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What to say when people complain they are "uncomfortable" because of your gun?

Freedom1Man

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
4,462
Location
Greater Eastside Washington
that really worked at dissolving the marksman teams at highschools? despite the fact there wasn't an overabundance of shooting each other or others at the schools during this time?
Yes.

It worked. The majority of voting morons agreed that children cannot buy guns. Since children cannot own guns what business could they have taking them to school? Since children cannot take guns to school no one should have guns on school grounds. Since you cannot have guns on school grounds, therebis no longer any need to a marksmanship range.

Incrementally, piece by piece, slowly we are stripped of our rights due to public/media agreement that you do not need your rights anyways.

If you have nothing to hide then why do you have curtains/coverings on your windows?

Since we have a fire department, why would you need a fire extinguisher?

I was the first year of high school students who could not bring guns onto campus at all where I grew up. The last year that I was in middle school they could bring their rifles/shotguns to school so long as the guns stayed in the car/truck.

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marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
I tend to view the reduction of high-school-age shooting teams as being largely cultural. The legislative effects of gun control did succeed in moving shooting facilities off-campus, but then again the ownership of, say, swimming pools and cars is also largely restricted to adults (admittedly less by law and more by expense).

Swimming and driving are activities one must engage in off campus. But surely if the rate of high-schoolers who drive decreases, we need look no farther than a cultural shift. It seems to me that a "media/public" conspiracy as Freedom1Man describes is really nothing more than a cultural shift akin to any other except for one detail: our own dislike of it.

It seems clear to me that the 20th century marked a low point in America's cultural appreciation for its 2nd Amendment rights. Alongside this, we find a high point in legislative attempts to restrict or limit civilian ownership of guns. (It's less clear which is the cart and which is the horse in that causal relationship; did the law react to culture, or did culture react to the law?)

It also seems clear to me that Americans are, to a large degree, beginning to once again appreciate the value of the 2nd amendment in a broader content. It also seems to me that the law is -- belatedly and incompletely -- moving in the same direction.

If I'm right in concluding that the direction of causality is cultural shift --> legislative shift, then it is also likely the low point experienced in the 20th century had the same causal structure.

Of course, one benefit of open carry is to effect social change, and I really do think it has worked; it is working (idiots with long guns in Kroger or at the zoo being the exception, of course). So I think the shifts will continue. Maybe we'll see a resurgence in shooting teams.
 
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HPmatt

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
1,468
Location
Dallas
Was born and raised in Omaha - used to drag race with permission on an unused section of Offutt AFB.

To get this back on topic, when I was in school (Central HS), I frequently rode the public transportation bus home OCing my rifle team rifle - no one said a word or appeared uncomfortable. That was before dirt was invented though. :p

They had buses back then? Can't be that long ago...


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Liberty-or-Death

Regular Member
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Feb 7, 2014
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23235
(idiots with long guns in Kroger or at the zoo being the exception, of course).
IMO, those who support 2A and denigrate LG carriers as idiots are no different from antis that denigrate any carriers (except LEOs) as idiots. IMO.
 
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Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
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May 21, 2006
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Valhalla

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
IMO, those who support 2A and denigrate LG carriers as idiots are no different from antis that denigrate any carriers (except LEOs) as idiots. IMO.

What I have seen, and yes even on OCDO, is that many who claim to support 2A actually support guns, or one of their pet rights instead of all rights. IMO you can't be true 2A unless you support all of the BOR.

The second amendment is very, very, very clear it's intent, and there is just too many excuses made instead of interpreting as it was written. Open carry for self defense, IMO, is not 2A, that is 9A. OC to make people comfortable is not 2A, that is 1A. There is only one purpose for 2A, and that is a free state.
 
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color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,950
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
What I have seen, and yes even on OCDO, is that many who claim to support 2A actually support guns, or one of their pet rights instead of all rights. IMO you can't be true 2A unless you support all of the BOR.

The second amendment is very, very, very clear it's intent, and there is just too many excuses made instead of interpreting as it was written. Open carry for self defense, IMO, is not 2A, that is 9A. OC to make people comfortable is not 2A, that is 1A. There is only one purpose for 2A, and that is a free state.
And a free state is the people.
 

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
And a free state is the people.
Of course it is, but it was never intended, or stated as self defense, hunting, sport shooting. It had one purpose, and that was all that was spelled out, plain, and clear. There is absolutely NOTHING about normalization, hurt feewings, PC garbage. Granted it is in our best interest to put a good face forward, and that is the first amendment. I see nothing wrong with being polite, I do have a problem with being oppressed because of someone's feewings.
 

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,950
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Of course it is, but it was never intended, or stated as self defense, hunting, sport shooting. It had one purpose, and that was all that was spelled out, plain, and clear. There is absolutely NOTHING about normalization, hurt feewings, PC garbage. Granted it is in our best interest to put a good face forward, and that is the first amendment. I see nothing wrong with being polite, I do have a problem with being oppressed because of someone's feewings.
One of those inalienable rights.
 

stealthyeliminator

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
3,100
Location
Texas
Think it is good to consider the perceptions of the public, legislators, and press when acting out/going public.

Consider the OCDO rule #14 before you classify all in that category.
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/misc.php?do=showrules

#12 is a good one, too, and one that perhaps marshaul should take more into consideration next post.

LGOC is generally considered off topic, but I can say generally that the efforts of the larger OC organizations in Texas have had great success spreading the seed of liberty to the hearts of members of communities where events have been held. Patriots gone dormant have been reawakened, and many seeds have been planted for new patriots to grow.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
#12 is a good one, too, and one that perhaps marshaul should take more into consideration next post.

LGOC is generally considered off topic, but I can say generally that the efforts of the larger OC organizations in Texas have had great success spreading the seed of liberty to the hearts of members of communities where events have been held. Patriots gone dormant have been reawakened, and many seeds have been planted for new patriots to grow.

great success as the campaign worked so well for the Texas citizens...OC w/a privilege card so the state can maintain it's profit center...

pardon while i go hurl in the corner in a round room with your off topic comment on how well it worked...right.

remember you opened the conversation...

ipse
 

stealthyeliminator

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
3,100
Location
Texas
great success as the campaign worked so well for the Texas citizens...OC w/a privilege card so the state can maintain it's profit center...

pardon while i go hurl in the corner in a round room with your off topic comment on how well it worked...right.

remember you opened the conversation...

ipse

Sorry, all out of troll food, solus. Try not to starve, buddy, maybe I'll have something for you tomorrow.
 

nonameisgood

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
1,008
Location
Big D
#12 is a good one, too, and one that perhaps marshaul should take more into consideration next post.

LGOC is generally considered off topic, but I can say generally that the efforts of the larger OC organizations in Texas have had great success spreading the seed of liberty to the hearts of members of communities where events have been held. Patriots gone dormant have been reawakened, and many seeds have been planted for new patriots to grow.

The LGOC folks in Texas were effective in getting OC because a few folks looked at what they were doing and thought "geez, let's do OC so they'll put away the rifles." Otherwise they had no positive effect on Texas attitudes or politics. In fact, very few people even noticed or heard about those people LGOC. And LGOC had a very, very small effect on getting licensed OC here.


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stealthyeliminator

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
3,100
Location
Texas
The LGOC folks in Texas were effective in getting OC because a few folks looked at what they were doing and thought "geez, let's do OC so they'll put away the rifles." Otherwise they had no positive effect on Texas attitudes or politics. In fact, very few people even noticed or heard about those people LGOC. And LGOC had a very, very small effect on getting licensed OC here.


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Funny you should say that since I didn't even mention legislative accomplishment once in my entire post. Your post is not only false, but it's a red herring. I'm not inclined to spend any time showing you how you are incorrect since it is completely beside what I was saying.
 

Citizen

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,269
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
What I have seen, and yes even on OCDO, is that many who claim to support 2A actually support guns, or one of their pet rights instead of all rights. IMO you can't be true 2A unless you support all of the BOR.

The second amendment is very, very, very clear it's intent, and there is just too many excuses made instead of interpreting as it was written. Open carry for self defense, IMO, is not 2A, that is 9A. OC to make people comfortable is not 2A, that is 1A. There is only one purpose for 2A, and that is a free state.


I would go even further. Stealthy mentioned inalienable right. I think this is pretty close. At the foundation, I think, it is about self-ownership. Who owns your body? How much of you is owned by someone else?

If you own your body, then it follows you have a right to protect it against aggression. A criminal points a gun at you, he's saying in a sense that he owns your body and can damage it if he wants.

Separately, I would include self-defense in the 2A as the militia angle is really just a buncha self-defenders organizing themselves into a group. For example, a few thousand can each barricade himself in his home and await the invaders as they march up the road. And, get picked off individually by the invaders. Or, the self-defenders can organize themselves into squads, companies, and battalions, and meet the invaders in an organized manner. Ditto a criminal government operating to the harm or oppression of the people living under its asserted jurisdiction.

Similarly for the 1A right to petition for redress of grievances. Its really just the official version of the underlying human right to object. The former is less a separate right, than the natural extension of the latter as applied to government.
 
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marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
IMO, those who support 2A and denigrate LG carriers as idiots are no different from antis that denigrate any carriers (except LEOs) as idiots. IMO.

I can see you're a stranger to nuance. Anyway, thanks for letting me know that your opinion is worthless. I'll keep that in mind going forward.
 
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