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Thread: Cop knocks on your car window...

  1. #1
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Cop knocks on your car window...

    According to the Wisconsin Supreme Court, feel free to drive away! The saying "you may beat the rap but you won't beat the ride (and they'll steal your guns)" comes to mind.

    Well, I'm going to bookmark this in my phones browser and try it if I ever get Johnny Law knocking on my truck window. The conversation should be interesting at least when they decide to invent PC and pull me over. The video will be...ummm...exonerating.

  2. #2
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    And because windows phones are crap and have very very short term clipboard storage...



    http://thefreethoughtproject.com/sta...-window-drive/



    The link.
    Last edited by wimwag; 07-29-2014 at 12:55 AM.

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    Regular Member Freedom1Man's Avatar
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    DUI for sitting in a parking lot....
    Provision for free medical attendance and nursing, for clothing, for food, for housing, for the education of children, and a hundred other matters, might with equal propriety be proposed as tending to relieve the employee of mental strain and worry. --- These matters obviously lie outside the orbit of congressional power. (Railroad Retirement Board v Alton Railroad)

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    A correct but surprising ruling given the fact that courts see your car usually as a rolling jail.

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    I see gunfire in your future and it likely will not be you busting a cap.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Judicial notice of contempt of cop, from the decision. "To their credit, citizens and others may feel tethered by social norms to an officer's request and may consent in order to avoid the taboo of disrespecting an officer of the law. However, a person's consent is no less valid simply because an individual is particularly susceptible to social or ethical pressures."

    Shortly after, the court cites "the grassy knoll" again.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 07-29-2014 at 08:06 AM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    I see gunfire in your future and it likely will not be you busting a cap.
    Future?

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    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    The courts are bending over backwards to see any citizen's interaction with law enforcement as 'voluntary' as that is most beneficial to the officer. Absent commands to comply, drawn weapons, flashing emergency lights, an escape pathway blocked by multiple officers, any questions that are answered are likely to be viewed as voluntary statements.

    Per the Court: "...when the officer, by means of physical force or show of authority, terminates or restrains his freedom of movement.” Brendlin v. California (2007) __ U.S. __ [2007 WL 1730143].

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    Hey, I drove away before a meter maid (hartford) could place the ticket on my car .... he ran after me for about 100 ft, then gave up..

    So, he processed the thing anyway .... a short visit to the city attorney and the case was dissmissed !

    And in NYC (craphole that it is -- their laws have no effect on my behavior) got the the geo. wash bridge and no one was at the cash booth to collect (small line formed) ~ people had to just say "screw this" ... got a ticket der ... filed a motion to dismiss ... case dismissed.


    In Boston, got a ticket, they put some stupid code down for color (using old ticket nomenclature on new forms), I argued law requires color to be put on ticket, case dismissed there too.

    And when I get tickets and lose (hey, we all know its a scam system) I don't pay.

    I don't pay civil judgments ... like many people who I have gotten civil judgements from...

  10. #10
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    I see gunfire in your future and it likely will not be you busting a cap.

    Go on and finish that statement.

  11. #11
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wimwag View Post
    Go on and finish that statement.
    My comment stands alone. Inability to see the reality of the situation as it stands today is on you.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fallschirmjäger View Post
    The courts are bending over backwards to see any citizen's interaction with law enforcement as 'voluntary' as that is most beneficial to the officer. Absent commands to comply, drawn weapons, flashing emergency lights, an escape pathway blocked by multiple officers, any questions that are answered are likely to be viewed as voluntary statements.

    Per the Court: "...when the officer, by means of physical force or show of authority, terminates or restrains his freedom of movement.” Brendlin v. California (2007) __ U.S. __ [2007 WL 1730143].
    Yup. And they only think that the 4th amendment really only applies to your sub-sub-basement.

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    I remember the good old days 20 years ago.... I was in a bar parking lot between 1 and 2 am (probably) sitting in the driver's seat and had just tossed my alcohol laden stomach contents outside the driver's side door when an officer came up and rapped on the window. I rolled it down and he said, "Everything OK here?" I replied, "Yeah, I'm just going to wait here a while." He said, "Ok, make it a long while before you go anywhere, OK?" I said, "Will do." and that was that.

    Nowdays I've heard of people getting tickets for going out to their car with keys in their hands to retrieve cigarettes with no intention to drive while under the influence.
    It use to be key in the ignition. Now it's "Constructive Possession." Just having the key in your possession or in your control is constructive possession of the motor vehicle.

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    Regular Member Resto Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by color of law View Post
    It use to be key in the ignition. Now it's "Constructive Possession." Just having the key in your possession or in your control is constructive possession of the motor vehicle.
    What a load of crap! What is next, "knowing where your keys are while seated in your home and having a drink"?

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    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    .......to retrieve cigarettes .......
    Straight to PRISON for owning those!!!!! Let alone Smoking them!!!!
    (Dope is cool though, occifer).
    “Men live without other security than what their own strength and their own invention shall furnish them"
    -Thomas Hobbes 1651

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Yup. And they only think that the 4th amendment really only applies to your sub-sub-basement.
    Ironic, considering that's where Amanda Berry and friends spent the better part of a decade.

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    It was the correct ruling, for the wrong reason.

    The issue at hand was whether or not he was "seized", and obliged to interact, or whether he was free to leave. The court's ruling was the only thing that made the DWI evidence admissible

    If he had actually driven away, or attempted to, and the officer claimed fear for his life before shooting the driver, I don't for one second believe the court would have ruled the driver was free to leave the the officer should have simply stepped aside.

  18. #18
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Does it take getting shot by a cop to be adjudicated as to have been seized?
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    If he had actually driven away, or attempted to, and the officer claimed fear for his life before shooting the driver, I don't for one second believe the court would have ruled the driver was free to leave the the officer should have simply stepped aside.
    I fear you may be correct.

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    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    My comment stands alone. Inability to see the reality of the situation as it stands today is on you.

    Let's get down to what you're really saying: "Don't rock the boat! I'm afraid to stand up for my rights!" Your breed is why all but the politically connected and financially elite in California and New England are disarmed. Way to go. Your generation screwed up big time. You took the bait (drugs) and got high while the entire nation was stripped of our civil rights. While you were tripping they were gutting the Bill of Rights. You railed on and on about "the establishment" or "commies" while voting for them. Talk about indoctrination...

    Don't preach to me about what you think will happen. Your generation freely gave up those rights and refused to stand up for what is just and now ours is taking them back. So sit on the sideline where you've been your whole life and watch us whippersnappers take back what you gave up in exchange for drugs. They say a mind is a terrible thing to waste and your generation is living proof.

  21. #21
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Does it take getting shot by a cop to be adjudicated as to have been seized?

    Must be a scary world you live in. Mine? I see it and people for what they are. Most are soft, some are loud and a small percentage actually take action. Many cops are no different than bullies. They resort to threats, whether it's words or pulling a weapon on those unaffected by words, and rarely ever follow through on threats. Most cops who draw on a violent suspect never fire. They freeze up and the guy simply leaves. Other cops arrive later and attack in a large group. Bullies. That's it.

    My first experience with a police officer ever was having a gun shoved in my mouth for picking up coal along the railroad tracks. Big man pulling a gun on a 7 year old. I've had a cop drive by and point a gun at me and my girlfriend over fighting a traffic ticket. I've had a cop sit outside my apartment every day for 3 months and block my vehicle for testifying that I saw him yank a teenage girl around by her hair for 4 minutes after he handcuffed her. I've had a bailiff attempt to assault me in the Eau Claire County courthouse in a hallway with no cameras and dropped him even though I was handcuffed. No charges there. I've had guns pointed at me for OC. I've had cops force their way into my home to threaten my girlfriend over charges they brought being thrown out. I've had an assistant chief threaten to kill my newborn baby over my turning him and another officer in for pointing guns at me and my girlfriend. I've had a deputy threaten to kill me and then try to run me over for open carry during deer season. I've had a police chief threaten to shoot me on sight if I held an OC walk and that was all talk. I've had cops neither detain nor arrest me and lock me in the jail overnight and then follow me home in their cars during a 100 degree day after stealing my shoes and socks. I've had a deputy threaten to shoot me if I reached for my wallet while OCing.

    Do you think I'm afraid of some cop's bruised ego? I don't have consensual conversations with cops, even when they're off duty.

    Except for Primus. :P

  22. #22
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wimwag View Post
    Let's get down to what you're really saying: ....
    No, this is what you are saying.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  23. #23
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wimwag View Post
    Must be a scary world you live in. Mine? I see it and people for what they are. ...
    You see people as you want to see them, and it is likely that the adverse reactions listed are more of your own making than the antics of thug cops.

    "Scary world"...too funny.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  24. #24
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    No, this is what you are saying.

    I call it for what it is.

  25. #25
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    You see people as you want to see them, and it is likely that the adverse reactions listed are more of your own making than the antics of thug cops.

    "Scary world"...too funny.

    Explain to me the rationale of pointing a gun at someone from a moving vehicle and then just driving off afterwards. Must not have been doing enough to warrant the cop to stop.

    Big oops moment for Mike Mason anyways. Next time we met was two years ago in Rice Lake. He was one of the officers that suddenly retired after the passing of Act 35. The sight of armed citizens terrifies would be tyrants like him. He got even fatter which I didn't think was possible. Must be almost 500 lbs. Couldn't be a threat to anyone except for with that gun and the badge to cover up his wrongdoing. Now he's got neither.

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