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Thread: CSPOA Sheriff: Feds strategize for 'raid' on ranch. Warning follows threat from Reid.

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    CSPOA Sheriff: Feds strategize for 'raid' on ranch. Warning follows threat from Reid.

    "The executive director of the Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association says his sources inside the federal government warn that Washington’s weekend retreat in a dispute over grazing land in Nevada was only a move to distract attention and diffuse tensions, because a raid on the family’s ranch still is planned. And there probably would be violence involved, said Richard Mack, the former sheriff of Graham County, Ariz."

    http://www.wnd.com/2014/04/sheriff-f...raid-on-ranch/
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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    "The executive director of the Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association says his sources inside the federal government warn that Washington’s weekend retreat in a dispute over grazing land in Nevada was only a move to distract attention and diffuse tensions, because a raid on the family’s ranch still is planned. And there probably would be violence involved, said Richard Mack, the former sheriff of Graham County, Ariz."

    http://www.wnd.com/2014/04/sheriff-f...raid-on-ranch/
    Is this the same guy that said the protestors were going to line up the women and children in the front so if there was blood shed they would get shot first? It was player on fox news several times. Didn't catch his name but I remember they said he was former sheriff of some place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Is this the same guy that said the protestors were going to line up the women and children in the front so if there was blood shed they would get shot first? It was player on fox news several times. Didn't catch his name but I remember they said he was former sheriff of some place.
    you just watched a short clip taken out of context because you are a cop. (I actually don't believe you are a cop)

    wouldn't expect anything else from you.


    how does it feel to see cops run away with their tails between their legs ?

    cops aren't so tough when they have to meet resistance huh ?

    cops aren't so tough when they don't have a 15-1 ratio huh ?

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onus View Post
    you just watched a short clip taken out of context because you are a cop. (I actually don't believe you are a cop)

    wouldn't expect anything else from you.


    how does it feel to see cops run away with their tails between their legs ?

    cops aren't so tough when they have to meet resistance huh ?

    cops aren't so tough when they don't have a 15-1 ratio huh ?
    Actually it was on Fox News several times. Take it up with them if it was "out of context". Not really sure how you can say "we were stratigizing to put women and children in front in case there was a rogue officer who took a shot" out of context.

    But please feel free to post the whole video and clear it up for us.



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    Former sheriff willing to let wife, daughters die on front lines of Bundy ranch

    "Former Arizona sheriff Richard Mack says he and other organizers at Cliven Bundy’s ranch in Nevada were contemplating using women and children as human shields in case “rogue federal officers” opened fire. Appearing on Fox News’ “The Real Story” on Monday, former Sheriff Richard Mack said he and other protesters “were actually strategizing to put all the women up at the front. If they are going to start shooting, it’s going to be women that are going to be televised all across the world getting shot by these rogue federal officers.”

    Mr. Mack told radio host Ben Swann on Monday that he believes women should be “the first ones shot” in order to send the most effective message. “I would have put my own wife or daughters there, and I would have been screaming bloody murder to watch them die,” he said. “I would’ve gone next, I would have been the next one to be killed. I’m not afraid to die here. I’m willing to die here.”

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ter-die-front/

    VIDEO - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZd61_9hofE

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    Last edited by Nightmare; 04-15-2014 at 02:02 PM.

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    "Former Arizona sheriff Richard Mack says he and other organizers at Cliven Bundy’s ranch in Nevada were contemplating using women and children as human shields in case “rogue federal officers” opened fire. Appearing on Fox News’ “The Real Story” on Monday, former Sheriff Richard Mack said he and other protesters “were actually strategizing to put all the women up at the front. If they are going to start shooting, it’s going to be women that are going to be televised all across the world getting shot by these rogue federal officers.”

    Mr. Mack told radio host Ben Swann on Monday that he believes women should be “the first ones shot” in order to send the most effective message. “I would have put my own wife or daughters there, and I would have been screaming bloody murder to watch them die,” he said. “I would’ve gone next, I would have been the next one to be killed. I’m not afraid to die here. I’m willing to die here.”

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ter-die-front/

    VIDEO - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZd61_9hofE

    Understand self-immolation as the Buddhist monks taught.
    Wtf. This is worse then the clip I saw.

    Where's the outcry from his fellow patriots? Is that how we won independence? By putting women and children first to get shot?

    Wait.... hiding behind women and children while they get killed.... trying to make a big political statement.... doing it for propaganda on TV...... where have I seen this tactic before? Rings a bell for **** AQI does.

    Real american heroes right here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Wtf. This is worse then the clip I saw.

    Where's the outcry from his fellow patriots? Is that how we won independence? By putting women and children first to get shot?

    Wait.... hiding behind women and children while they get killed.... trying to make a big political statement.... doing it for propaganda on TV...... where have I seen this tactic before? Rings a bell for **** AQI does.

    Real american heroes right here.

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    It is called Guerrilla or unconventional warfare. Men have been expendable in society for century's. Can you imagine how many less wars we would have had if those flag draped coffins coming back from overseas contained female remains? You do not have to acknowledge the truth, it is still true!

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DON`T TREAD ON ME View Post
    It is called Guerrilla or unconventional warfare. Men have been expendable in society for century's. Can you imagine how many less wars we would have had if those flag draped coffins coming back from overseas contained female remains? You do not have to acknowledge the truth, it is still true!
    Oh so you agree then? Think thats the way it should be done? Just like up the women and children and let them have it?

    ******* pathetic.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Most of the women I saw there were openly carrying and WANTED to be there.

    I think Mack epicly misspoke in his attempt to show what was kinda already happening just because we have a lot of women and families on our side as it is.

    Personally, I don't deserve to be shot any more than a woman or child. The point is that federal agents had damn well better be careful...
    Last edited by MAC702; 04-15-2014 at 09:03 PM.
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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    Most of the women I saw there were openly carrying and WANTED to be there.

    I think Mack epicly misspoke in his attempt to show what was kinda already happening just because we have a lot of women and families on our side as it is.

    Personally, I don't deserve to be shot any more than a woman or child. The point is that federal agents had damn well better be careful...
    Mac we aren't talking about equal sex stuff here. If a woman wants to defend herself and hers then that's good on her. If she wants to go show support and defend her rights and beliefs then that's awesome.

    This dude wasn't talking about that and he didn't misspeak. He was clear and apparently talked about it for a while. They were planning on putting women and children in front as a friggin shield. Hoping either a "rogue" officer either wouldnt take a shot or worse if they did at least they could put a good media spin on it. That's bull shite.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Wtf. This is worse then the clip I saw.

    Where's the outcry from his fellow patriots? Is that how we won independence? By putting women and children first to get shot?

    Wait.... hiding behind women and children while they get killed.... trying to make a big political statement.... doing it for propaganda on TV...... where have I seen this tactic before? Rings a bell for **** AQI does.

    Real american heroes right here.

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    I am personally outraged by such a suggestion. If I were in the presence of the man when a suggestion like that came out of his mouth, I'd have a mind to slap him right across the face and exclaim, "how ******* dare you?!?" I tell you the truth.

    I think it's ridiculous. I also think that the idea is probably, for the most part, only his. I doubt there was a significant number of people who thought for more than a second it was in any way, shape, form or fashion a reasonable or decent idea.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    Most of the women I saw there were openly carrying and WANTED to be there.

    I think Mack epicly misspoke in his attempt to show what was kinda already happening just because we have a lot of women and families on our side as it is.

    Personally, I don't deserve to be shot any more than a woman or child. The point is that federal agents had damn well better be careful...
    I agree that Richard Mack was probably quoted somewhat out of context, or at least only partially quoted, but Primus has a point:
    If someone is intentionally strategizing in such a way as to capitalize on a tragedy by increasing the likelihood of its occurrence, they're stooping to the level of the antis.

    Not that the death of any Freedom-loving individual isn't a tragedy already, but making a plan to essentially CREATE a slaughter of women and girls is something I'd expect only from the statists, not what I would expect from patriots I'd like to identify with.
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator View Post
    I am personally outraged by such a suggestion. If I were in the presence of the man when a suggestion like that came out of his mouth, I'd have a mind to slap him right across the face and exclaim, "how ******* dare you?!?" I tell you the truth.

    I think it's ridiculous. I also think that the idea is probably, for the most part, only his. I doubt there was a significant number of people who thought for more than a second it was in any way, shape, form or fashion a reasonable or decent idea.
    I sincerely hope so and doubt its a large number of guys who agree with him, but he made it clear 'they" were strategizing to do it. On national TV and newsprint. So where the rest of his crowd immediately stepping up and saying he doesn't represent them?

    Insane....

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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    Most of the women I saw there were openly carrying and WANTED to be there.

    I think Mack epicly misspoke in his attempt to show what was kinda already happening just because we have a lot of women and families on our side as it is.

    Personally, I don't deserve to be shot any more than a woman or child. The point is that federal agents had damn well better be careful...
    No US citizen should be murdered for simply exercising their rights. If this is some ploy by the Feds to gain...whatever...they better be damn well careful what they wish for! They may get more than they can handle. Maybe that's the point?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    I sincerely hope so and doubt its a large number of guys who agree with him, but he made it clear 'they" were strategizing to do it. On national TV and newsprint. So where the rest of his crowd immediately stepping up and saying he doesn't represent them?

    Insane....

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    Given the track record of the "mainstream" media, it wouldn't surprise me if they just went fishing for the craziest sound bite they could find, then represent the source of the soundbite as some sort of spokesman.

    Quote Originally Posted by FreeInAZ View Post
    No US citizen should be murdered for simply exercising their rights. If this is some ploy by the Feds to gain...whatever...they better be damn well careful what they wish for! They may get more than they can handle. Maybe that's the point?
    It is a show of force to "set an example" to the rest of the country. A kind of intimidation used to great effect time and time again by other empires and tyrannical governments: "this is what happens if you resist".
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    "Former Arizona sheriff Richard Mack says he and other organizers at Cliven Bundy’s ranch in Nevada were contemplating using women and children as human shields in case “rogue federal officers” opened fire. Appearing on Fox News’ “The Real Story” on Monday, former Sheriff Richard Mack said he and other protesters “were actually strategizing to put all the women up at the front. If they are going to start shooting, it’s going to be women that are going to be televised all across the world getting shot by these rogue federal officers.”

    Mr. Mack told radio host Ben Swann on Monday that he believes women should be “the first ones shot” in order to send the most effective message. “I would have put my own wife or daughters there, and I would have been screaming bloody murder to watch them die,” he said. “I would’ve gone next, I would have been the next one to be killed. I’m not afraid to die here. I’m willing to die here.”

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ter-die-front/

    VIDEO - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZd61_9hofE

    Understand self-immolation as the Buddhist monks taught.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Young Man View Post
    Given the track record of the "mainstream" media, it wouldn't surprise me if they just went fishing for the craziest sound bite they could find, then represent the source of the soundbite as some sort of spokesman.



    It is a show of force to "set an example" to the rest of the country. A kind of intimidation used to great effect time and time again by other empires and tyrannical governments: "this is what happens if you resist".
    Wasn't a "sounds bite" cherry picked. He apparently gave multiple interviews laying out their plans. Can't blame this on the media.

    What show of force? They backed down. They didn't even bring any "force" to show. And they let the cattle go.

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    Regular Member FreeInAZ's Avatar
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    Looks like all sides are playing mind games. Who ever chucks the first stone should be prepared for the avalanche that follows. We the people- out number those behind badges 1,000 to 1. So if only 5% take to arms that's 50 to 1. During the revolutionary war roughly 33% of the population fought the king's men. Let's hope cool heads prevail. But many think they can continue to shat down upon people with no worries of suffering likewise. Those days may be coming to an end?
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    To be clear, I'm not defending Mr. Mack. I've barely heard of him before this, and haven't watched or heard his clip or speech. Purposely using women and children (or men) as innocent collateral is wrong, obviously.

    Janet Reno has ordered the deaths of more women and children than TPTB would like to recall.
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    ...What show of force? They backed down. They didn't even bring any "force" to show. And they let the cattle go. ...
    Are you serious? You can justify their show of force, and rationalize the release of the cattle that didn't die in the process, but you can't pretend it didn't happen.

    Indeed, how can you "back down" if you didn't first show force?
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    Are you serious? You can justify their show of force, and rationalize the release of the cattle that didn't die in the process, but you can't pretend it didn't happen.

    Indeed, how can you "back down" if you didn't first show force?
    Not trying to pretend it didn't happen. I fully acknowledge the went and took the cattle.

    You are correct in that some physical "force" as in guys there to get the cattle and security to protect them obviously showed up. My comment was more to the fact the other poster was making it seem as if the BLM actually mustered some huge force to crush or intimidate them and said huge force backed down. That's untrue. They certainly didn't call for help from all across the country or even muster and real large force. Basically this was a one sided urinating contest.

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    Regular Member The Big Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Not trying to pretend it didn't happen. I fully acknowledge the went and took the cattle.

    You are correct in that some physical "force" as in guys there to get the cattle and security to protect them obviously showed up. My comment was more to the fact the other poster was making it seem as if the BLM actually mustered some huge force to crush or intimidate them and said huge force backed down. That's untrue. They certainly didn't call for help from all across the country or even muster and real large force. Basically this was a one sided urinating contest.

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    I think Sniper rifles trained on American Citizens exercising their right of redress to be somewhat of a show of force. It sure would have intimidated me. Automatic weapons are a show of force.
    I'm guessing that we didn't see a bigger army of jack-booted thugs because the powers that be didn't want to deal with the backlash from the killing of citizens which I believe it would have ultimately led to.

    The big question is: Why the hell does the Bureau of Land Management have sniper teams??? That alone is scary...

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    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Wasn't a "sounds bite" cherry picked. He apparently gave multiple interviews laying out their plans. Can't blame this on the media.

    What show of force? They backed down. They didn't even bring any "force" to show. And they let the cattle go.

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    I'm not referring to the cattle or the events that may have transpired that we are not privy to (if the rumors that are floating around are true, Bundy is by no means innocent of eliciting consideration from the BLM, just as the latter is not innocent of overreach and overreaction).

    I am referring to the fact that ARMED federal "employees" (or henchmen, depending on the person) were moved in with weapons.
    You and I must have a vastly different opinion of what constitutes force or a display of force then.
    Is the presence of an armed body of federal "employees" not a show of force? Is having snipers IN POSITION not a show of force?

    I'd wager at least one of those weapons was of the type reserved only for those who are more equal than others, but I digress as it may just be speculation on my part.
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    SNIP...What show of force? They backed down. They didn't even bring any "force" to show. And they let the cattle go.
    At the time they showed up, what was the ratio of Feds to protesters (Bundy and crew)? Size of force can be relative: an individual facing 15 at once may as well be facing 30 at once. In this case, the Feds FORMERLY outnumbered the resisting citizens, and I'm sure their firepower was superior as well.

    On the other point: I hope the plan was the brainchild of nothing more than this man and a small handful.
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Wasn't a "sounds bite" cherry picked. He apparently gave multiple interviews laying out their plans. Can't blame this on the media.

    What show of force? They backed down. They didn't even bring any "force" to show. And they let the cattle go.

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    B.S. There was a large show of force, their miscalculation Is not on the shoulders of the American people. So do you admit, that you value a woman's, or child's life higher than a Mans, because I think that is what you eluded to. Aren't all Americans created equal?

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