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Thread: quick question on vehicle storage

  1. #1
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    quick question on vehicle storage

    So I'm currently attending the FAA academy in OKC and was wondering if I'm allowed by law to keep my handgun in my car in the parking lot while I'm in class. I hold a Missouri CCW which is recognized by Oklahoma. I have done some research on http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-laws/oklahoma.aspx and http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/oklahoma.pdf and from what I understand locked in your car on a federal parking lot is not illegal. Is this correct or am I reading the laws wrong?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ATCSamps View Post
    So I'm currently attending the FAA academy in OKC and was wondering if I'm allowed by law to keep my handgun in my car in the parking lot while I'm in class. I hold a Missouri CCW which is recognized by Oklahoma. I have done some research on http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-laws/oklahoma.aspx and http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/oklahoma.pdf and from what I understand locked in your car on a federal parking lot is not illegal. Is this correct or am I reading the laws wrong?
    carry or possessing any firearm is illegal on any federal installation. even in the parking lot. I would not try it. its not worth it. you can always ask your instructor if its ok.

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    It doesn't matter what state law says, state law never trumps federal law. If your class is on federal property, either park across the street or leave the gun at home.

    Quote Originally Posted by FAA Human Resource Policy Manual
    14. Possession of Firearms: No employee, while in or on FAA/GSA-owned or leased property, to include Government and personal vehicles, shall carry or have in their possession, privately owned firearms or other weapons unless authorized by the FAA to do so in connection with his/her official duties, such as survival and emergency firearms in an operational area, such as the Alaskan Region. See FAA Order 1600.69(series), Facility Security Management Program, Appendix 12, for additional information. This prohibition applies regardless of any State law which may permit the carrying of firearms.
    Linky
    Last edited by hrdware; 07-03-2014 at 08:35 AM. Reason: Added Info
    I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be accepted as legal advice

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    Once again this site is putting false information 18 USC 930 defines Federal Installations as buildings, NOT parking lots. The USPS tried this and was told they couldn't ban firearms in parking lots.

    Also you quote an HR handbook NOT Federal Law.
    Last edited by Amigatec; 07-03-2014 at 03:09 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amigatec View Post
    Once again this site is putting false information 18 USC 930 defines Federal Installations as buildings, NOT parking lots. The USPS tried this and was told they couldn't ban firearms in parking lots.

    Also you quote an HR handbook NOT Federal Law.
    First, the site did not put out any information.
    Second, the USPS is not a federal installation. That ruling is currently only valid in the 9th circuit.
    Third, I never said what I quoted was law, I specifically tagged it as from an HR handbook. Don't you think an EE should know what their employer thinks of firearms on their property?
    Fourth, if the training is behind a secure checkpoint, firearms can still be banned in the parking lot.

    Guess it all depends on where the training will take place.

    ATCSamps, where will this training take place?
    I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be accepted as legal advice

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    Quote Originally Posted by hrdware View Post
    It doesn't matter what state law says, state law never trumps federal law.
    Which is the outcome of the Civil War, and why the states which think they've legalized marijuana haven't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amigatec
    18 USC 930 defines Federal Installations as buildings, NOT parking lots.
    The USPS tried this and was told they couldn't ban firearms in parking lots.
    You're right about "federal facilities" only being buildings, and here's that bit of code, but the PO is "protected" by its own section of federal code.
    There are some legislators working to correct that, bring it into line with that CO judge's ruling.

    Quote Originally Posted by 39CFR232.1(L)
    Notwithstanding the provisions of any other law, rule or regulation, no person while on postal property may carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for official purposes.
    Of course, that same section (232.1) also says that you're not allowed to have a dog or other animal on the property, and you must have currently-valid license plates & driver's license if you're driving your vehicle on the property.
    Guess which one they're enforcing? (Hint: it's not the dog or valid license plates.)


    I've been searching that law.cornell.edu site for combinations of [FAA property firearm] and this is the only possibly applicable statute I've found. (There may of course be others, but they're hiding from me.)
    It would only apply if you're an FAA employee, not just taking a course from them.

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/31/0.215
    Quote Originally Posted by 31CFR0.215
    (a) Employees shall not possess firearms, explosives, or other dangerous or deadly weapons, either openly or concealed, while on Government property or official duty.
    "Possess" would probably be taken to include both carrying & storage.
    Last edited by MKEgal; 07-07-2014 at 11:17 AM.
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    http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...grams/academy/

    Remember, it is a .gov and all information listed must be taken with a grain of salt. Also, what you read today may be lost tomorrow after a "hard drive crash."
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    Quote Originally Posted by tausch View Post
    carry or possessing any firearm is illegal on any federal installation. even in the parking lot. I would not try it. its not worth it. you can always ask your instructor if its ok.
    Incorrect.

    The general prohibition only applies to building or portion thereof.

    Some Federal agencies (Post Office, Army Corps, Va, etc.) have specific regulations in place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ATCSamps View Post
    So I'm currently attending the FAA academy in OKC and was wondering if I'm allowed by law to keep my handgun in my car in the parking lot while I'm in class. I hold a Missouri CCW which is recognized by Oklahoma. I have done some research on http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-laws/oklahoma.aspx and http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/oklahoma.pdf and from what I understand locked in your car on a federal parking lot is not illegal. Is this correct or am I reading the laws wrong?
    Id park across the street if possible. Just my 2 cents.

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    I work for the Federal Gov, and I can guarantee you there are at least a half dozen firearms in the parking lot everyday, and unless you're brandishing the Gov doesn't care. I really doubt this facility has Federal Police Officers, and if they do, the last thing they would want to conduct a search of cars in the parking lot, they would have to have probable cause, and unless you are bragging or brandishing they don't have any probably cause. We had a person brag to the Federal cops he was carrying a loaded M1911 into the building, and the Cops didn't search him, just because he bragged about it, was not probably cause.

    Keep it in your car, and keep your mouth shut. By parking across the street you only bring attention to yourself. Don't bring any suspicion to yourself. Act normal. If the firearm is out of site, and secured, no one needs to know.

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    just be cool

    Quote Originally Posted by Amigatec View Post
    I work for the Federal Gov, and I can guarantee you there are at least a half dozen firearms in the parking lot everyday...
    Keep it in your car, and keep your mouth shut... Act normal. If the firearm is out of site, and secured, no one needs to know.

    Agreed.
    A similar example would be at the Tulsa International Airport where there are several companies up to even American Airlines who are technically on airport property but are fine as long as you park in the lot (inside "the fence") and don't bring things into the restricted area. In every case I'm aware of security is a subcontracted company and they usually have a form, which to my knowledge no one has ever filled out, in order to "authorize" it on "company" property... But then, the state did passed that law about parking lots and even in this big city folks like their hunting season.

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    We had an employee that parked his car around the side of the building in visitor parking, instead of employee parking. He then would walk back around the building to, use the employee entrance. He walked 2 to 3 times as far as needed, just so people wouldn't see his cat. The other employees and the Fed Police thought it was strange and decided to investigate, and discovered he didn't have a drivers license, it had been revoked for drink driving, if he would have parked in employee parking the cops would never looked into the matter.

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