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Thread: Open Carry win in Swissvalle

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    Open Carry win in Swissvalle

    Went grocery shopping at the Giant Eagle in Swissvalle Pa the other day and I was stopped by the store security/Pa constable. He told me that the store owner's/manager did not allow firearms. (this was not a corporate store) He said I could put it in my car and continue shopping. I declined and said it could be stolen. He said I could conceal it and continue. I then said you said I could not be there period with a firearm concealed or open. He got confused and said that I can stay if I cover it. I shopped and left. I contacted the home office and the store manager and was informed there was no such policy. The store manager informed me he would inform the security/constable that they had no such policy and I was welcome to shop there.

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    was he a constable ?

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    constable

    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    was he a constable ?
    That is what his uniform patches said and his badge said. Still do not know exactly what a constable is. But he was acting as store security. I watched him punch out at the time clock as I was leaving.

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    Regular Member david.ross's Avatar
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    A constable acting in such a manner is concerning, though at least he didn't do anything extremely stupid. I'm very familiar with the constable program in Pennsylvania. Don't take this one encounter as a base for all constables. Most constables in the state of Pennsylvania are every day people who work a full time job. Many constables serve bench warrants for district magistrates for people who evade court(speeding violations, summary offenses, etc). Many constables don't arrest a person straight up, they're swell people by going to the person, explaining the situation and getting them to pay or call in to schedule a court date.

    A little info on Constables, they're peace officers who were there before cities had LEOs. They were there to serve the public and the courts. If anything, those are the people who are truly supposed to be there "to serve and protect."
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    Regular Member Maverick9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Birdman View Post
    Went grocery shopping at the Giant Eagle in Swissvalle Pa the other day and I was stopped by the store security/Pa constable. He told me that the store owner's/manager did not allow firearms. (this was not a corporate store) He said I could put it in my car and continue shopping. I declined and said it could be stolen. He said I could conceal it and continue. I then said you said I could not be there period with a firearm concealed or open. He got confused and said that I can stay if I cover it. I shopped and left. I contacted the home office and the store manager and was informed there was no such policy. The store manager informed me he would inform the security/constable that they had no such policy and I was welcome to shop there.
    This is good, but I think a better initial conversation should have gone like this:

    Store security: "Sir, the Store's manager did not allow..."
    You: "Sir, go get the manager. I'll be in aisle 7 getting some salsa..."
    SS: "Sir..."
    You: "Sir, I do not consent to an encounter with you. Store security, as you know can not detain people, I'll be waiting in aisle 7 for the manager"
    SS: "Sir..."
    You: "If you keep harassing me, I'm calling 911..."
    SS: Wanders off.

    You see there is no need for you to consent for him to speak to you, since you were not doing anything illegal, he can't detain you (maybe mention kidnapping...lol)

    Then you finish shopping and call the company, and tell them they'd better educate their security, because next time he tries to stop you, puts his hand on you, you'll be filing suit. Now, this guy does not sound malicious, so you don't want him fired, just want him to do his job.

    You didn't say if in his capacity as SS, he was armed, or if he had the usual Walkie-Talkie, flashlight, maybe pepper spray? If he was armed, you could probably turn the tables on him 'The manager told me he was planning on not allowing SS to carry a firearm, starting tomorrow, did you know that?'

    Good thread.

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    The Giant Eagle in Northern Cambria (formerly Barnesboro), Cambria County, is also a franchise operation and the owner has "No Weapons" signs posted at both entrances. Nope, Cliff (the owner) isn't about to change his mind; apparently he's had one too many customers drop their handguns on the floor (how?) while shopping. So, so as to not upset anyone inside, I don't open carry while shopping there.

    The franchise-operated BiLo just down the road, however, has no problem at all with me OCing.

    Oh, uniformed store security? That must be a Big City thing. We don't have any of that out here in the hinterlands.

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    Regular Member fjpro2a's Avatar
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    Have you gone bacK?

    Mr. Birdman,
    Have you gone back since 8/17 to this store? If so, have you seen the "constable," and has he apologized? I am not an expert in any way, but always felt that follow up is important.

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    Swissvalle

    Quote Originally Posted by fjpro2a View Post
    Mr. Birdman,
    Have you gone back since 8/17 to this store? If so, have you seen the "constable," and has he apologized? I am not an expert in any way, but always felt that follow up is important.
    I have been very busy and have not really had the time to go there. I am planning on going back next week if time allows. I have seen other uniformed security there. I think the other person I saw was a Swissvalle police officer. I was open carrying at that day and he did not say a word to me. Maybe it was because I was carrying my little Ruger LCR, and he did not see it. The other time I was carrying my full size glock 22.

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    constable

    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick9 View Post
    This is good, but I think a better initial conversation should have gone like this:

    Store security: "Sir, the Store's manager did not allow..."
    You: "Sir, go get the manager. I'll be in aisle 7 getting some salsa..."
    SS: "Sir..."
    You: "Sir, I do not consent to an encounter with you. Store security, as you know can not detain people, I'll be waiting in aisle 7 for the manager"
    SS: "Sir..."
    You: "If you keep harassing me, I'm calling 911..."
    SS: Wanders off.

    You see there is no need for you to consent for him to speak to you, since you were not doing anything illegal, he can't detain you (maybe mention kidnapping...lol)

    Then you finish shopping and call the company, and tell them they'd better educate their security, because next time he tries to stop you, puts his hand on you, you'll be filing suit. Now, this guy does not sound malicious, so you don't want him fired, just want him to do his job.

    You didn't say if in his capacity as SS, he was armed, or if he had the usual Walkie-Talkie, flashlight, maybe pepper spray? If he was armed, you could probably turn the tables on him 'The manager told me he was planning on not allowing SS to carry a firearm, starting tomorrow, did you know that?'

    Good thread.

    He was in full constable uniform. Tazzer, handcuffs. baton radio. badge. the whole 9 yards. I would have recorded the encounter but I was not sure if recording a constable/store security guard would be legal.

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    Regular Member cjohnson44546's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick9 View Post
    This is good, but I think a better initial conversation should have gone like this:

    Store security: "Sir, the Store's manager did not allow..."
    You: "Sir, go get the manager. I'll be in aisle 7 getting some salsa..."
    SS: "Sir..."
    You: "Sir, I do not consent to an encounter with you. Store security, as you know can not detain people, I'll be waiting in aisle 7 for the manager"
    SS: "Sir..."
    You: "If you keep harassing me, I'm calling 911..."
    SS: Wanders off.

    You see there is no need for you to consent for him to speak to you, since you were not doing anything illegal, he can't detain you (maybe mention kidnapping...lol)

    Then you finish shopping and call the company, and tell them they'd better educate their security, because next time he tries to stop you, puts his hand on you, you'll be filing suit. Now, this guy does not sound malicious, so you don't want him fired, just want him to do his job.

    You didn't say if in his capacity as SS, he was armed, or if he had the usual Walkie-Talkie, flashlight, maybe pepper spray? If he was armed, you could probably turn the tables on him 'The manager told me he was planning on not allowing SS to carry a firearm, starting tomorrow, did you know that?'

    Good thread.
    and as your walking off, he says "you must leave the store" ... and you keep going over to aisle 7... you'd most likely be arrested for trespassing. Does he have the authority to tell you to leave? who knows... but you'd probably be arrested anyways, even if the charges were dismissed later.

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