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Thread: Pentagon to destroy 1 billion in ammunition

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    Regular Member conandan's Avatar
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    Pentagon to destroy 1 billion in ammunition

    From the marinecorpstimes.com.

    The Pentagon is going to destroy a billion dollars worth of ammo. Now they spent billions buying up all this ammo and cause shortages and high prices now they are going to throw it away. What the hell is our government doing.

    They said in the article that the branches of the military can't share info directly. But how does that translate into wasting that amount of ammo. http://www.fark.com/goto/8239655/htt...sf25544404%3D1
    Last edited by conandan; 04-28-2014 at 08:39 PM.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    No link?
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member conandan's Avatar
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    I can't get it to post a link using my phone that's why I typed the Web site. If some can tell me how to make it work I will happily put a direct link up.
    Got it a friend showed me.
    Last edited by conandan; 04-28-2014 at 08:40 PM.

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    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/arti...estroy-1B-ammo

    From the article:

    WASHINGTON — The Pentagon plans to destroy more than $1 billion worth of ammunition although some of those bullets and missiles could still be used by troops, according to the Pentagon and congressional sources.

    It's impossible to know what portion of the arsenal slated for destruction — valued at $1.2 billion by the Pentagon — remains viable because the Defense Department's inventory systems can't share data effectively, according to a Government Accountability Office report obtained by USA TODAY.

    The result: potential waste of unknown value.

    "There is a huge opportunity to save millions, if not billions of dollars if the (Pentagon) can make some common-sense improvements to how it manages ammunition," said Sen. Tom Carper, D-Del., and chairman of the Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee. "Despite years of effort, the Army, Navy and Air Force still don't have an efficient process for doing something as basic as sharing excess bullets. This Government Accountability Office (GAO) report clearly shows that our military's antiquated systems lead to millions of dollars in wasteful ammunition purchases."

    The Army and Pentagon, in a statement, acknowledged "the need to automate the process" and will make it a priority in future budgets. In all, the Pentagon manages a stockpile of conventional ammunition worth $70 billion.

    The effect of inaccurate accounting of ammunition for troops at war was outside the scope of the study. However, there were limited supplies at times of .50-caliber machine gun and 9mm handgun ammunition at the height of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, according to a senior military officer who spoke on condition of anonymity to talk about the issue.

    "We simply cannot afford this type of waste and ineffectiveness," Carper said. "The (Pentagon) has a responsibility to efficiently manage its ammunition stocks, not only because it is important to be fiscally responsible, but also because our antiquated ammunition inventory systems can shortchange our war fighters and compromise their ability to complete their mission."
    Wonder what kind of munitions we're talking about here, seeing as quality conventional rifle and pistol centerfire ammo should last decades (at least) if stored properly (even just an ammo can in a cool place).

    Don't see why the ammo can't be used as part of a citizen marksmanship program, akin to what Switzerland does. If the ammo is set to be destroyed, it may as well be used for good. This would be a great opportunity to promote REAL gun safety (education, familiarization) and REAL gun control (proper stance, good grip, smooth trigger pull, and follow-through).
    Last edited by Rusty Young Man; 04-28-2014 at 08:42 PM. Reason: Addendum
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Found it.

    The Pentagon plans to destroy more than $1 billion worth of ammunition although some of those bullets and missiles could still be used by troops, according to the Pentagon and congressional sources.

    It's impossible to know what portion of the arsenal slated for destruction — valued at $1.2 billion by the Pentagon — remains viable because the Defense Department's inventory systems can't share data effectively, according to a Government Accountability Office report obtained by USA TODAY.

    http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/arti...estroy-1B-ammo
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member cirrusly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    ...It's impossible to know what portion of the arsenal slated for destruction — valued at $1.2 billion by the Pentagon — remains viable because the Defense Department's inventory systems can't share data...
    http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/arti...estroy-1B-ammo
    Disgusting. If this isn't proof that our government is too big, I don't know what is. Simply share the ******* ammo, it's not hard. Or donate it to US troops to use at the range. $1.2 Billion pissed away. Ridiculous.
    I want to keep our founding fathers' visions and rights for this country pure. I implore you to do the same.

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    Or simply sell the excess on the civilian market.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxxon View Post
    Or simply sell the excess on the civilian market.
    Gooood luuuuck !!!
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cirrusly View Post
    Disgusting. If this isn't proof that our government is too big, I don't know what is. Simply share the ******* ammo, it's not hard. Or donate it to US troops to use at the range. $1.2 Billion pissed away. Ridiculous.
    As I understand things, the .mil does not know how old the ammo is and there are concerns that some servicemember may be exposed to some level of risk by shooting ammo that is past its "Best Used By" date.*

    stay safe.

    * - Sarcasm? You decide.
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    As I understand things, the .mil does not know how old the ammo is and there are concerns that some servicemember may be exposed to some level of risk by shooting ammo that is past its "Best Used By" date.*

    stay safe.

    * - Sarcasm? You decide.
    Even if there were some valid risk, the brass and lead have value/worth greater than landfill ballast.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member cirrusly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Even if there were some valid risk, the brass and lead have value/worth greater than landfill ballast.
    Definitely. In fact, some states permit the sale of beer or certain food and beverages beyond the "Best if used by" dates.
    I want to keep our founding fathers' visions and rights for this country pure. I implore you to do the same.

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    As I understand things, the .mil does not know how old the ammo is and there are concerns that some servicemember may be exposed to some level of risk by shooting ammo that is past its "Best Used By" date.*

    stay safe.

    * - Sarcasm? You decide.
    While I was in, Navy, and responsible to count the bullets and oil the 1911A1s, I could trace the pedigree of every small arms round back to its birth. Some .45 rounds were AARP eligible and yet still hung on the hip of a topside watch along with his similarly aged 1911A1. Some commands only knew that X number of rounds of .45 was on hand cuz that was all they had to know.

    Some commands were more diligent in maintaining their ammo records than others.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxxon View Post
    Or simply sell the excess on the civilian market.
    Might go to terrorists--all gun guys are terrorists ala Barry.

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Young Man View Post
    http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/arti...estroy-1B-ammo

    From the article:



    Wonder what kind of munitions we're talking about here, seeing as quality conventional rifle and pistol centerfire ammo should last decades (at least) if stored properly (even just an ammo can in a cool place).

    Don't see why the ammo can't be used as part of a citizen marksmanship program, akin to what Switzerland does. If the ammo is set to be destroyed, it may as well be used for good. This would be a great opportunity to promote REAL gun safety (education, familiarization) and REAL gun control (proper stance, good grip, smooth trigger pull, and follow-through).
    Good question. It does include MISSILES. So I'm sure they cost a lot.

    We seem to be forgetting that ammunition isn't just pistol/rifle ammo. This includes TOW missiles, artillery rounds, etc. Etc.

    I'd rather see round count then the "value" they assign in dollars. Is I 100 rockets and a couple of cans of 5.56 or is it 1 rocket and 500 millions rounds if rifle ammo.

    It matters because rockets/missiles aren't something you can always use after "best used by date". We were able to use some "older" TOW missiles just this past summer and 2 out of 3 rockets had broken wires.

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    Regular Member Kopis's Avatar
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    forgot the ammo..... can i have a missile?

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    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Good question. It does include MISSILES. So I'm sure they cost a lot.

    We seem to be forgetting that ammunition isn't just pistol/rifle ammo. This includes TOW missiles, artillery rounds, etc. Etc.

    I'd rather see round count then the "value" they assign in dollars. Is I 100 rockets and a couple of cans of 5.56 or is it 1 rocket and 500 millions rounds if rifle ammo.

    It matters because rockets/missiles aren't something you can always use after "best used by date". We were able to use some "older" TOW missiles just this past summer and 2 out of 3 rockets had broken wires.

    Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk
    Good point. But even so, I'm a little hesitant to believe everything that is slated for wasteful disposal is unserviceable. Any amount of rifle and pistol cartridges would be accepted by me. All I need is a day and time, and I'll rent me a few semis to move the brass back home.

    And some guys seem willing to risk the missiles (see below).


    Quote Originally Posted by Kopis View Post
    forgot the ammo..... can i have a missile?
    I don't imagine they'll let you just pull up with a tow hitch and take one home, but I like your "waste not" attitude.
    Last edited by Rusty Young Man; 04-29-2014 at 02:40 PM.
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    I get notified about this and that from the CMP people. They sell "surplus ammunition" to the public. They also sell firearms and accessories. This entire lot could be sent to them for resale. Any rockets could be sent to Sarco on consignment.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    Regular Member Kopis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Young Man View Post



    I don't imagine they'll let you just pull up with a tow hitch and take one home, but I like your "waste not" attitude.
    lol....... probably not but hey, gotta ask right? one of our car wash guys found two grenades in a car the military rented a few years ago..... i was like damn why didnt you call me!

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    My USMC son just got back from training he sent me a picture of him sitting at a Duece in a pile of brass and said the powers that be handed over tons of ammo and said shoot it up, they did.
    Throw me to the wolves and I will come back leading the pack.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    My USMC son just got back from training he sent me a picture of him sitting at a Duece in a pile of brass and said the powers that be handed over tons of ammo and said shoot it up, they did.
    Can you share?
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    The government needs to get their act together. What a waste. Our hard working dollars time and time again wasted because of un-organization.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Can you share?
    SGT Hayes at the Deuce.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Steve and Ma Duece.jpg 
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    Last edited by Jeff Hayes; 05-01-2014 at 11:12 PM.
    Throw me to the wolves and I will come back leading the pack.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    Yes
    Wolverines!.......LOL....If the SHTF...he can ride in my truck anytime!
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  24. #24
    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    SGT Hayes at the Deuce.
    He looks like he was having fun. Did he go through three barrels, or are those replacements to keep the fun going?

    What happens to all that brass? I've heard it USED TO be sold to reloading companies, but might now be scrapped?
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

  25. #25
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Young Man View Post
    He looks like he was having fun. Did he go through three barrels, or are those replacements to keep the fun going?

    What happens to all that brass? I've heard it USED TO be sold to reloading companies, but might now be scrapped?
    The barrel will definitely heat up on that thing.

    Believe they have put an end to most of the scrapping of brass.
    http://www.govliquidation.com/Scrap-...Fe07Ogod9hMAsw
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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