Tales of tyranny

sudden valley gunner · Dec 14, 2013

Primus said:
Your just proving my point. Maybe we aren't on the same coin. Your coin is full of hate and suspicion and distrust.

Only one of us is on here posting entire threads dedicated to cases of the other doing bad things.

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Your point is that I am hateful, suspicious and full of distrust, or that I am hateful suspicions and distrustful of the government?

Yes I have the ability to post "entire threads".

Besides being an arbitrary vague statement not really truthful, who is the one justifying the bad actions?

eye95 · Dec 14, 2013

Primus said:
Again the punjshment for the law is bogus I agree for the 110th time. That doesn't equal tyranny.

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I agree that the word "tyranny" is used WAY too much around here. However, using the law the way they have here, including the implied sentence that has NOT been suspended that denies the man his RKBA, is an excessive control on the People by the government and is, therefore, somewhat tyrannical in nature.

Primus · Dec 14, 2013

eye95 said:
I agree that the word "tyranny" is used WAY too much around here. However, using the law the way they have here, including the implied sentence that has NOT been suspended that denies the man his RKBA, is an excessive control on the People by the government and is, therefore, somewhat tyrannical in nature.

Good point eye.

I would agree eye if I knew that was the intent of the law or the .gov. I believe to be tyrannical you need the intent. Otherwise its just incompetence or something to that effect. If the prosecutor judge etc. All colluded or even the legislation even wrote this law to solely get at his gun rights and to control him then I could get behind the tyranny bit. Without that intent and collusion.... I just don't see it.

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countryclubjoe · Dec 14, 2013

The property owner build a building on his property... The local G wanted him to acquire certifications, and permits, and get a license to build, the locate G wanted to impose fines, and fees on the law abiding property owner for non compliance.. "Non Compliance" is clearly a term invented by tyrants, oh excuse me we use the term tyrant to much on this board. Let me change that to " Thieves" and strong arming comes to mind.
Thieves abusing their power. End of story.

My .02

CCJ

sudden valley gunner · Dec 15, 2013

They convicted someone of a crime and there was no victim, no mens rea and no actus reus.

The "justice" system colluded in a crime in convicting someone they made a victim, had mens rea and actus reus.

The friends of San Juan (a watermelon group) has been influencing and electing these public officials.

eye95 · Dec 15, 2013

Just to be clear: Not everyone at OCDO (I would hazard to say not even a majority) believes that every crime has to have a bleeding corpse or missing property. Some of us here actually agree that local and State governments are well within their authorities, as ceded by the People (and, no, not every one of them alive today) to pass laws to make the communities functional.

I am not saying that there was no injustice in this case. I just don't want visitors to think that this site is solely populated with anarcho-libertarians. Some of us do think that some government is necessary.

I happen to believe that the best way to protect Liberty is to allow governments that are close to the People to be as tyrannical as the People make it. If you don't like your local or State government, use that right to travel and vote with your feet. If most people did this, Liberty would flourish. The little tyrannies would collapse, and communities and States with reasonable (including "victimless") laws would prosper and grow.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 15, 2013

To be clear this isn't a thread of anarchy or libertarianism.

This is a thread about the growing abuse of government whether you think government is necessary or not.

eye95 · Dec 15, 2013

sudden valley gunner said:
To be clear this isn't a thread of anarchy or libertarianism...

I didn't say that it was. However, the constant repetition of the idea that crimes require a bleeding corpse or missing property is definitely anarcho-libertarian and is often spouted as though it were a universally accepted truth at OCDO. It is not.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 15, 2013

eye95 said:
I didn't say that it was. However, the constant repetition of the idea that crimes require a bleeding corpse or missing property is definitely anarcho-libertarian and is often spouted as though it were a universally accepted truth at OCDO. It is not.

Interesting I didn't even mention corpus delicti.

By our common law legal founding, for a crime to be a crime you must have 3 elements I mentioned.

This is not anarcho-libertarian this is ancient English tradition one our founders had adopted, but of course the founders were more anarcho-libertarian minded then the top down style of government in place today.

It is also a property rights issue. It is also a due process issue. A definite collusion occurs when a warrant is issued under the pretext of non consent. It is also an issue of prosecutor and cops and judges working together instead of being a check and balance on each other, etc.

eye95 · Dec 15, 2013

sudden valley gunner said:
Interesting I didn't even mention corpus delicti...

No, you didn't. I was translating the seeming need for a "victim" to claim a crime.

BTW, (I am going to be a bit pedantic here) do you know what a "corpus delicti" is? It ain't the dead body! Although the dead body is often a huge part of it.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 15, 2013

eye95 said:
No, you didn't. I was translating the seeming need for a "victim" to claim a crime.

BTW, (I am going to be a bit pedantic here) do you know what a "corpus delicti" is? It ain't the dead body! Although the dead body is often a huge part of it.

Yep I do, but your comment made me think of it, I meant nothing more than that.

By English common law, a victim is need for their to be a crime, and the other elements too.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 15, 2013

Even some judges are recognizing what is becoming the norm....http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/11/blistering-9th-circuit-di_n_4426802.html

"I wish I could say that the prosecutor’s unprofessionalism here is the exception, that his propensity for shortcuts and indifference to his ethical and legal responsibilities is a rare blemish and source of embarrassment to an otherwise diligent and scrupulous corps of attorneys staffing prosecutors’ offices around the country. But it wouldn’t be true. Bradyviolations have reached epidemic proportions in recent years, and the federal and state reporters bear testament to this unsettling trend."

Judge Kozinski, Chief Judge of the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, dissenting opinion in United States v. Olsen

Also from Kozinski...

"Protecting the constitutional rights of the accused was just not very high on this prosecutor's list of priorities. The fact that a constitutional mandate elicits less diligence from a government lawyer than one's daily errands signifies a systemic problem: Some prosecutors don't care about Brady because courts don't makethem care."

sudden valley gunner · Dec 15, 2013

Nightmare said:
It is informative that we are lectured on corpus delecti but nearly never on mens rea or actus reus and their required coincidence.

+1

OC for ME · Dec 16, 2013

Caesar's tax collector is a powerful man with Caesar's Legion available and waiting to collect Caesar's tribute.

Be happy, citizen of Rome, that you keep your life.....at Caesar's pleasure of course.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 16, 2013

OC for ME said:
Caesar's tax collector is a powerful man with Caesar's Legion available and waiting to collect Caesar's tribute.

Be happy, citizen of Rome, that you keep your life.....at Caesar's pleasure of course.

+1

eye95 · Dec 16, 2013

sudden valley gunner said:
+1

There was no lecture. Oddly, the most pedantic poster on OCDO, whose goal with every post is clearly to impress, not to communicate, called a single humorous sentence a "lecture."

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<o>

stealthyeliminator · Dec 16, 2013

eye95 said:
there was no lecture. Oddly, the most pedantic poster on ocdo, whose goal with every post is clearly to impress, not to communicate, called a single humorous sentence a "lecture."

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<o>

qft

sudden valley gunner · Dec 16, 2013

eye95 said:
There was no lecture. Oddly, the most pedantic poster on OCDO, whose goal with every post is clearly to impress, not to communicate, called a single humorous sentence a "lecture."

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<o>

Had to see what +1 you were referring too.

When I read the post I didn't interpret it as a lecture from you just about being lectured in general.

eye95 · Dec 16, 2013

sudden valley gunner said:
Had to see what +1 you were referring too.

When I read the post I didn't interpret it as a lecture from you just about being lectured in general.

And you are not the lecturer. The person you +1'ed is. Look over his posts. He tries to impress, not to communicate.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 16, 2013

eye95 said:
And you are not the lecturer. The person you +1'ed is. Look over his posts. He tries to impress, not to communicate.

Oh well I +1 his post on how we are lectured more about one thing than the more proper founding of common law.....that's all I meant by it. Wasn't meaning to get into the middle of any spat.

Tales of tyranny

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