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Thread: specific question about the barbers

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    specific question about the barbers

    If I am open carrying. And I go to get a haircut and they wrap one of those smock things around me. Is that still legal?

    oregon law makes no mention of "visibility" of the weapon.

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    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter bigtoe416's Avatar
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    Technically you'd be on private property and an agent of the property owner would be covering your firearm, so you're probably okay.

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    Regular Member dakatak87's Avatar
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    I went to a barber shop a month ago in Tacoma area while OC. The employees at the shop didn't say anything about my sidearm. I didn't even think about being "concealed" once they put the smock on me. This does bring an issue if the cops were called by someone. And of course you would not hang your holster with your coat by the door.

    I just realized that you are on private property so them "concealing" your firearm while performing their job should not be an issue. The most they can do is ask you to leave before they sit you in the chair.
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    This is a cutting edge legal question....

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    Quote Originally Posted by catastrophic_success View Post
    If I am open carrying. And I go to get a haircut and they wrap one of those smock things around me. Is that still legal?

    oregon law makes no mention of "visibility" of the weapon.

    Which law says you can carry concealed in oregon on private property with no license? I read 166.250 a million and one times. But I may have missed it

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    Quote Originally Posted by catastrophic_success View Post
    Which law says you can carry concealed in oregon on private property with no license? I read 166.250 a million and one times. But I may have missed it
    I agree.

    One thing I've come to be a little careful about is gray areas.

    A poster above said the private property owner was doing the covering, thus it should be OK.

    The smart-alecky response would be, "I hope the judge decides the same way."

    Unless statute or case law clearly protects it, you can bet at least one cop somewhere will write the citation or make the arrest. Then a fella has to go to court, maybe get an attorney, the expense, the time, etc., etc., etc.

    And, if as Catastrophic suggests by his question, there is no exemption for CCing on private property with that property owner's permission, then really it would be an offense. I'm sure a prosecutor or judge who wanted to make an example of gunner would have little trouble setting aside as irrelevant any argument about the property owner having given permission.

    Just read the law. All I'm allowed to say is "follow the law."
    Last edited by Citizen; 12-17-2013 at 12:10 AM.
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    I would think this applies:
    (3) Firearms carried openly in belt holsters are not concealed within the meaning of this section.

    An observer sitting on the other side of the room may not be able to see it, but it is openly carried in your belt holster. I don't think I've ever had a barber put a drape on me that covered any significant portion of my side so I just don't see that as concealment and wouldn't loose any sleep over it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveM View Post
    I would think this applies:
    (3) Firearms carried openly in belt holsters are not concealed within the meaning of this section.

    An observer sitting on the other side of the room may not be able to see it, but it is openly carried in your belt holster. I don't think I've ever had a barber put a drape on me that covered any significant portion of my side so I just don't see that as concealment and wouldn't loose any sleep over it.
    I've determined that it would be a violation of the law.

    1) the only provision states that the owners, or someone who in part owns a business may keep a concealed weapon at the place of business.

    2) Think about it this way. If I wore one of the smocks to the store I would be carrying a concealed weapon ( it covers the entire weapon and all of your torso, down to below your waist ) And legally there is no difference between me sitting in their chair with a smock on, and walking down the road with a smock on in terms of handgun laws.

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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by catastrophic_success View Post
    I've determined that it would be a violation of the law.

    1) the only provision states that the owners, or someone who in part owns a business may keep a concealed weapon at the place of business.

    2) Think about it this way. If I wore one of the smocks to the store I would be carrying a concealed weapon ( it covers the entire weapon and all of your torso, down to below your waist ) And legally there is no difference between me sitting in their chair with a smock on, and walking down the road with a smock on in terms of handgun laws.
    I would just tuck the smock behind my sidearm and avoid the concealment and maintain oc status problem solved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by catastrophic_success View Post
    If I am open carrying. And I go to get a haircut and they wrap one of those smock things around me. Is that still legal?

    oregon law makes no mention of "visibility" of the weapon.
    Do you have a CPL? Since I need one for in the car carry (WA) I always have a CPL. That way I'm "covered" either way.
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    Quote Originally Posted by catastrophic_success View Post
    2) Think about it this way. If I wore one of the smocks to the store I would be carrying a concealed weapon ( it covers the entire weapon and all of your torso, down to below your waist ) And legally there is no difference between me sitting in their chair with a smock on, and walking down the road with a smock on in terms of handgun laws.
    What ever you do, don't enter a bathroom stall, store fitting room, phone booth, or photo booth while open carrying. When I slide into a both at a restaurant no one can see that I am carrying, is it now concealed? I guess what I'm saying is that simply not being able to see the firearm from certain vantage points doesn't meet the legal definition of "concealed", how far away from us must the obscuring object(s) be before it is no longer concealment?

    The best solution is to get rid of these unconstitutional laws so that we can get on with our lives and worry about important stuff.

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    Regular Member XD40sc's Avatar
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    I'm not going near the OC vs. CC debate.

    Just get a damn permit and don't worry about such nonsense, as you will be covered (nor will it matter if your gun is covered) What do OC'ers (without a concealed permit) do in bad weather anyway, put your raincoat or winter coat behind the butt of your gun?
    Last edited by XD40sc; 01-05-2014 at 12:12 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by XD40sc View Post
    I'm not going near the OC vs. CC debate.

    Just get a damn permit and don't worry about such nonsense, as you will be covered (nor will it matter if your gun is covered) What do OC'ers (without a concealed permit) do in bad weather anyway, put your raincoat or winter coat behind the butt of your gun?
    Excellent advice. Even if a person is a staunch OC’er, having the CC license could mitigate some of those possible “gotcha” circumstances that life presents us at times. Having the CC license provides for some convenient carry options. Some people don’t mind becoming the “test case” but not everybody is willing to go that distance. The most important part is being able to maintain personal security capability. IMHO.
    I carry a gun because I can't carry a cop.

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    Quote Originally Posted by XD40sc View Post
    I'm not going near the OC vs. CC debate.

    Just get a damn permit and don't worry about such nonsense, as you will be covered (nor will it matter if your gun is covered) What do OC'ers (without a concealed permit) do in bad weather anyway, put your raincoat or winter coat behind the butt of your gun?
    So I mostly CC I wear tshirts and don't tuck them in. I find OC with only a tshirt a pita but if wearing a coat it is much better to tuck it behind the butt of my pistol. Really I don't want a heavy zipped up coat getting between me and my gun.

    I'll see if I can post pics to show everyone what I am talking about.

  15. #15
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    Concealed under a tshirt.



    If I OC with the IWB the shirt bunches up around my gun


    In this one my shirt is trapped between my gun and thumb


    Not a problem when wearing a coat.


    With a Serpa rig the shirt bunches to and makes drawing difficult.


    Much better with a coat (sorry this one is blurry)


    Now my favorite OC the crossdraw. The butt leans away from the body a bit. (Thinking about trying some spacers with the serpa to get the same effect.





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    Wow those pictures really suck. I just looked at them on my computer and they hurt my eyes!

    Oh well you get the idea.

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