• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Open carrier stopped in Dayton

Grapeshot

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
commonsense1776 said:
Adam Lanza walking down the street. Bad stop? Ignore him? How are the police officers to know? Jeez...
Click to expand...

BB62 said:
Before anyone wastes their time and brain cells responding to the troll, I urge you to read this:
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/s...-Carry-Today&p=2016210&viewfull=1#post2016210
Click to expand...

commonsense1776 said:
I'm sorry but I'm not buying this whole open carry thing. In my opinion, people with openly displayed weapons are not there to assert their rights. They are there to feel important and intimidate others. And that, in turn, is going to provide anti-firearm critics, and those who may be on the fence, with more evidence that additional regulation is needed.
Click to expand...

Is there a provocateur pattern here?
 
Fallschirjmäger

Fallschirjmäger

Active member
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
3,823
Location
Cumming, Georgia, USA
color of law said:
This is a good case to read. (Even though I have some issues with the case)
{¶14} The Ohio Supreme Court has held that a police officer's statement “Hey, come here a minute,” while nominally couched in the form of a demand, is actually a request that a citizen is free to regard or to disregard.
Click to expand...
In other words, you voluntarily talk to police, it's at your own risk.
State v. Boswell, 2014-Ohio-886
http://www.supremecourt.ohio.gov/rod/docs/pdf/5/2014/2014-ohio-886.pdf
Click to expand...
It is indeed an Excellent case to read. There is also a court case (I cannot lay my hands upon, but I'm sure it's been mentioned here) where the court ruled, saying essentially that, "Hey You! Get off that porch and come here, I want to talk to you, NOW!" even in a "police voice" is merely a polite entreaty on the behalf of Officer Friendly that may be casually disregarded.
So if a commanding "Come here!" is only a polite request, how is Joe Citizen supposed to know when he's been given a command and not merely a request?
 
Last edited:
W

Werz

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2012
Messages
301
Location
Northeast Ohio
OC for ME

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
Fallschirmjäger said:
You mean, "Would that it were so simple" don't you, OC?

oscargamble.jpg
Click to expand...
Yepper, that be what I mean.
 
OC for ME

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
The bottom line, if a "you come here" is a request that can be ignored.....ignore it, the "request." No big deal, right. Now, will the cop accept being ignored. I mean, I can ignore anyone can I not?
 
color of law

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,950
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
OC for ME said:
The bottom line, if a "you come here" is a request that can be ignored.....ignore it, the "request." No big deal, right. Now, will the cop accept being ignored. I mean, I can ignore anyone can I not?
Click to expand...
Look, from a little tyke you are trained or, better yet, brained washed into believing that you are to obey every command thrown at you; answer every question asked of you. And DO NOT question authority.

When you become an adult no one tells you that is not true. Even in high school government class, studying the constitution, it does not dawn on you that you have rights.

Then one day Morpheus appears and offers you a choice between a red pill or blue pill. That's when you discovered the tangled web that was woven to deceive you and control you.

I have been following a local case where the court has refused to read a Pro Se his rights. Below is just a sample of the court interaction. The judge at this guys third appearance still would not read him his rights per criminal rule 5 until he procured an attorney. Below is part of his second appearance.

THE COURT: Mr. XXXXXX, were you in court on this before on the 23rd of September before a magistrate?
THE DEFENDANT: Yes, I was.
THE COURT: All right. And then that's the time when you entered a plea of not guilty.
THE DEFENDANT: No, I did not enter a plea of not guilty.
THE COURT: Well, a plea of not guilty was entered for you.
THE DEFENDANT: Over my objection because I did not get to see the complaint. This is the first time I have seen this complaint. And the rules are very clear. As you well know, I have a right to see the complaint, and I was denied the right to see that complaint.
THE COURT : All right. Have you seen the complaint today?
THE DEFENDANT: Yes. And I still don't know what my rights are. I haven't even had my rights read to me.
THE COURT: Well, let's do this. I'm going to overrule your motion to dismiss, enter a plea of not guilty. We'll set this for a trial or pretrial. Did you want to consult with a lawyer?
THE DEFENDANT: Your Honor, I have to object. I still haven't been read my rights. What are my rights?
THE COURT: This is not the occasion for that, Mr. XXXXXX. All right?
THE DEFENDANT: You mean I'm not entitled to have my rights read to me?
THE COURT: Mr. XXXXXX, I want you to consult with an attorney. All right?
THE DEFENDANT: Well, I object for the record.
THE COURT: Okay. we'll note the objection.
Click to expand...

The worse part is the court is to be a bulwark between the state and the defendant. Instead the court is assisting the prosecution.
 
MyWifeSaidYes

MyWifeSaidYes

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2009
Messages
1,028
Location
Logan, OH
Fallschirmjäger said:
It is indeed an Excellent case to read. There is also a court case (I cannot lay my hands upon, but I'm sure it's been mentioned here) where the court ruled, saying essentially that, "Hey You! Get off that porch and come here, I want to talk to you, NOW!" even in a "police voice" is merely a polite entreaty on the behalf of Officer Friendly that may be casually disregarded.
So if a commanding "Come here!" is only a polite request, how is Joe Citizen supposed to know when he's been given a command and not merely a request?
Click to expand...


"Am I free to go?"
 
Last edited by a moderator:
J

JediSkipdogg

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2012
Messages
139
Location
Batavia
Nightmare said:
Aren't there legal limits on arguably inappropriate uses of the 911 system, on non-emergency calls?
Click to expand...

Yes, but those are rarely prosecuted because who defines what an emergency is? Is a MWAG in your front yard that you don't know an emergency or not? How about a car that you've never seen before parked in front of you house for 2 hours? How about 24 hours? How about unmoved for 100 hours?

About the only misuse of 911 calls that are prosecuted are blatant misuse where police fully investigate something and tell the person to not call again on that event or someone reporting a totally false call that doesn't exist. A good example of the first one is my department charged someone about 3 years ago for saying his wife needed medical help. His wife refused a squad or treatment yet he kept calling. He was subsequently charged for the calls because his wife stated she needed no help every time we responded in that day.
 
color of law

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,950
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
BB62 said:
The Beavercreek video (and an odd bald-headed guy) made it to the Columbus, Ohio TV (channel 10) airwaves: http://www.10tv.com/content/sections/vi ... ExoBUYvF3l
Click to expand...
And that surprises you?????

The police need to educate the public that the carrying a gun in of it self is not a crime. Just like driving your car down the street in a non-reckless manner, you don't call the cops.
 
MyWifeSaidYes

MyWifeSaidYes

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2009
Messages
1,028
Location
Logan, OH
And if they DO decide to "check you out", it should be a polite, consensual encounter. If there is no RAS of wrongdoing and the OC'er declines to ID themselves, that should be the end of the encounter.

And I'm not bald, dammit!

:rolleyes:


The newest class at the Lorain County Community College police academy is getting mis-information from their teacher:

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/03/robert-farago/omg-open-carry-omg-2/
 
W

Werz

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2012
Messages
301
Location
Northeast Ohio
2OLD2W8

2OLD2W8

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2011
Messages
138
Location
Black Waters
Werz said:
Misinformation?

Reasonable suspicion of felon in possession of a firearm? I agree. Misinformation

Reasonable suspicion of unsupervised juvenile in possession of a firearm? Maybe not misinformation.
Click to expand...

Reasonable suspicion of unsupervised juvenile in possession of a firearm? Might be a case bigoted eyesight.
 
MyWifeSaidYes

MyWifeSaidYes

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2009
Messages
1,028
Location
Logan, OH
The Lorain open carrier is 24, and I believe both people involved in the Riverside 'payday' stop are in their 20's.

A person may start driving at age 16 in Ohio.

How many 16 and 17-year-olds are stopped JUST for 'looking too young'?

How many 18 to 20-year-olds are stopped JUST for 'looking too young'?

Serious questions.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top