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Thread: How different is you're States 2nd A in comparison to The United States Constitution?

  1. #1
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    How different is you're States 2nd A in comparison to The United States Constitution?

    Hi Folks

    How different is you're States 2A compared to the 2A of the United States of America Constitution?

    Here is what I have on the New Jersey State 2 A Constitution..

    Political Power-(2) All political power is inherent in the people. Government is instituted for the protection, security, and benefit of the people, and they have the right at all times to alter or reform the same, whenever the public good may require it.

    In earlier times many people held that political power belonged to a king or to nobles. Now we claim that the people should rule themselves. They have a right to make the kind of government that they feel will protect and benefit them. Of course, if they can establish a government, they can change it whenever they think a change is necessary..

    This Amendment is from a 1965 edition titled 'Our Great State Papers"

    No where in this edition is it mentioned that a citizen as a "right to keep and bear arms"

    More study and research is needed on my end. No wonder why this is such an anti state, they have no mention that such a right to keep and bear arms exist..

    I am curious to learn just how many other State Constitutions do not mirror the 2A of the United States of America's Constitution.

    Please post you're states Constitution if the verbiage is different then the US Constitution.

    Thank you in advance and best regards.

    CCJ
    " I detest hypocrites and their Hypocrisy" I support Liberty for each, for all, and forever".
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  2. #2
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Right to keep and bear arms--exception.

    Section 23. That the right of every citizen to keep and bear arms in defense of his home, person and property, or when lawfully summoned in aid of the civil power, shall not be questioned; but this shall not justify the wearing of concealed weapons.
    Infringed all the time. NJ does not have a need for one because the 2A exists, perhaps.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Infringed all the time. NJ does not have a need for one because the 2A exists, perhaps.
    NJ has no 2nd A , not in the same way the rest of the modern day does anyhow.

    REGARDS

    ccJ
    " I detest hypocrites and their Hypocrisy" I support Liberty for each, for all, and forever".
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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    More information than you probably ever wanted to know in order to answer a simplistic (but not simple) question. Prof. Volk to the rescue!

    http://www.trolp.org/main_pgs/issues/v11n1/Volokh.pdf

    Google and ye shall find. You owe me $0.037 for the amount of time needed, at my usual rate, to find that.

    stay safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    More information than you probably ever wanted to know in order to answer a simplistic (but not simple) question. Prof. Volk to the rescue!

    http://www.trolp.org/main_pgs/issues/v11n1/Volokh.pdf

    Google and ye shall find. You owe me $0.037 for the amount of time needed, at my usual rate, to find that.

    stay safe.
    Many Thanks skidmark-- NO provision for the rights of the people to keep and bear arms. It is criminal.

    My .02

    REgards
    CCj
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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by countryclubjoe View Post
    Many Thanks skidmark-- NO provision for the rights of the people to keep and bear arms. It is criminal.

    My .02

    REgards
    CCj
    So fix it. Get the state constitution fixed. Im assuming the state has a process since it was amended as recent as the 60s

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    Regular Member Kopis's Avatar
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    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
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    Ooo excellent topic. I'm on my phone so it isn't easy to quote it but unfortunately here in Texas during the reconstruction something along the lines of ',but the legislature shall have the power to regulate the wearing of arms with a view to prevent crime' was added to the end of ours. We hope to get that fixed. As Primus pointed out, it is possible. Edit: i'm sure the process varies by state, just saying generally...
    Last edited by stealthyeliminator; 07-08-2014 at 02:04 PM.
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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    So fix it. Get the state constitution fixed. Im assuming the state has a process since it was amended as recent as the 60s

    Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk
    +1

    Waiting for out of staters to do it for you, or the critters in DC to fix it for you = not getting fixed.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Also... Here's some food for thought.

    Depending on the state, I wonder if it would be EASIER to get the constitution amended then it would be to get legislation repealed/passed.

    For example, say the state allows you to open it up for a ballot question or some other majority vote it would be easy to pass if the actual majority of state voters wanted it.

    We know some/most of the state "reps" don't always represent "us". So it would he a way to for us to represent us directly...

    This would obviously work better in states where certain counties/districts may have more reps in the stage house who are voting liberal but the vast majority I'd the state is conservative. Isn't WA like that? The few big cities run state politics and ruin it for the rest?

    Again, I could be way off base but I figured id step down the rabbit hole.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Also... Here's some food for thought.

    Depending on the state, I wonder if it would be EASIER to get the constitution amended then it would be to get legislation repealed/passed.

    ....
    Hey, Kopis!

    Could you do up Cpt Picard for then/than? Can/may? Affect/effect? And don't forget grammer/grammar!

    stay safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator View Post
    Ooo excellent topic. I'm on my phone so it isn't easy to quote it but unfortunately here in Texas during the reconstruction something along the lines of ',but the legislature shall have the power to regulate the wearing of arms with a view to prevent crime' was added to the end of ours. We hope to get that fixed. As Primus pointed out, it is possible. Edit: i'm sure the process varies by state, just saying generally...
    Ours is very similar

    That the citizens of this State have a right to keep and to bear arms for their common defense; but the Legislature shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms with a view to prevent crime.
    That last part is very vague and can really be taken to mean anything. Unfortunately for us it means that we've adopted a law that criminalizes any form of loaded carry (except in your car as of July 1st) without a state issued permission slip (that's really just a defense to the crime which it still is).
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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Also... Here's some food for thought....
    MO has two avenues to pursue. Citizen initiated and legislative initiated. Sometimes it takes the people to do the heavy lifting that elected critters refuse to do.

    +1 again.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Washington State Constitution:

    ARTICLE 1 SECTION 24 RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS. The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men.
    No right is held more sacred, or is more carefully guarded, by the common law than the right of every individual to the possession and control of his own person, free from all restraint or interference of others, unless by clear and unquestionable authority of law. Union Pacific Rail Co. vs Botsford as quoted in Terry v Ohio.


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    The Volokh.pdf provided in post #4 @ 0539 has ALL state constitution RKABA excerpts

    Last edited by Nightmare; 07-08-2014 at 06:13 PM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

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    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SovereignAxe View Post
    Ours is very similar



    That last part is very vague and can really be taken to mean anything. Unfortunately for us it means that we've adopted a law that criminalizes any form of loaded carry (except in your car as of July 1st) without a state issued permission slip (that's really just a defense to the crime which it still is).
    Hmm very similar indeed. Now that I'm at my computer, this is the Texas Constitution Bill of Rights Section 23

    Sec. 23. RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS. Every citizen shall have the right to keep and bear arms in the lawful defense of himself or the State; but the Legislature shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime.

    Seems almost as if our states both had the same person telling them what to do with their bill of rights.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ak56 View Post
    Washington State Constitution:

    Which some interpret to mean we can't organize a body of armed men. I disagree.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

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    Colorado: Section 13. Right to bear arms. The right of no person to keep and bear arms in defense of his home, person and property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned, shall be called in question; but nothing herein contained shall be construed to justify the practice of carrying concealed weapons.

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    Regular Member Gil223's Avatar
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    Utah Constitution, Article I, Section 6. [Right to bear arms.]

    The individual right of the people to keep and bear arms for security and defense of self, family, others, property, or the state, as well as for other lawful purposes shall not be infringed; but nothing herein shall prevent the Legislature from defining the lawful use of arms. (italics added)

    I was quite satisfied with our Utah Constitution... until I passed the semi-colon. I guess we can't expect the state to give up ALL control, can we? Pax...
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    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    You owe me $0.037 for the amount of time needed, at my usual rate, to find that..
    Thanks Skid, I posted this on Whatcom Countys fazeboog page. Can I send you a check or will you accept paypal?

    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Which some interpret to mean we can't organize a body of armed men. I disagree.
    This is a quandary. Does this mean that the Whatcom County Chapter of Washington Open Carry cannot "organize", or must we remain a "loosely knit group of like minded individuals"?

    but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    Paragraph VIII. Arms, right to keep and bear.
    The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, but the General Assembly shall have power to prescribe the manner in which arms may be borne.

    So, even if the Constitution of the United States only gave the States the ability to maintain a militia (a fallacious argument) the State Constitution guarantees the right of the people to bear arms.

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    Campaign Veteran Running Wolf's Avatar
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    Wisconsin Article 1, Section 25:

    Section 25. [As created Nov. 1998] The people have the right to keep and bear arms for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose.
    When rights are outlawed only outlaws will have rights.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Nevada's is perhaps as good as it gets, in Article 1, Section 11:
    Every citizen has the right to keep and bear arms for security and defense, for lawful hunting and recreational use and for other lawful purposes.
    Last edited by MAC702; 07-10-2014 at 09:29 PM.
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    Ours will pass that if Constitutional Amendment 5 passes next month.

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    Regular Member SouthernBoy's Avatar
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    We don't have a Second Amendment in Virginia, however we do have Section 13... which is really more important for Virginians. Section 13 was the text from which the Second Amendment in the U.S. Bill of Rights was drawn by James Madison. We can thank Patrick Henry and George Mason for convincing Mr. Madison that a Bill of Rights was not only necessary but essential to the continued liberty of a free people.


    "Section 13. Militia; standing armies; military subordinate to civil power.

    That a well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defense of a free state, therefore, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed; that standing armies, in time of peace, should be avoided as dangerous to liberty; and that in all cases the military should be under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power."
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