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Thread: Police department asking for additional information

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    Police department asking for additional information

    I am a recently certified NRA pistol instructor. Two students of mine came back to me and asked that I fill out a "Firearms Instructor & Class Information" sheet. This is a sheet that is not part of the application found on the state of CT website. Is this additional sheet of Information required by law or is this the police department overstepping their lawful boundaries? I ask because the application itself already requires my NRA. ID number. Any help will be appreciated, thank you.

    Nick T

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    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
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    You likely don't have much of a choice if you don't want to piss of your student.
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    I would recommend that you file for a declaratory judgment with the BFPE regarding the forms if you have objections to them ... rather than make your "students" get p-u-ed.

    Once you get the ruling from the BFPE and its favorable then you can instruct your "students" of the ruling.

    Hows business going?

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    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
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    Was this from Stamford? I think Canton has created one now too, I advise my students they can refuse to submit it and file an appeal if the town fails to process but since it is the student's decision and I don't want to jam them up if they wish to just submit it I will fill it out for them, as you said all they really ask you is your name, NRA # what gun you shot, test score...not really that big a deal when we have towns asking for a lot worse than that.
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    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
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    What a great state to live in. You've got the nannies looking up all sorts of stuff that is none of their damn business. Had to have slowly encroached on rights over the years.
    “Men live without other security than what their own strength and their own invention shall furnish them"
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    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brk913 View Post
    ...not really that big a deal when we have towns asking for a lot worse than that.
    Quote Originally Posted by HPmatt View Post
    Had to have slowly encroached on rights over the years.
    Be careful Mates, it's like rust. Something about "take an inch......".
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
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    Although not mandated as required by state statute (and as I said the student could refuse to provide it and take it to an appeal) I can see the purpose of checking to make sure the applicant took the course from a legitimate Certified Instructor, there has been a huge influx of "fly by night" "certificate mills" popping up in the last 2 years. The state does not have a list of reputable, accepted instructors as some other states do. So if an applicant submits a certificate to the local authority how are they to know if the person who issued it is legit without asking? I know the application contains the Instructor's Name and ID# but it would be pretty easy for someone to just make one up as there is no system in place to verify the information.
    Member:, NRA Patron Life, NSSF, CCDL, CT Carry, MRPC and Bell City
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    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
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    Here's the form from Stamford...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Member:, NRA Patron Life, NSSF, CCDL, CT Carry, MRPC and Bell City
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    I noticed that Stamford's form is from their Crime Scene Unit. What crime has been committed?

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    Now..where it says business name, what if there is none? Not an LLC or anything just doing it on the weekends.


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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brk913 View Post
    Although not mandated as required by state statute (and as I said the student could refuse to provide it and take it to an appeal) I can see the purpose of checking to make sure the applicant took the course from a legitimate Certified Instructor, there has been a huge influx of "fly by night" "certificate mills" popping up in the last 2 years. The state does not have a list of reputable, accepted instructors as some other states do. So if an applicant submits a certificate to the local authority how are they to know if the person who issued it is legit without asking? I know the application contains the Instructor's Name and ID# but it would be pretty easy for someone to just make one up as there is no system in place to verify the information.
    Does not the NRA maintain a file of all those who have passed the exam to ualify as Certified NRA Instructor? A fax to them if there was a question would resolve everything. Otherwise you have a fly-by-night who has only filled out a form - with no other documentation to substantiate the assertions made.

    Extra-legal demands are both extra-legal and evidence of the attempt to exert additional control beyond what the state legislature, in its infinate wisdom, has decided would be sufficient.

    stay safe.
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  12. #12
    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
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    As far as I know the NRA will not discuss the status of members or instructors, plus there are only like 3 people that actually work in the Training Department and they cover the whole country, I once tried to get a hold of any of them, it took 6 months to get a response....

    Wow, I totally overlooked the Crime Scene Unit...

    If you are not a business you simply fill in the individual name and leave that part blank...
    Last edited by brk913; 06-17-2014 at 02:40 PM.
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  13. #13
    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
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    I agree, anything they add simply adds a burden to the applicant and the legislature was pretty clear on that, there is even a declaratory ruling that was sent to all 164 issuing authorities stating they may not add to the application process. While an applicant can refuse and take the issue before the Board and more than likely prevail at the hearing they will wait about 24 months for that hearing, that's right 2 years.....even if they are successful, the towns will continue with their extra requirements for all future applicants, why? Because there is no penalty to them for not following the law....that is what needs to be addressed by the legislature, if we had a law like FL that said anyone who uses their official capacity to hinder the permit process is personally liable for a $5,000 fine, they'd all snap into line then....
    Member:, NRA Patron Life, NSSF, CCDL, CT Carry, MRPC and Bell City
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    A cite to the declaratory ruling may help out the OP greatly.

    The training's a joke ... just a $$$ hurdle to keep blacks from getting a permit.

  15. #15
    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    A cite to the declaratory ruling may help out the OP greatly.
    You're right: http://www.ct.gov/bfpe/lib/bfpe/bfpedeclrule.pdf

    Yet, the issuing authorities (not all, but most...) don't care and ignore that too....
    Member:, NRA Patron Life, NSSF, CCDL, CT Carry, MRPC and Bell City
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    I would like to say thank you to everyone who posted to my topic, thanks guys.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
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    Details about the fight over 'additional permit requirements' can be found here: http://ctcarry.com/Permits/AdditionalRequirements

    As I indicated already, as a trainer, you really have no recourse without ******* off your customer(s).
    Connecticut Carry is dedicated to advancing and protecting the fundamental civil rights of the men and women of Connecticut to keep and bear arms for self defense of themselves and the state as guaranteed by the United States Constitution and the Constitution of Connecticut.

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