Contesting A Restraining Order

marshaul said:

I think can we all see where that got him. :lol: His mother's response is as predictable as sunshine after rain.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm suggesting. Even in an ideal world, this is not the sort of assault which necessitates intervention by the state. In our world, it's not a small fraction of what would make such intervention a good idea.

Record everything. Defend yourself if necessary. Otherwise, disengage.

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Why bother recording anything if you aren't going to bring it into court? ES, his wife, and his mother were all there so I suppose they know what happened.

But seeing as how they did "invite the law into their lives", do you have any constructive suggestions to offer to the discussion?

stay safe.

skidmark said:

Why bother recording anything if you aren't going to bring it into court?

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Precisely so that you don't have to make a complaint as some sort of pre-emptive strike. If the other party decides to do so, your bases are covered.

Why bring someone into court over a minor physical altercation in which nobody was meaningfully hurt, and everybody walked away? Because it vindicates your ego?

skidmark said:

But seeing as how they did "invite the law into their lives", do you have any constructive suggestions to offer to the discussion?

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Yes. "Live and learn."

marshaul said:

Precisely so that you don't have to make a complaint as some sort of pre-emptive strike. If the other party decides to do so, your bases are covered.

Why bring someone into court over a minor physical altercation in which nobody was meaningfully hurt, and everybody walked away? Because it vindicates your ego?



Yes. "Live and learn."

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I would consider an altercation that results in blood being drawn fall under "meaningfully hurt."

Additionally, if my wife were to be arrested, she would lose her job. I believe there is another member here who has experienced the same. They say you can beat the rap, but you can't beat the ride. She didn't want to have to take the ride in the first place.

Esanders2008 said:

I would consider an altercation that results in blood being drawn fall under "meaningfully hurt."

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Sometimes my cats draw blood when I play with them. The horror!

I would consider filing a criminal complaint over an altercation about which the worst you can say is that it "drew blood" to be unwise. You see why; the system is a tool just as easily used by someone you piss off as it is by yourself, the righteously aggrieved.

The system is not on your side, and it does not exist to protect you.

Additionally, if my wife were to be arrested, she would lose her job. I believe there is another member here who has experienced the same. They say you can beat the rap, but you can't beat the ride. She didn't want to have to take the ride in the first place.

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You aren't going to be losing any job if you have a recording of the incident.

As far as I can see, you could have put this behind you; now it's following you around. But, hey, it's not my loss if you wanna dig your heels in.

I do wish you the best. The situation you've found yourself in is no joke (although perhaps it should be).

Marshaul -

Are you related to davidmcbeth?

It seems to be clear that you do not consider the precipitating event worthy of pressing criminal charges. (Have no idea how you feel about a civil suit, but since I raised the issue I'm sure you will share your wisdom with us.)

However, you were querried for constructive actions based on the existing situation. Why you remain insistant on how you might have responded and how things might have been different, as opposed to how to deal with the reality of the situation, would be puzzling except that I have reason to suspect what the answer is to my question above.

stay safe.

skidmark said:

Marshaul -

Are you related to davidmcbeth?

It seems to be clear that you do not consider the precipitating event worthy of pressing criminal charges. (Have no idea how you feel about a civil suit, but since I raised the issue I'm sure you will share your wisdom with us.)

However, you were querried for constructive actions based on the existing situation. Why you remain insistant on how you might have responded and how things might have been different, as opposed to how to deal with the reality of the situation, would be puzzling except that I have reason to suspect what the answer is to my question above.

stay safe.

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I was thinking he spent too much time in California.

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skidmark said:

Marshaul -

Are you related to davidmcbeth?

It seems to be clear that you do not consider the precipitating event worthy of pressing criminal charges. (Have no idea how you feel about a civil suit, but since I raised the issue I'm sure you will share your wisdom with us.)

However, you were querried for constructive actions based on the existing situation. Why you remain insistant on how you might have responded and how things might have been different, as opposed to how to deal with the reality of the situation, would be puzzling except that I have reason to suspect what the answer is to my question above.

stay safe.

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Personal attacks now? Why so hostile of late?

I didn't say a word about "worthiness". I merely provided sage advice: avoid involving the law except as a last resort. You don't do your own credibility any service by treating what I said as anything but.

Of course, you are free to deny what's right in front of your face, but I think the benefit of involving the law speaks quite well for itself. :lol:

marshaul said:

The system is not on your side, and it does not exist to protect you.

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+1000. I have learned and lived this lesson. Even if you "win" what do you win, how are you compensated, the state is the system is, rarely the victim.

marshaul said:

Personal attacks now? Why so hostile of late?

I didn't say a word about "worthiness". I merely provided sage advice: avoid involving the law except as a last resort. You don't do your own credibility any service by treating what I said as anything but.

Of course, you are free to deny what's right in front of your face, but I think the benefit of involving the law speaks quite well for itself. :lol:

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Oh, what the heck. The guy hands me a post full of straight lines. What's a fella gonna do?

Personal attack? Seeking clarification of a question is now hostility[SUP]1[/SUP]? Or are you ascribing characteristics to the named individual that have not otherwise been introduced? Also, "Methinks the lady doth protest too much" may be apropos.

Please explain the difference between "worthiness" and involving the law as a last resort. Isn't that merely a matter of degree? Somewhere in there, I would love to learn just what would constitute a "last resort".

stay safe.

[SUP]1[/SUP] - thank $diety I was not carving a watermelon at the time I asked the original question.

skidmark said:

Please explain the difference between "worthiness" and involving the law as a last resort. Isn't that merely a matter of degree?

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Sorry if I get the impression you're being willfully obtuse. I may be mistaken, but when you asked what I consider "worthy of pressing charges", it seemed to me that it was intended to be an ethical question, one of justice. I am not speaking to the justice of the matter; merely the incredibly predictable manner in which the current state was precipitated by the involvement of the law.

Somewhere in there, I would love to learn just what would constitute a "last resort".

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Nah, I'm not going to be baited into specifying some arbitrary bright line. I'll tell you what isn't a last resort, though: the OP's case. :lol:

Wait, here's one for you: if you can, as an OCer, assume that the involvement of the law comes with a free brandishing conviction from the state of Virginia (not a wildly unreasonable assumption given recent history, and as you yourself can attest ) and/or temporary loss of RKBA rights, and still decide it's worth it, then it probably qualifies as a "last resort".

Seriously guys, I'm not trying to be combative, or argumentative just for the sake of it. I've seen this sort of thing time and time again: after a spat or fight, one person gets a restraining order, the other person retaliates in like manner, the headaches long outlast the original injury, and ultimately nobody benefits. Better to walk away, I say, and give them the opportunity to do the same. Plus, you can – and should – shun the aggressor later (which, frankly, is at least as effective as a restraining order). But really – you didn't pay a cent for this advice, and are free to value it accordingly.


BTW, I've seen your remarks regarding DMB, so, yeah, the comparison constitutes a personal attack. Don't worry, I'm not offended; I just call it like I see it – I've never been one for paper-thin veneers. (Are you related to eye95?)

marshaul said:

....

BTW, I've seen your remarks regarding DMB, so, yeah, the comparison constitutes a personal attack. Don't worry, I'm not offended; I just call it like I see it – I've never been one for paper-thin veneers. (Are you related to eye95?)

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Comparison? As in saying A has the attributes or qualities of B? I guess I must have been out sick that day when it was explained that questions were actually statements.

No relationship at all to the gentleman, until you get down to the biological taxonomy sorts of relationships. I am disappointed that you would choose him as your foil. But nowhere near as disappointed in seing how you, after declaring your apprbation for a particular behavior, willfully engage in just such behavior. At the moment I am confused as to whether it indicates a lack of refinement or a lack of maturity. Perhaps I might carve out some time to mull over the question - if the rest of my life does not get in the way.

But now that we have had our little exchange, I wonder if you would favor me, if not the rest of those following this thread, with some constructive advice for esanders regarding how to move forward from where he and his wife find themselves? Or is your only contribution to remain stating that you would have done things differently? (Somehow the comparison to the usefullness of a rubber crutch does come to mind.)

stay safe.

marshaul said:

Personal attacks now? Why so hostile of late?

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I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.

George Bernard Shaw

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MontanaResident said:

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What?!? And let him get away without some constructive comment?

stay safe.

I've recently learned two new words that I find to be appropriate for some use, but I'll abstain.

Anyways good luck to the OP, I have been is a somewhat similar predicament but it was the fore mentioned temporary 24 hour BS no need for probable cause restraining order, and I to this day have never seen the "paper" instead I heard of it and went to the magistrate myself.

For something that can strip you of your rights they should not be so ridiculously easy to get.

Just wanted to give everyone an update:
The CA's office called me today, after I had contacted the sheriff's office about the witness intimidation. A formal request has been made to the CA to assist with the prosecution of the case. We will know if we have been approved within a few days.

Esanders2008 said:

Just wanted to give everyone an update:
The CA's office called me today, after I had contacted the sheriff's office about the witness intimidation. A formal request has been made to the CA to assist with the prosecution of the case. We will know if we have been approved within a few days.

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I know it's a cheap shot, but I'm going to take it.

Told you so!

BTW - who made the formal request for the CA to "assist with the prosecution of the case"?

stay safe.

skidmark said:

I know it's a cheap shot, but I'm going to take it.

Told you so!

BTW - who made the formal request for the CA to "assist with the prosecution of the case"?

stay safe.

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I spoke with an assistant CA, who is forwarding the request to the CA for the city of Chesapeake.

I'm presuming the Assistant CA you spoke with was in the Chesapeake CA's office. No need to respond unless that is not correct.

stay safe.

Don't know where you are with your possible case but here are some attorney's that may help. They are from the VCDL website.

http://www.hkshooter.net/lawyers/

wittmeba said:

Don't know where you are with your possible case but here are some attorney's that may help. They are from the VCDL website.

http://www.hkshooter.net/lawyers/

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A crime against the peace and dignity of the Commonwealth of Virginia was committed. It is the responsibility of the Commonwealth to prosecute the charge.

I am going to guess that up until the issue of witness intimidation was brought to the point it could not be ignored the CA just figured this was a slam-dunk and they did not need to show up. My thoughts about that are not able to be expressed in socially appropriate language.

However, it appears the CA has had at least a momentary relapse of cranial-rectal inversion.

stay safe.