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RANT: Idiots in my engineering class.... don't know SH!T about guns.

Freedom1Man

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One lady is building some sort of head protector/binder for children. It was talked about making it into a "bullet proof" shield, because of "ALL THE SCHOOL SHOOTINGS."

I said "What school shootings? Those are VERY rare, so rare why worry about them? Arm the teachers if there is a worry..."

Another person said, "Earthquakes are rare."

I said, "Earthquakes happen all the time!"

Another guy piped up and said that, "I know you don't watch TV but there is another school shooting every 2 weeks."

-----
Issues:

1. Has there been a rash of school shootings that have gone unreported or something? When I tried to look into I could not find anywhere near 1 every month much less 1 ever 2 weeks. Did I miss something?

2. How is a "bullet proof" shield going to help a 75# child? Assuming that the attacker did use an AR15 with a FV (just before impact) of 2500fts and a bullet weight of 55 grains the foot pounds of force would be 763.2ftpds. If a child got hit by that, even without penetration, would that not knock them off their feet? Would that not disable them?

Please, share your thoughts, I am missing something or are my classmates idiots when it comes to guns?
 

davidmcbeth

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Relax .. its just stupid comments .. engineers are supposed to make things ... cannot tell you how many products I have been a part of a team where one pushing it pushes it for goofy reasons.

Who cares ... make it bulletproof ... what else ya gonna do in the class? You may learn something.

I've invented hundreds of products .. some I thought were great sold zero...some I thought were good sold 1/4 billion dollars worth ...and some I thought were eh also sold for gobs of $$.

You can never tell for sure what the market will react to ...
 
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HPmatt

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Doesn't sound like a upper division engineering class. Wouldn't be EEs - all they know is math. PEs and CEs would know about fracking and earthquakes. MEs would know about mass x velocity and psi. Engineering science or something - would have women in it?

Back to point 1 - the look to your left and then to your right - each of them w/b gone when you graduate. Dummies will peel off by the time you get to upper division.
 
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Rusty Young Man

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SNIP...I've invented hundreds of products .. some I thought were great sold zero...some I thought were good sold 1/4 billion dollars worth ...and some I thought were eh also sold for gobs of $$.

You can never tell for sure what the market will react to ...

You forgot to put in smileys or the like to make it obvious that you're joking.


To the OP:Ask them to calculate the force a bullet (even one from a handgun, such as a 9mm from any LEA-issue) hits a child with. Ask them what that kind of force would do to the child (same reason you can get a concussion even while wearing a helmet).

Also, bring up the cost of materials and the projected final cost of the product, as well as the average salary of the parents of these children.
Case in point: there's a reason everyone isn't wearing Kevlar body armor.
 

davidmcbeth

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Not joking ... make it "bullet proof" and test it .. the OP may learn how to make a bullet proof helmet ... surely a worthwhile skill to learn.

If the OP wants to be a scientist ... one cannot let political opinions or morals guide everything that they work on.
 
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Rusty Young Man

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Doesn't sound like a upper division engineering class. Wouldn't be EEs - all they know is math. PEs and CEs would know about fracking and earthquakes. MEs would know about mass x velocity and psi. Engineering science or something - would have women in it?

Back to point 1 - the look to your left and then to your right - each of them w/b gone when you graduate. Dummies will peel off by the time you get to upper division.

Engineers can do math. That's about the only generalization I will apply to them anymore.

However, I'm not sure that math relates very well to the understanding of firearms and their use.
If scientists, who are trained to see each and every occurrence under similar conditions as an isolated incident that supports a TREND somehow come out in support of gun confiscation (or whatever the antis are trying to disguise it as today), I don't think a higher IQ necessarily equates to more common sense, or in this case, I don't think higher level means "more logical".
 
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Freedom1Man

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Not joking ... make it "bullet proof" and test it .. the OP may learn how to make a bullet proof helmet ... surely a worthwhile skill to learn.

If the OP wants to be a scientist ... one cannot let political opinions or morals guide everything that they work on.

I have my AAS in Machining, I was "burning" my GI bill by taking the Engineering mechanical graphics design side also. I want to have a better understanding of what the "guys" who create the blueprints are thinking. But, if this is any sign of who will be creating blueprints, I am worried.
 

OC for ME

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One lady is building some sort of head protector/binder for children. It was talked about making it into a "bullet proof" shield, because of "ALL THE SCHOOL SHOOTINGS."

I said "What school shootings? Those are VERY rare, so rare why worry about them? Arm the teachers if there is a worry..."

Another person said, "Earthquakes are rare."

I said, "Earthquakes happen all the time!"

Another guy piped up and said that, "I know you don't watch TV but there is another school shooting every 2 weeks."
<snip>
Wasn't there a kid last week who pretended to shoot a kid in school? He got suspended for three days. If you count those, I guess kids are dropping like flies every week.

The "Another guy" needs to watch less TV it seems, or at least stop watching MSNBC/CNN/ABC/CBS/NBC. Stop reading The Huffing And Puffington Post. Stop listening to NCPR (National Communist Party Radio).

I think you should recommend some light reading for him, the US Constitution is pretty easy to read and don't take too long neither.
 

Primus

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http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States

This says 17 "school shootings" just last month.

This site does include any shootings on school ground or busses on school grounds. So no, they aren't all "mass" shootings.

There's is most certainly a rise in the number of shootings at school. I don't know how much of a rise or the reason for said rise, but there is an increase.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk
 

davidmcbeth

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http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States

This says 17 "school shootings" just last month.

This site does include any shootings on school ground or busses on school grounds. So no, they aren't all "mass" shootings.

There's is most certainly a rise in the number of shootings at school. I don't know how much of a rise or the reason for said rise, but there is an increase.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk

Really, I would not count college shootings within the definition of "school"....most are on college campuses ... maybe lends credence to allowing college students to OC.
 

Primus

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Really, I would not count college shootings within the definition of "school"....most are on college campuses ... maybe lends credence to allowing college students to OC.

Its still a place of education. Whether the students are 60 or 6.. the intent is the same.

Agreed, at the very least would be a good reason to allow students/teachers to carry. Maybe.

My only issue is now you introduce kids with handguns into college campus. Kids tens to do very stupid things on campus. Something in the air I think.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk
 

davidmcbeth

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Its still a place of education. Whether the students are 60 or 6.. the intent is the same.

Agreed, at the very least would be a good reason to allow students/teachers to carry. Maybe.

My only issue is now you introduce kids with handguns into college campus. Kids tens to do very stupid things on campus. Something in the air I think.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk

But, for the vast majority, they are adults, not minors.

No one says my kid goes to Harvard school .... they say University....

So putting the definition of "school" to include colleges and universities wherein most people think of elementary and HS students being in "schools" just adds to the # of shootings being considered as "school shootings".

What about people in trade schools? Are they in "school"?

Certainly in people's minds, a 5 yr old being killed that has no chance of defending themselves is different than a 35 yr old college student.
 

Primus

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But, for the vast majority, they are adults, not minors.

No one says my kid goes to Harvard school .... they say University....

So putting the definition of "school" to include colleges and universities wherein most people think of elementary and HS students being in "schools" just adds to the # of shootings being considered as "school shootings".

What about people in trade schools? Are they in "school"?

Certainly in people's minds, a 5 yr old being killed that has no chance of defending themselves is different than a 35 yr old college student.

Agreed, a 5 year old and a 35 year old are definitely different.

But I think even the fact of shootings on universities has increased. It was never the in thing to go shoot ANY place up. Now its malls and schools/universities.

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Maverick9

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Rather than employing engineers to make 'armor' look at the big picture.

Target denial:
Reinforce entry denial into schools by unauthorized people;
Create a number of 'safe rooms' or perhaps a safe closet inside of classrooms
Allow kids to carry locator chips and/or cell phones that can dial 911 and the school office
Have affordable resistant items, backpacks, briefcases, coats with bullet resistant features. These could be distributed in classrooms with teacher access to armor up the students in the event of an incursion and inability to get into the safe rooms.

Use features already in existence. Guarded access into parking lots, better use of locked access and lockdown capability.

Kids are not going to wear helmets, so don't waste time building things they won't use.
 
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carolina guy

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Perhaps you should "suggest" to them to build a "bullet proof shield" to cover the entire school. Something along the lines of a Star Trek shield. That will keep the kiddies "safe" from any attack. ;) After all, its just a class and who says that what ever is being designed has to pass real world muster and management?
 

carolina guy

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http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States

This says 17 "school shootings" just last month.

This site does include any shootings on school ground or busses on school grounds. So no, they aren't all "mass" shootings.

There's is most certainly a rise in the number of shootings at school. I don't know how much of a rise or the reason for said rise, but there is an increase.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk


Since the list includes self inflicted wounds, ones that happen before/after classes, and also includes people that are not even students it is only useful in documenting crime that happens "very" close to a school. Meh.
 
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MSG Laigaie

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Rather than employing engineers to make 'armor' look at the big picture.

Target denial:
.

I am an Engineer. At my last Command, I worked with about two hundred very good Engineers. Never tell an Engineer what to do, for they will do that thing. Challenge them with an objective. "Protect the People in the school from an active shooter". Let them run with that and you may get better results. Deny the Shooter.
 

carolina guy

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Rather than employing engineers to make 'armor' look at the big picture.

Target denial:
Reinforce entry denial into schools by unauthorized people;
Create a number of 'safe rooms' or perhaps a safe closet inside of classrooms
Allow kids to carry locator chips and/or cell phones that can dial 911 and the school office
Have affordable resistant items, backpacks, briefcases, coats with bullet resistant features. These could be distributed in classrooms with teacher access to armor up the students in the event of an incursion and inability to get into the safe rooms.

Use features already in existence. Guarded access into parking lots, better use of locked access and lockdown capability.

Kids are not going to wear helmets, so don't waste time building things they won't use.

...or....just arm the staff. (we do, but we homeschool). ;)
 

carolina guy

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But, for the vast majority, they are adults, not minors.

No one says my kid goes to Harvard school .... they say University....

So putting the definition of "school" to include colleges and universities wherein most people think of elementary and HS students being in "schools" just adds to the # of shootings being considered as "school shootings".

What about people in trade schools? Are they in "school"?

Certainly in people's minds, a 5 yr old being killed that has no chance of defending themselves is different than a 35 yr old college student.


Don't forget all the "students of life" out there...don't they matter? ;)
 

davidmcbeth

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I am an Engineer. At my last Command, I worked with about two hundred very good Engineers. Never tell an Engineer what to do, for they will do that thing. Challenge them with an objective. "Protect the People in the school from an active shooter". Let them run with that and you may get better results. Deny the Shooter.

I've been told by groups of PhD's scientists:"we tried that before several times-its not possible" --- months later US/Foreign patents with my name on 'em ooooo-yeah.
 
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