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Thread: Tempe Town Lake Fireworks

  1. #1
    Regular Member The Trickster's Avatar
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    Tempe Town Lake Fireworks

    Does anyone know if Tempe will be restricting the rights of the citizenry to exercise their Second Amendment rights while at Tempe Town Lake on the 4th? As I recall, in subsequent years they have claimed to have the authority to prohibit firearms.

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    I believe, as a government agency, they can only do so if they offer to check your firearm.

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    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterNSteinmetz View Post
    I believe, as a government agency, they can only do so if they offer to check your firearm.
    I'd add:
    Unless they're making the claim that the area is being "leased" as a "venue", or is being cordoned off (also as a "venue") for the consumption of liquor in the cordoned-off area, or the area is being "secured", I also do not see them having any legitimate claim to said authority.

    At any rate, I do believe the family and I will be in attendance, and I have no intention of being rendered defenseless on the anniversary of the signing of a document such as the Declaration of Independence (one of my favourite parts is "He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power."; I wonder where else I remember reading something about it).

    If you happen to see me, go ahead and say hello. You'll recognize me as the extremely good-looking guy with the long dark hair, sun-kissed skin, and impeccable taste in fashion.
    If you still can't pick me out, you've obviously got a different idea of what constitutes fashion than I do (seems to be the case most of the time), and your idea of good-looking might differ as well.
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Young Man View Post
    I'd add:
    At any rate, I do believe the family and I will be in attendance, and I have no intention of being rendered defenseless on the anniversary of the signing of a document such as the Declaration of Independence (one of my favourite parts is "He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power."; I wonder where else I remember reading something about it).
    Glad to hear you will be checking it out. I guess I'll hear about the results the following day!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Young Man View Post
    I'd add:
    Unless they're making the claim that the area is being "leased" as a "venue", or is being cordoned off (also as a "venue") for the consumption of liquor in the cordoned-off area, or the area is being "secured", I also do not see them having any legitimate claim to said authority.

    At any rate, I do believe the family and I will be in attendance, and I have no intention of being rendered defenseless on the anniversary of the signing of a document such as the Declaration of Independence (one of my favourite parts is "He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power."; I wonder where else I remember reading something about it).

    If you happen to see me, go ahead and say hello. You'll recognize me as the extremely good-looking guy with the long dark hair, sun-kissed skin, and impeccable taste in fashion.
    If you still can't pick me out, you've obviously got a different idea of what constitutes fashion than I do (seems to be the case most of the time), and your idea of good-looking might differ as well.
    Rusty, have you been out there before? I am considering going out there but don't know if it will be to crowded?

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    No firearms permitted :(

    Looked at their website and found out firearms are not permitted http://www.tempe4th.com/

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    Regular Member The Trickster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Javelina View Post
    Looked at their website and found out firearms are not permitted http://www.tempe4th.com/
    I do not understand how they have the authority to do this as the event is outside on public property.

    Additionally, "all persons and bags are subject to search." 4th Amendment??????????
    Last edited by The Trickster; 07-03-2014 at 07:11 PM.

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    Looks like it is run by eventsbysya.com. The case appears fairly strong. According to Korwin's book, they would need to provide a gun check at no charge, if they want to make this request. ARas 13-3102.01 seems to the appropriate statute.

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    I think I would just show up and act like nothing is wrong. If they say you can't bring in your firearm, then ask where is the secure readily accessible storage. If they don't have any, then tell them ARS 13-3102.01 clearly requires they provide it or abandon the request. If they won't comply, call the police and report them as being in violation. Finally, if you can't get in and want some burgers, come by my house.

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    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterNSteinmetz View Post
    Glad to hear you will be checking it out. I guess I'll hear about the results the following day!
    Sure will.

    Quote Originally Posted by Javelina View Post
    Rusty, have you been out there before? I am considering going out there but don't know if it will be to crowded?
    I've gone several times before I carried, but not since then. I've been at the West end of the lake, farther West where I was on private property beyond the lake, the East end of the lake, and in the Tempe Marketplace parking lot East of the lake.

    Since I didn't carry at the time (not able to buy or didn't yet own my 1911), I simply carried a fixed blade knife OWB (~" blade, maybe 1 ft overall length).
    Never had any trouble with either security or the people there (some looks and others would avoid me though).

    As was pointed out, it doesn't seem like any disarm will be enforceable unless lock boxes are provided. We'll see. The family and I will arrive around 8 pm in order to get an acceptable view of the fireworks (I'm not the "camp out" type).
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

  11. #11
    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterNSteinmetz View Post
    Looks like it is run by eventsbysya.com. The case appears fairly strong. According to Korwin's book, they would need to provide a gun check at no charge, if they want to make this request. ARas 13-3102.01 seems to the appropriate statute.
    I'm taking a print out of the law with me; don't think I'll need it, but we all know it's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterNSteinmetz View Post
    I think I would just show up and act like nothing is wrong. If they say you can't bring in your firearm, then ask where is the secure readily accessible storage. If they don't have any, then tell them ARS 13-3102.01 clearly requires they provide it or abandon the request. If they won't comply, call the police and report them as being in violation.
    This is the plan.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterNSteinmetz View Post
    Finally, if you can't get in and want some burgers, come by my house.
    That's generous, but I hope it doesn't come to that. Prohibiting lawful carry at a public 4th of July celebration would be more un-American than banning high-capacity sodas.
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

  12. #12
    Regular Member The Trickster's Avatar
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    It is unfortunate that although the requirement to provide secured storage is specified in ARS, many do not offer it and suffer no repercussions from not providing it. Furthermore, many employees at public places such as the MVD, courts, etc. aren't even aware of the law and will insist that you must leave it in your car. When the police are called in to deal with the situation, I'll bet my bottom dollar that they will almost certainly side with the employees of the public property and have you leave the weapon in your vehicle. In typical fashion, when the law is convenient to government or works in its favor, the governed are expected to follow it without exception and with severe consequences should they choose not to do so; however, when the law is inconvenient for government and it favors the governed, the government circumvents and/or ignores it with usually no repercussions for doing so.

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    Regular Member FreeInAZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Trickster View Post
    It is unfortunate that although the requirement to provide secured storage is specified in ARS, many do not offer it and suffer no repercussions from not providing it. Furthermore, many employees at public places such as the MVD, courts, etc. aren't even aware of the law and will insist that you must leave it in your car. When the police are called in to deal with the situation, I'll bet my bottom dollar that they will almost certainly side with the employees of the public property and have you leave the weapon in your vehicle. In typical fashion, when the law is convenient to government or works in its favor, the governed are expected to follow it without exception and with severe consequences should they choose not to do so; however, when the law is inconvenient for government and it favors the governed, the government circumvents and/or ignores it with usually no repercussions for doing so.
    You can thank Governor Brewer for vetoing many bills that would have held local units of government accountable for violating "our" laws & "our" rights. I use the term "our", because apparently, those in government have been given the "wink & nod" by her to do what they damn well please, with no worry of repercussions! May the door hit her in her arse on her way out the door!

    She has proven one of our forefathers to be spot on, when he said this: "A government that does not trust its law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust" - James Madison

    In short - she sides with the masters in AZ government who say it's fine for "them" to be armed in public (though I doubt they really feel this way), but I'll be damned if they can carry in MY building(s)! See, when you have power, it's easy to forget where that power came from....the people!

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    Regular Member The Trickster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gutshot View Post
    "subsequent years"? Don't you mean previous years?
    No, I meant subsequent. Don't tell anybody, but I can actually see the future.

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    Regular Member The Trickster's Avatar
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    Did anyone attend and if so, what was it like?

  16. #16
    Regular Member Rusty Young Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Trickster View Post
    Did anyone attend and if so, what was it like?
    The actual fireworks were uneventful:
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...41#post2073841
    I carry to defend my loved ones; Desensitizing and educating are secondary & tertiary reasons. Anything else is unintended.

    “Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place.” - Frederic Bastiat

    "When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle." - Edmund Burke

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