they acted upon that intent).
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  2. #2
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    An anecdote does not establish the norm.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

    <o>

  3. #3
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    An anecdote does not establish the norm.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

    <o>
    Did you even read the article this is more than anecdotal it is factual.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Did you even read the article this is more than anecdotal it is factual.
    Locutus commented similarly to my mention of a fine and insightful op-ed and citation of a couple of thousand pages of literature. I am convinced that perhaps a half-dozen here read beyond their narrowest interests - OCDO.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  5. #5
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Locutus commented similarly to my mention of a fine and insightful op-ed and citation of a couple of thousand pages of literature. I am convinced that perhaps a half-dozen here read beyond their narrowest interests - OCDO.
    +1 And you have added to my long list of reading I must say.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  6. #6
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Or, it could be that what is posted here by members is derived from what they read elsewhere. The validity of those readings, done elsewhere, is a different issue.

    Me, I like to make things up, then post without reading what I post.....oh, and I apparently hate the "?" key. I gotta work on that.

  7. #7
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Police and prosecutors and judge exist to serve and protect the state. Going after hardened criminals is both difficult and unsafe, these people were a soft target. You don't usually become a sheriff or a judge or a prosecutor because you're a humble guy who wants to preserve freedom and help people. You do those things because you're a raving narcissist on a petty power trip.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Or, it could be that what is posted here by members is derived from what they read elsewhere..
    The contrary suggestion is laughable, that members post ANY original thought. The very best that we can hope for is a quotation without context, more usually we get some cut&paste from Little Orphan Annie's Sandy, "ARF,ARF"

    Vide supra.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 12-12-2013 at 09:32 AM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Did you even read the article this is more than anecdotal it is factual.
    Anecdotes are usually factual. That is not the point.

    The point is that a statement cannot be proven by example. An anecdote, true or false (no matter), is just an example.

    Statements can be disproven with a single counterexample. Basic logic.

  10. #10
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    Anecdotes are usually factual. That is not the point.

    The point is that a statement cannot be proven by example. An anecdote, true or false (no matter), is just an example.

    Statements can be disproven with a single counterexample. Basic logic.
    Semantics.

    Why not talk about what happened instead? I am outraged are you?
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  11. #11
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    Tales of tyranny

    I am outraged that you started this thread by bashing ALL cops based on one story. That is intellectually dishonest. Had your original premise of this thread merely been the anecdote at hand, I might have shared your outrage. But that is not what you did. So I will focus on your attempt to parlay a single story into an indictment of the entire barrel.

    One single example, no matter how stark, cannot prove a statement. The whole barrel is NOT rotten. I need provide one single example to disprove your contention that it is. Shall I? I can flood this thread with counterexamples if that is your wish.

    Or, you could knock of the generalized bashing.


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    Last edited by eye95; 12-12-2013 at 10:11 AM.

  12. #12
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    I am outraged that you started this thread by bashing ALL cops based on one story. That is intellectually dishonest. Had your original premise of this thread merely been the anecdote at hand, I might have shared your outrage. But that is not what you did. So I will focus on your attempt to parlay a single story into an indictment of the entire barrel.

    One single example, no matter how stark, cannot prove a statement. The whole barrel is NOT rotten. I need provide one single example to disprove your contention that it is. Shall I? I can flood this thread with counterexamples if that is your wish.

    Or, you could knock of the generalized bashing.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.
    The system that allows this is the barrel, it isn't a blanket bashing of "all cops" quit grasping at straws.

    And I can flood this thread with examples and court decisions and actions by government peons that have destroyed our rights. The one in the OP isn't an isolated case.

    I bet loyalist had lots of examples where the Tories and the King helped colonist.

    The point is if this happened 100, 50, 25? This behavior wouldn't have been accepted it is becoming the norm.

    The colonist would tear apart the house of government officials who would act like this they would have chased them back to England and wouldn't have been nice about it. What does our society do, many rationalize these bad acts with asinine statement that they do good too.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  13. #13
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    https://www.rutherford.org/publicati...n_police_state

    FUQ
    At a time when the government routinely cites national security as the justification for its endless violations of the Constitution, the idea that a citizen can actually be “secure” or protected against such government overreach seems increasingly implausible, while suggesting that a person take steps to secure his person and property against the government could have one accused of fomenting anti-government sentiment.
    Nevertheless, the reality of our age is this: if the government chooses to crash through our doors, listen to our phone calls, read our emails and text messages, fine us for growing vegetables in our front yard, jail us for raising chickens in our backyard, forcibly take our blood and saliva, and probe our vaginas and rectums, there’s little we can do to stop them. At least, not at that particular moment. When you’re face to face with a government agent who is not only armed to the hilt and inclined to shoot first and ask questions later but also woefully ignorant of the fact that he works for you, if you value your life, you don’t talk back.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  14. #14
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    The contrary suggestion is laughable, that members post ANY original thought. The very best that we can hope for is a quotation without context, more usually we get some cut&paste from Little Orphan Annie's Sandy, "ARF,ARF"

    Vide supra.
    I do not "cut and paste".....I'm shocked that you would, maybe, infer that I do. I clearly "copy and paste" cuz the words remained on those webpages.

  15. #15
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    It is possible that all of those cops are thugs. Or, they could be doing nothing more than following orders. Their kids have got to eat too. Tyranny is from the top down. The courts don't take a cotton to cops being tyrannical, that is the realm of the prosecutors, judges, and the politicians. Judges don't like uppity cops.

  16. #16
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Following orders has a bad history, and leaves a bad taste in my mouth I will never excuse a government agent that were just following orders.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Let's make a distinction. There ain't a thing wrong with following lawful (which requires constitutionality) orders.


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    <o>

  18. #18
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    Let's make a distinction. There ain't a thing wrong with following lawful (which requires constitutionality) orders.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

    <o>
    Very good distinction.

    Now in this case, nothing was constitutional about it and yet from the deputies to the prosecutor to the Judge to an improperly informed jury, (I talked to author of this article and he alleges they were not properly informed) they colluded in this bit of tyranny.

    Notice the search warrant was granted because of the false claim they were denied access to the property. A judge could have stopped this long before it reached the point it did. No due process was served.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  19. #19
    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
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    I think that eye95 misunderstood. By saying "the whole barrel is rotten" it isn't meant, I take it, that literally every single government employee is fundamentally evil in their hearts, it means that all of the components of the justice system work together to foster corruption and, yes, tyranny. The whole barrel meaning all of those components; municipal police, sheriff's department, prosecutor's office, judges/trials, etc. The deck is stacked against those in government who are truly good. Constitutional, oath-keeping officers, police chiefs and sheriff's are prosecuted criminally for no more than simply keeping their oaths.

    People have been taught the dangerous falsity that our "great" government was designed to keep itself in check via a balance of branches. The truth is that in any system of government the only check and balance that ever ends up mattering is the willingness of the people to stand up with a rifle and say "no."
    Last edited by stealthyeliminator; 12-13-2013 at 01:05 PM.
    Advocate freedom please

  20. #20
    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Very good distinction.

    Now in this case, nothing was constitutional about it and yet from the deputies to the prosecutor to the Judge to an improperly informed jury, (I talked to author of this article and he alleges they were not properly informed) they colluded in this bit of tyranny.

    Notice the search warrant was granted because of the false claim they were denied access to the property. A judge could have stopped this long before it reached the point it did. No due process was served.
    I don't understand, isn't that basically saying that the lack of consent gives probable cause? Hasn't this notion been denied over and over and over and over in the courts?
    Advocate freedom please

  21. #21
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator View Post
    I think that eye95 misunderstood. By saying "the whole barrel is rotten" it isn't meant, I take it, that literally every single government employee is fundamentally evil in their hearts, it means that all of the components of the justice system work together to foster corruption and, yes, tyranny. The whole barrel meaning all of those components; municipal police, sheriff's department, prosecutor's office, judges/trials, etc. The deck is stacked against those in government who are truly good. Constitutional, oath-keeping officers, police chiefs and sheriff's are prosecuted criminally for no more than simply keeping their oaths.

    People have been taught the dangerous falsity that our "great" government was designed to keep itself in check via a balance of branches. The truth is that in any system of government the only check and balance that ever ends up mattering is the willingness of the people to stand up with a rifle and say "no."
    +1 I think Eye got it though because he did offer an insightful post a few posts later.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  22. #22
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator View Post
    I don't understand, isn't that basically saying that the lack of consent gives probable cause? Hasn't this notion been denied over and over and over and over in the courts?
    Yea I don't get that either, and then on top of it the government never even asked to come on so there wasn't even the chance to give a lack of consent. They just raided with no due process. When you carry a hammer everything is a nail.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    The only victims in this nightmare are the family that had to endure this unconstitutional treatment..
    The gentleman served 180 days in jail for the crime of WHAT?---- This jail time to me falls under the category's of (1) False arrest, (2) Willful and Malicious prosecution (3) wrongful imprisonment and (4) kidnapping..

    Clearly this man and his wife should seek an attorney that specialized in USC 42 section 1983 litigation..

    The prosecutor, the sheriff and the Judge, violated the gentleman rights to his land and his property..

    The couple should seek an attorney that has a proven tract record in US Constitutional and the deprivation of your constitutional rights, by three people 'acting under the gist of government authority.

    Good Bless, and I pray the corrupt judge, and prosecutor and the dumb ass sheriff get to sleep in the horrible cell together.. Tyrants all three.

    Liberty and justice will prevail.

    Best regards

    CCJ
    " I detest hypocrites and their Hypocrisy" I support Liberty for each, for all, and forever".
    Ask yourself, Do you own Yourself?

  24. #24
    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    This is becoming more and more the norm.....this is why I say the whole barrel is rotten......the local cops, prosecutor and judge all colluded in this disgusting display of tyranny.

    Really makes me mad because this very close to me both in location and because I work in the building industry and have seen property rights destroyed in this state.

    [COLOR=#444444][FONT=Arial]FUQ

    http://myfreedomfoundation.com/blog/...-the-san-juans

    Sheriff Rob Nou, Prosecutor Randy Gaylord and judge Stewart Andrew, you are the reasons why I despise the state, I have ran into your types you are the criminals. Any deputies that partook in this you are just as liable. Any jury who willfully convicted you are criminals, you don't have to obey the judges instructions it is not law.

    I'd definitely say these actors in this (government officials) created a victim, had mens rea (evil mind, intent), and actus reus ( they acted upon that intent).
    Does anyone know the building code or the charges they brought against them? It says the was jailed because the building code is criminal? And 18 months for building code violations? What are they leaving out?

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  25. #25
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Does anyone know the building code or the charges they brought against them? It says the was jailed because the building code is criminal? And 18 months for building code violations? What are they leaving out?

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    Building codes are not criminal. That's one of the major problems I have with this being in the building industry. In fact there is wide discretion in this state on what local planning commissions enforce or don't.

    18 months makes something a felony, this is what boggles me too, because even building a house without permits doesn't lead to this and they appear to have been within the agriculture rules for the out building, the other thing was for a compost toilet.

    Even if they blatantly defied building codes, I would support them, it is their property. They were raided without due process. The San Juans used to be a place for rugged individuals to be well individuals. Sadly it has been took over by watermelons and collectivist.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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