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Thread: HBs I-591 & I-594 Judiciary Hearing Jan 28th 130pm (Olympia)

  1. #1
    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    HBs I-591 & I-594 Judiciary Hearing Jan 28th 130pm (Olympia)

    Washington State listen up.....

    There is an upcoming hearing in Judiciary on Jan. 28th at 1:30 p.m. regarding House Bills I-594(anti) & I-591(pro). We need your support by either testifying on behalf of gun rights/2nd amendment or just being physically there. Please come to Olympia as we need as many people there as possible.

    Concealed Carry & Open Carry is allowed on the Washington State capitol grounds. See you there !

  2. #2
    Regular Member jsanchez's Avatar
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    I hope our speakers do their homework. You know law enforcement is going to be their talking their garbage.

    I hope someone asks the question why now, why do we need background checks now, and what is the evidence to support this.

    Show the committee that Chicago, New York, and California have background checks, and it doesn't stop crime.

    And what about straw purchaser's?

    I hope Dave Workman and our leaders have their ducks in a row.

    And get their early to sign up to speak.

    Last time they only took 5 people from each side, assault weapon ban time.

    We should post our statements here, so we can all fine tune them, and make them short and to the point, because they will probably only give you a minute or two.

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    Regular Member Whitney's Avatar
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    Please read

    Please take some time to read through the documents. Ask lots of questions, folks here are VERY knowlegable.
    If you are a collector pay particular attention to to wording; collectors will have to get background checks.

    Public Hearing:
    1. HI 591 - Protect our gun rights. (If measure is referred to committee.)
    2. HI 594 - Gun sales background check. (If measure is referred to committee.)
    3. HB 1561 - Concerning short-barreled rifles.


    In the event you can not attend you can make comments from the initiative / bill page. Look for the "comment on this initiative" link near the top.

    ~Whitney


    The problem with America is stupidity.
    I'm not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

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    Activist Member golddigger14s's Avatar
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    How about we meet up prior to the hearing to compare notes? There is a Subway nearby: 1023 Capitol Way S, about 12:00 pm?
    "The beauty of the Second Amenment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." Thomas Jefferson
    "Evil often triumphs, but never conquers." Joseph Roux
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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    HBs I-591 & I-594 Judiciary Hearing Jan 28th 130pm (Olympia)

    GOAL Post 2014-3





    Legislative Update from Olympia 23 January 2014





    PUBLIC HEARINGS ON INITIATIVES



    I-594 CERTIFIED BY SOS; I-591 NEXT



    FIREARMS ON THE CAPITOL CAMPUS



    FORMAT CHANGE



    NEW BILL(S) FILED



    ADDITIONAL PUBLIC HEARING(S) SCHEDULED



    OPPOSE HB 2459/SB 6039





    Public hearings will be conducted on Initiatives 591 (pro-gun) and 594 (anti-gun) on 28 January (House Judiciary) and 29 January (Senate Law & Justice). It is critical that as many individuals turn out as possible to attend BOTH of these hearings. A strong turnout sends a strong signal to both the legislature and to the media present of the support for, or opposition to, each of the initiatives. Signs and posters are not allowed inside the buildings, but we will be distributing "Guns Save Lives" stickers to participants. Parking in the vicinity of the Campus is tight, and Olympia loves to give tickets for illegal parking, so car pools are strongly encouraged. http://www.leg.wa.gov/legislature/Pages/Parking.aspx



    The House Judiciary Committee will conduct it's hearing on both initiatives at 1:30 p.m. on Tuesday, in House Hearing Room "A" in the John L. Obrien (House) Office Building. The Senate Law & Justice Committee will hear both initiatives at 1:30 p.m. on Wednesday in Senate Hearing Room "1" in the John A. Cherberg Senate Office Building. Sign-up sheets will likely be posted outside the hearing rooms. Please come early and sign in FOR I-591 and AGAINST I-594.



    (And just before I sent this, House Judiciary chair Rep. Laurie Jinkins (D-27) announced she would also hear HB 1561 -- legalizing short-barreled rifles under state law -- in conjunction with her hearing on the initiatives Tuesday afternoon.)



    The Secretary of State announced on Wednesday that the count of signatures for I-=594 was completed, and the initiative has sufficient signatures to move forward. The count on I-591 is underway as you read this.



    And here is where I alienate some of you on the list. Carry is legal on the Capitol Campus. But both committee chairs have asked that no one OPEN carry in deference to the victims the other side is expected to bring in. I know, and for the most part agree with, the arguments for open carry. But occasionally discretion is the better part of valor. This is NOT the time to push the issue. In fact, the most likely reaction to such activity is a change in the law banning ALL firearms on the Campus. That does no one any good. Please be discrete.



    I've merged the "Bill Status" and "GOAL Position" segments to make for easier linking of the two. The GOAL position on a given bill will appear immediately below the bill information.



    One new firearm-related bill was filed this week. SB 6245, by Sen. Brian Dansel (R-7) makes technical fixes to the existing law requiring surrender of a CPL held by anyone convicted of certain offenses.



    A public hearing will be conducted on SB 6199, a bill restricting the use of incendiary or tracer ammunition and incendiary devices.



    I have taken a position to oppose HB 2459 and SB 6039, bills dealing with hunter education training. I support the intent of hunter education training. I was first certified by the State of California as a Hunter Safety instructor in 1973. Hunter education training was developed by the NRA in the 1930s. Hunter Ed instruction is currently conducted by volunteer instructors. But this bill allows the Department of Fish and Wildlife to set a registration fee "of not more than $20" to take the course. Revenues collected shall be used to reimburse volunteer instructors for out-of-pocket expenses and other purposes. I oppose the bills as written because I believe $20 is too high and will evolve into a cash cow for DFW. Instructors deserve to be reimbursed, but a $20 fee for the course may act as a bar to certifying young hunters.





    BILL STATUS/GOAL POSITION:



    The following 28 bills filed in 2013 remain under consideration in the 2014 session:

    Bill # Subject Sponsor Status

    HB 1096 Juvi illegal firearm possession Hurst (D-31) H. Jud

    CONCERNS

    HB 1147 1st degree juvi unlawful possess. Goodman (D-45) H. Jud

    CONCERNS

    HB 1184 Range protection Takko (D-19) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 1318 CPL renewal notice Taylor (R-15) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 1371 WA Firearms Freedom Act Taylor (R-15) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 1561 Short barreled rifles Blake (D-19) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    SHB 1588 Background checks Pedersen (D-43) H. Jud

    OPPOSE

    HB 1676 Mandatory safe storage Kagi (D-32) H. Jud

    OPPOSE

    HB 1703 Gun "safety" training and tax Jinkins (D-27) H. Jud

    OPPOSE

    HB 1729 Street gangs Warnick (R-13) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 1788 Firearms/school employees Pike (R-18) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    SHB 1839 Background checks Goodman (D-45) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 1840 Firearms/restraining orders Goodman (D-45)H. Rules

    OPPOSE

    HB 1908 Firearms on school property Scott (R-39) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 2020 Firearms-related jobs Shea (R-4)H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 2164 Juvenile firearm possession Orwall (D-33) H. Jud

    EVALUATING

    HB 2324 Use of force Shea (R-4) H, Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 2459 Hunter safety Blake (D-19) H. Ag/NatRes

    OPPOSE AS WRITTEN

    HB 2475 Short barreled rifles/shotguns Overstreet (R-42) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 2502 Delivery to peace officers Klippert (R-8) H. Jud

    SUPPORT

    HB 2529 Sales tax exemption on firearms Overstreet (R-42) H. Finance

    SUPPORT



    SB 5376 Juvi illegal firearm possession Kline (D-37) S. W&M

    CONCERNS

    SSB 5452 Stalking protection orders Conway (D-29)S. Rules

    CONCERNS

    SB 5478 Firearms/mental health court Keiser (D-33)S. L&J

    CONCERNS

    SB 5479 Safekeeping of firearms Keiser (D-33) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5485 Mandatory safe storage Kline (D-37) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5604 NRA license plates Hatfield (D-19) S. Trans

    NEUTRAL

    SB 5625 Background checks Kline (D-37) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5635 Restoration of firearm rights Darneille (D-27) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5660 Firearm safety education Chase (D-32) S. K-12

    SUPPORT

    SB 5710 Mandatory safe storage Kohl-Welles (D-46) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5711 Background checks Kline (D-37) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5737 Ban on sale of "assault weapons" Murray (D-43)S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5739 Ban on guns in parks Murray (D-43) S. L&J

    OPPOSE

    SB 5831 Prohibits double tax on clay pigeonsty6 Rivers (R-18)S. Rules

    SUPPORT

    SB 5956 Short-barreled rifles Hatfield (D-19)S. L&J

    SUPPORT

    SB 6025 Use of body armor O’Ban (R-28) S. L&J

    NEUTRAL

    SB 6039 Hunter safety Pearson (R-39) S. NatRes

    OPPOSE AS WRITTEN

    SB 6066 Restoration of rights Honeyford (R-15) S. L&J

    SUPPORT

    SB 6198 Range protection Roach (R-31) S. L&J

    SUPPORT

    SB 6199 Wildfires/incendiary devices Braun (R-20) S. NatRes

    EVALUATING

    SB 6245 Surrender of CPL Dansel (R-7) S. L&J

    EVALUATING



    Key to abbreviations: S. = Senate, H. = House, Ag/NatRes = Agriculture/Natural Resources, Fin = Finance, Jud = Judiciary, K-12 = Education, L&J = Law & Justice, NatRes = Natural Resources & Parks, Trans = Transportation, W&M = Ways and Means





    HEARING(S) SCHEDULED:



    28 January I-591/594 House Judiciary Committee

    1:30 p.m. House Hearing Room "A" John L. O'Brien Bldg (JLOB)



    28 January SB 6199 Senate Natural Resources & Parks Committee

    1:30 p.m. Senate Hearing Room "1" John A. Cherberg Bldg (JAC)



    29 January I-591/594 Senate Law & Justice Committee

    1:30 p.m. Senate Hearing Room "1" John A. Cherberg Bldg (JAC)





    LEGISLATIVE HOT LINE: You may reach your Representatives and Senator by calling the Legislative Hotline at 1-800-562-6000. Toll free!!! The hearing impaired may obtain TDD access at 1-800-635-9993. Also toll free!!!



    1-800-562-6000 TDD 1-800-635-9993





    OTHER DATA: Copies of pending legislation (bills), legislative schedules and other information are available on the legislature's web site at "www.leg.wa.gov". Bills are available in Acrobat (.pdf) format. You may download a free version of Adobe Acrobat Reader from Adobe's web site (http://www.adobe.com). You may also obtain hard copy bills, initiatives, etc, in the mail from the Legislative Bill Room FREE OF CHARGE by calling 1-360-786-7573. Copies of bills may also be ordered toll free by calling the Legislative Hotline at (800) 562-6000. You may also hear floor and committee hearing action live at http://www.tvw.org/ (you need "RealAudio" to do this, available free at the TVW web site).



    By reading the House and Senate "bill reports" (hbr, sbr) for each bill, you can see how individual committee members voted. By reading the "roll call" for each bill, you can see how the entire House or Senate voted on any bill. The beauty of the web site is that ALL this information is available, on line, to any citizen.





    GET THE WORD OUT: If you want to subscribe to the GOAL Post by e-mail, send a message to "jwaldron@halcyon.com" or to "goalwa@cox.net.". Please pass GOAL Post on to anyone you believe may have an interest in protecting our rights. Better yet, make a couple of copies of this message, post it on your gun club’s bulletin board, and leave copies with your local gun shop(s). PERMISSION IS HEREBY GRANTED TO DUPLICATE OR REDISTRIBUTE GOAL POST PROVIDED IT IS REPRODUCED IN ITS ENTIRETY WITHOUT TEXTUAL MODIFICATION AND CREDIT IS GIVEN TO GOAL. I can be reached at "jwaldron@halcyon.com" or by telephone at (425) 985-4867. Unfortunately, I am unable to mail hard copy GOAL Post to individuals. Limited numbers of hard copies MAY be available at the Second Amendment Foundation book table at WAC gun shows.





    Upcoming WAC gun show(s):



    Monroe 15-16 February

    Puyallup 22-23 February





    "The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men."



    Article 1, Section 24

    Constitution of the State of Washington





    Copyright 2014 Gun Owners Action League of WA

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    My personal commentary: Heller held that government buildings are presumptively sensitive places. If the Legislature bans all carry even without using metal detectors, the courts will in about a 90 percent likelihood uphold a legislative ban.

    If you open carry into the legislature, you will be solely responsible for our unnecessary disarmament in the Capitol. You were warned.
    Last edited by Gray Peterson; 01-24-2014 at 01:54 PM.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Alpine's Avatar
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    So the way we protect open carry at the capitol is by not open carrying at the capitol?

    How long do we need to avoid open carrying at the capitol to save open carrying at the capitol? A year? Two? A decade? A century?

    I'm also curious as to what was meant by the "FIREARMS ON THE CAPITOL CAMPUS" item. There was no bill referenced. Is there some legislation submitted for this? We're in a very short session right now...
    Last edited by Alpine; 01-24-2014 at 02:34 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpine View Post
    So the way we protect open carry at the capitol is by not open carrying at the capitol?

    How long do we need to avoid open carrying at the capitol to save open carrying at the capitol? A year? Two? A decade? A century?

    I'm also curious as to what was meant by the "FIREARMS ON THE CAPITOL CAMPUS" item. There was no bill referenced. Is there some legislation submitted for this? We're in a very short session right now...

    Alpine;

    Please don't be a putz on this issue. A lot of money, time and energy have been spent trying to get an initiative on the ballot that will respond to, and perhaps provide a rational alternative to I-594, and it will be in OUR best interests (your, mine and everyone who carries a firearm openly or concealed) to honor GOAL's request.

    Here's what a guy said on Seattle Guns and it gets right to the point:

    THIS! Remember that if you do go, you're representing all of us who can't be there. PLEASE set a good example for the rest of us. If not...you will be drug over the coals, tarred and feathered and publicly humiliated here on the boards. Good luck.


    I've said this many times; If you want to make a political statement, rent a billboard.

  8. #8
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    If I may also add since the end point of my previous post seems to have been ignored: the courts will most likely view carrying of a firearm on the Capitol campus as a politically granted privilege rather than any sort of constitutional right. See United States v. Masciandaro.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Alpine's Avatar
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    Dave, I understand the point and I will take it to heart, but what I don't get is how it is very unique. If they are going to ban it, they are probably going to ban it. Several legislators are already sounding off about it. For instance, this legislator here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GGkuONM7eY



    I guess I shouldn't have been such a smart ass about it, my apologies. Hopefully this anti-gun hysteria will blow over after a while. I will be there to testify both days in dress shirt, slacks and tie.

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    Typical. Held on a weekday in the middle of the day. The 9-5ers never get to put their words in. Well, give them "hell" for me.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Whitney's Avatar
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    Comments on 594

    I cannot comit to a week day but want to provide some comments in the event others want to email, write, or coment from the legislature page. Attached is a detailed summary of how I read the proposal. Hopefully it will help others get started.

    ~Whitney
    The problem with America is stupidity.
    I'm not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

  12. #12
    Regular Member jsanchez's Avatar
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    Grey Peterson said, "And here is where I alienate some of you on the list. Carry is legal on the Capitol Campus. But both committee chairs have asked that no one OPEN carry in deference to the victims the other side is expected to bring in."



    I'm not going because I'm working graveyard, and I sleep during the day.

    Forget the victims, and forget the committee chairs, look at all the people that are not victims because of our gun laws and open carry.

    Washington state is one of the safest states in the nation because of OUR GUN LAWS,

    And now your just going to forget the last 120 years of state history and let them turn this state into California.

    All of a sudden open carry is the ugly step child in the room. Really.
    Last edited by jsanchez; 01-25-2014 at 12:59 PM.

  13. #13
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    If I go I will OC.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  14. #14
    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    If I go I will OC.
    While I agree that exercising a right should never be grounds to lose it, there is such a thing as tact. Causing people who are psychologically traumatized more trauma is unlikely to result in anything you would like.

  15. #15
    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    While I agree that exercising a right should never be grounds to lose it, there is such a thing as tact.
    Causing people who are psychologically traumatized more trauma is unlikely to result in anything you would like.
    This is "psychologically traumatizing" me to read this.

    I work hard to NORMALIZE the daily open carry of well holstered firearms. I understand you all think you are walking on eggshells to OC on Tues/Wed and we should hide our weapons to not scare the victims. Don't do this now so we can do it later is absurd. Discretion is getting us pushed into a closet. Eventually it will get worse and worse and they will take them away to make "us all safer".

    I understand your point/fears, and I wll not OC on campus, but I, for one, do not agree.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

  16. #16
    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    Nuff Said.....

    OpenCarry.org
    “A Right Unexercised is a Right Lost”

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    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    While I agree that exercising a right should never be grounds to lose it, there is such a thing as tact. Causing people who are psychologically traumatized more trauma is unlikely to result in anything you would like.
    The victims should either seek counseling to get over their trauma, or they should not participate in venues that are emotionally disturbing to them.

    They are volunteering to be political pawns. They should be able to live with the personal consequences.

    Shame on the committee chairs who are using people as chess pieces.

  18. #18
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    While I agree that exercising a right should never be grounds to lose it, there is such a thing as tact. Causing people who are psychologically traumatized more trauma is unlikely to result in anything you would like.

    Tact my ass!
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  19. #19
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Starks View Post
    Nuff Said.....

    OpenCarry.org
    “A Right Unexercised is a Right Lost”
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave_pro2a View Post
    The victims should either seek counseling to get over their trauma, or they should not participate in venues that are emotionally disturbing to them.

    They are volunteering to be political pawns. They should be able to live with the personal consequences.

    Shame on the committee chairs who are using people as chess pieces.
    +1 And they are letting themselves be used too, fake pain and trauma by the sight of a gun....give me a break.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  20. #20
    Activist Member golddigger14s's Avatar
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    Someones irrational fear of an inanimate object is best left to the licensed psychologists that can give them proper counseling.
    "The beauty of the Second Amenment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." Thomas Jefferson
    "Evil often triumphs, but never conquers." Joseph Roux
    http://nwfood.shelfreliance.com

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    So, you want to "normalize" OC?
    Wearing shoes is "normal".

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Peterson View Post
    [...] both committee chairs have asked that no one OPEN carry [...]

    So if you ask me to take off my shoes in your house, and I tell you to "%$#@& shove it", will you welcome me in again?

    Just sayin'...

    OK

  22. #22
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O_Kellogg View Post
    So, you want to "normalize" OC?
    Wearing shoes is "normal".




    So if you ask me to take off my shoes in your house, and I tell you to "%$#@& shove it", will you welcome me in again?

    Just sayin'...

    OK
    Don't quite get what you are saying can you clarify?

    Wearing shoes into someones private house doesn't equate to a public building.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Don't quite get what you are saying can you clarify?

    Wearing shoes into someones private house doesn't equate to a public building.
    Just thinkin' that the Chairs (hosts) have made a request. A person's choice to honor or deny that request is a direct reflection of a person's manners. Contrary to popular belief, manners matter.

    Maybe we'll get better results with a muzzle sweeping LGOC, but I doubt it.

    OK

  24. #24
    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O_Kellogg View Post
    Just thinkin' that the Chairs (hosts) have made a request. A person's choice to honor or deny that request is a direct reflection of a person's manners. Contrary to popular belief, manners matter.

    Maybe we'll get better results with a muzzle sweeping LGOC, but I doubt it.

    OK
    Actually, they are in OUR house -- NOT theirs.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave_pro2a View Post
    Actually, they are in OUR house -- NOT theirs.
    Right. Now, relax Dave. Think for a minute. Imma kick dirt clods on YOUR carpet...

    Or, since we're room-mates we can work with each other, respectfully...

    I believe an armed society can be a polite society. Stop trying to prove me wrong.


    OK

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