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Grand Rapids Tool

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bigt8261

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2013
Messages
181
Location
Grand Rapids
He really hates me and apparently he didn't like my seminar a few weekends back.

My message is one of education and understanding. Mayor Heartwell's message is one of fear and bigotry. You tell me where the righteousness lies.
 
Raggs

Raggs

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2012
Messages
1,181
Location
Wild Wild West Michigan
bigt8261 said:
He really hates me and apparently he didn't like my seminar a few weekends back.

My message is one of education and understanding. Mayor Heartwell's message is one of fear and bigotry. You tell me where the righteousness lies.
Click to expand...

We should see what it would take to have a seminar in the Grand Rapids Main Library
 
DrTodd

DrTodd

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
3,272
Location
Hudsonville , Michigan, USA
bigt8261 said:
He really hates me and apparently he didn't like my seminar a few weekends back.

My message is one of education and understanding. Mayor Heartwell's message is one of fear and bigotry. You tell me where the righteousness lies.
Click to expand...

Heartwell isn't basing his message on logical thought, rather he bases it on his "feelings". I am not trying to be derogatory but every time I hear him speak I get the feeling he believes that he is a Kindergarten teacher talking to a bunch of five-year-olds... which to me makes him seem somewhat limited cognitively. Like I said, I'm not questioning his intelligence, rather that he has chosen to live life based on his feelings. This may be appropriate for a Kindergarten teacher, maybe even desirable. But as a Mayor leading a major metropolitan area, it is definitely not who I would choose as a leader.

bigt8261, he only feels you are dangerous because you carry a gun... but in the same breath has no fear of the police officer who is armed in the same room. Yet, statistically the officer has a much greater chance to actually use the firearm in way that is dangerous to Mr Heartwell. But, like I said, logic is trumped by his "feelings".

In Heartwell's world, I would guess that a person carrying a gun in some type of a uniform is "OK", but someone carrying a holstered pistol, but not wearing a uniform, is on that fact alone, dangerous. I guess he has forgotten how well the assumption that Uniform = "good guy" worked for the victims of Anders Breivik. Once again, the mayor lets his "feelings" trump whatever logical thought you would ever be able to bring up. Sigh.
 
X

xmanhockey7

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
1,195
DrTodd said:
Heartwell isn't basing his message on logical thought, rather he bases it on his "feelings". I am not trying to be derogatory but every time I hear him speak I get the feeling he believes that he is a Kindergarten teacher talking to a bunch of five-year-olds... which to me makes him seem somewhat limited cognitively. Like I said, I'm not questioning his intelligence, rather that he has chosen to live life based on his feelings. This may be appropriate for a Kindergarten teacher, maybe even desirable. But as a Mayor leading a major metropolitan area, it is definitely not who I would choose as a leader.

bigt8261, he only feels you are dangerous because you carry a gun... but in the same breath has no fear of the police officer who is armed in the same room. Yet, statistically the officer has a much greater chance to actually use the firearm in way that is dangerous to Mr Heartwell. But, like I said, logic is trumped by his "feelings".

In Heartwell's world, I would guess that a person carrying a gun in some type of a uniform is "OK", but someone carrying a holstered pistol, but not wearing a uniform, is on that fact alone, dangerous. I guess he has forgotten how well the assumption that Uniform = "good guy" worked for the victims of Anders Breivik. Once again, the mayor lets his "feelings" trump whatever logical thought you would ever be able to bring up. Sigh.
Click to expand...

Well said my friend.
 
B

bigt8261

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2013
Messages
181
Location
Grand Rapids
I took the time to attend last night's Commission meeting and respond to the Mayor.

Gun advocate responds to Mayor Heartwell, says message spreads 'confusion, fear and bigotry'

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2014/01/gun_advocate_responds_to_mayor.html

"My message is and has been one of education and understanding. Your message is and has been a message of confusion, fear and bigotry. I want more people to know the laws and understand them, where you want others to be confused about our laws and afraid of people such as me without first attempting to understand us. You tell me who the bully is there and where the righteousness lies."
 
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X

xmanhockey7

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
1,195
bigt8261 said:
I took the time to attend last night's Commission meeting and respond to the Mayor.

Gun advocate responds to Mayor Heartwell, says message spreads 'confusion, fear and bigotry'

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2014/01/gun_advocate_responds_to_mayor.html

"My message is and has been one of education and understanding. Your message is and has been a message of confusion, fear and bigotry. I want more people to know the laws and understand them, where you want others to be confused about our laws and afraid of people such as me without first attempting to understand us. You tell me who the bully is there and where the righteousness lies."
Click to expand...

To you as well Tom, well said. Glad we have someone as articulate and intelligent as you in GR. Keep up the good work.
 
DrTodd

DrTodd

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
3,272
Location
Hudsonville , Michigan, USA
DanM said:
Excellent response, Tom. Thanks for your efforts!
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Tom, thank you for all that you have done, and continue to do, in the service of liberty.

Mr Heartwell chooses to become incoherently upset at the sight of mere citizens being able to protect themselves instead of handing off that "detestable task" to others. Although I do believe that his statements are truly indicative of his feelings, he does not understand that his emotion gets in the way of reason. To him we are a stereotype; he refuses to see you, me, and every other gun carrier as an individual. To him, gun carriers are heartless savages, in essence, evil. That you may seem to be anything other than HIS stereotype of a "typical gun" owner doesn't really equate, and so he blocks you out. When confronted by a reasonable gun owner, he flees and advocates that others do the same. Differences of opinion are fine, but his utter refusal to to reason, is very disturbing. The human ability for compassion is one of mankind's noble attributes, and he certainly has compassion for those that have been injured or killed through the misuse of firearms. However, letting his feelings run without being checked by intellect is the type of behavior that is more indicative of a criminal than a responsible member of society. To condemn the presence of firearms just because he has abdicated his ability to defend himself is to live a lie. To deny people the right to defend themselves with the most effective means available is to be blinded by misguided compassion. There is nothing in his words but raw emotion. He believes that his feelings are how "sophisticated" people feel, or are supposed to. According to the popular media, you should be uttering nonsensical grunts between his erudite speeches.

Yet, he is the irrational one who prefers to place his feelings as the guidepost for public policy. Accepting that he is responsible for his own safety may be something he is faced with someday. Accepting the responsibility that comes with the carrying a firearm is a lot of responsibility to bear, but not accepting that those deemed society's protectors aren't able to be everywhere is certainly not pleasant. Not accepting the facts, however, only throws him into simple, unchecked emotion.
 
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ghostrider

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
1,416
Location
Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA
DrTodd said:
Tom, thank you for all that you have done, and continue to do, in the service of liberty.

Mr Heartwell chooses to become incoherently upset at the sight of mere citizens being able to protect themselves instead of handing off that "detestable task" to others. Although I do believe that his statements are truly indicative of his feelings, he does not understand that his emotion gets in the way of reason. To him we are a stereotype; he refuses to see you, me, and every other gun carrier as an individual. To him, gun carriers are heartless savages, in essence, evil. That you may seem to be anything other than HIS stereotype of a "typical gun" owner doesn't really equate, and so he blocks you out. When confronted by a reasonable gun owner, he flees and advocates that others do the same. Differences of opinion are fine, but his utter refusal to to reason, is very disturbing. The human ability for compassion is one of mankind's noble attributes, and he certainly has compassion for those that have been injured or killed through the misuse of firearms. However, letting his feelings run without being checked by intellect is the type of behavior that is more indicative of a criminal than a responsible member of society. To condemn the presence of firearms just because he has abdicated his ability to defend himself is to live a lie. To deny people the right to defend themselves with the most effective means available is to be blinded by misguided compassion. There is nothing in his words but raw emotion. He believes that his feelings are how "sophisticated" people feel, or are supposed to. According to the popular media, you should be uttering nonsensical grunts between his erudite speeches.

Yet, he is the irrational one who prefers to place his feelings as the guidepost for public policy. Accepting that he is responsible for his own safety may be something he is faced with someday. Accepting the responsibility that comes with the carrying a firearm is a lot of responsibility to bear, but not accepting that those deemed society's protectors aren't able to be everywhere is certainly not pleasant. Not accepting the facts, however, only throws him into simple, unchecked emotion.
Click to expand...

Do you really think the Mayor feels that way? I think some people know better, but say such things just to further their agenda. I think it"s possible he knows better, but values the effectiveness of fomenting fear among the general citizenry. Fear can represent more consolidated power to him.
 
Ezerharden

Ezerharden

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2011
Messages
723
Location
Erie, MI
ghostrider said:
Do you really think the Mayor feels that way? I think some people know better, but say such things just to further their agenda. I think it"s possible he knows better, but values the effectiveness of fomenting fear among the general citizenry. Fear can represent more consolidated power to him.
Click to expand...

I tend to agree, it is mostly done to suit his agenda.
 
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