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Thread: VCDL says the "H" word

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    VCDL says the "H" word

    There is hope after all "

    There is currently an onerous noise ordinance being proposed by Culpeper County.

    In a nutshell the ordinance:

    * makes it unlawful to generate a loud noise after 6 PM. That is NOT a type-o! 6 PM. SIX PM.

    * makes it a serious Class 2 misdemeanor, with fines of up to $1,000 and no first-time warning, instead of a civil fine with a first-time warning.

    THE GOOD NEWS IS THAT SHOOTING AND HUNTING ARE EXEMPTED **CURRENTLY**.

    The onerous parts of that ordinance are not really in VCDL’s bailiwick since shooting and hunting are exempted. BUT, if the hunting/shooting exemptions are removed, it would be disastrous for gun owners. Hunt or shoot after 6 PM and get arrested, a criminal record, and fined. We are going to hedge our bets by also asking the hours be extended to at least 9 PM and that it remains a Class 4 misdemeanor, with only a warning required for a first offense.

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    :shocking:

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Impeach/recall the entire county board. A county noise ordinance??? REALLY!!! Ya know, 4 AM is after 6 PM.

    How about a linky to the proposed ordinance.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Impeach/recall the entire county board. A county noise ordinance??? REALLY!!! Ya know, 4 AM is after 6 PM.

    How about a linky to the proposed ordinance.
    Sussex County tried the same stunt earlier this year in an attempt to bypass the Sunday Hunting law. I videoed that. Finally, they dropped the idea after they ignored numerous FOIA's from me and and caught flak from some prominent landowners.

    In the meantime, VCDL was taking the Sheriff and Clerk to task for illegal CHP requirements.....and protesting the shooting aspect of the Noise proposal. They stayed out of the hunting part though.

    I'm seeing VCDL make "Baby Steps" toward representing all gun owners. That's a good thing!

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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    In the meantime, VCDL was taking the Sheriff and Clerk to task for illegal CHP requirements.....and protesting the shooting aspect of the Noise proposal. They stayed out of the hunting part though.

    <snip>
    I love "pro-gun" organizations that discuss issues with "permission slips" .. they should be arguing that these are not needed at all.

    When "pro-gun" groups start talking about "illegal permit requirements" they are saying that they actually approve of a permitting processes and that permission slips are needed in the first place.

    They [not VCDL specifically] should tell people "we think that permits cannot be required" .. but hardly any actually do. Why? Because they want $$$ and its best for their pocketbook.

    What they [again, not VCDL specifically] should be telling people is not to convict anyone of any gun crime as all laws in respect to guns are an infringement. But again, this not a "popular" thing to say and they are worried about being deemed "nuts".

    I have not seen any gun law that passes muster.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    There is hope after all "


    Forwarded comments from Friends of Kirby Burch:

    Stand by and rest a spell, someone will be there to help you shortly.

    Meanwhile, can you reach your lighter from there?
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Bring out the pitch forks and torches!!!

    I own land, 1000+ acres to be accurate-ish. Some citified nitwit moves out to the stick, builds his MacMansion country estate and hears me fire up the cotton picker at 4 AM, then calls the cops due to the noise?!? Trimming trees till sundown "after 6 PM" and Mr. MacMansion Country Squire calls the cops due to the noise?!?

    Just thinking about this proposed nitwit county ordinance really ticks me off!!! But, I shouldn't be surprised since the city is coming to the country these days. Any cop that would enforce this ordinance, if enacted, should be publicly shamed. Especially a county deputy.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    I live in the Town of Culpeper and I have sent an email to my County representative. If I didn't have to work on the 2nd, I would go to the meeting and protest.

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    Regular Member SouthernBoy's Avatar
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    I'm betting this is a result of Culpeper being "discovered" by more urbanized dwellers. They had a similar problem several years ago when new interlopers from the aforementioned areas discovered that people in Culpeper actually went outside their homes and shot guns. Horrors, we can't have that! Think of the children. So they tried to get the town to issue an ordinance (or some facsimile thereof) to outlaw this uncivlized behavior, never minding the fact that folks in that part of Virginia had been doing this for generations.

    Nice way to ingratiate oneself with the local gentry.
    In the final seconds of your life, just before your killer is about to dispatch you to that great eternal darkness, what would you rather have in your hand? A cell phone or a gun?

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Has anybody got a link to the proposed stupidity ordinance? I'd like to see how they define and intend to measure a "loud" noise.

    Without an objective measurement standard and an objective measurement at the time of alleged violation, they will be busy trying to wet the top of a vertical rope.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Regular Member scouser's Avatar
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    August 27 2014 ....

    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I love "pro-gun" organizations that discuss issues with "permission slips" .. they should be arguing that these are not needed at all.

    When "pro-gun" groups start talking about "illegal permit requirements" they are saying that they actually approve of a permitting processes and that permission slips are needed in the first place.

    They [not VCDL specifically] should tell people "we think that permits cannot be required" .. but hardly any actually do. Why? Because they want $$$ and its best for their pocketbook.

    What they [again, not VCDL specifically] should be telling people is not to convict anyone of any gun crime as all laws in respect to guns are an infringement. But again, this not a "popular" thing to say and they are worried about being deemed "nuts".

    I have not seen any gun law that passes muster.
    ... remember the date, I agree with mcbeth

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Has anybody got a link to the proposed stupidity ordinance? I'd like to see how they define and intend to measure a "loud" noise.

    Without an objective measurement standard and an objective measurement at the time of alleged violation, they will be busy trying to wet the top of a vertical rope.

    stay safe.

    Try this:
    Attached Files Attached Files

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    Quote Originally Posted by scouser View Post
    ... remember the date, I agree with mcbeth
    LOL Even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally. Don't look for it to happen again any time soon.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Culpeper Amended-Noise-Ordinance.txt
    Aha! Got it.

    Objective, measurable criteria OR some whiney induhvidual's statement that their ears and/or feelings were hurt.

    Will the police be issuing citations to those thumpa-thumpa rolling sub-woofers?

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Bring out the pitch forks and torches!!!

    I own land, 1000+ acres to be accurate-ish. Some citified nitwit moves out to the stick, builds his MacMansion country estate and hears me fire up the cotton picker at 4 AM, then calls the cops due to the noise?!? Trimming trees till sundown "after 6 PM" and Mr. MacMansion Country Squire calls the cops due to the noise?!?

    Just thinking about this proposed nitwit county ordinance really ticks me off!!! But, I shouldn't be surprised since the city is coming to the country these days. Any cop that would enforce this ordinance, if enacted, should be publicly shamed. Especially a county deputy.
    I lived in a place with no cops, no noise ordinances and on 1/3rd ac. lots. Oddly enough, if someone had an issue with noise, they would walk up and talk to me or visa versa. If someone is ill and needs extra consideration, people usually do the right thing...if its just complaining about noise at 6pm, they would not even bother to complain (they know its BS)

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Whomever writes the ordinances for Culpeper needs to learn how to use speel cheeker and/or a dictionary.

    Inoperable vehicles, sewerage, and noise intermixed w/o rhyme or reason.....what a disaster.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I lived in a place with no cops, no noise ordinances and on 1/3rd ac. lots. Oddly enough, if someone had an issue with noise, they would walk up and talk to me or visa versa. If someone is ill and needs extra consideration, people usually do the right thing...if its just complaining about noise at 6pm, they would not even bother to complain (they know its BS)
    david -

    Are those the "no cops" that you regularly serve with trespass notices?

    I did notice that the noise of a human voice - regardless of the inanity of the words - is not targeted, so you would have nothing to fear when you come down here for a visit.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    david -

    Are those the "no cops" that you regularly serve with trespass notices?

    I did notice that the noise of a human voice - regardless of the inanity of the words - is not targeted, so you would have nothing to fear when you come down here for a visit.

    stay safe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    david -

    Are those the "no cops" that you regularly serve with trespass notices?

    I did notice that the noise of a human voice - regardless of the inanity of the words - is not targeted, so you would have nothing to fear when you come down here for a visit.

    stay safe.
    Seems the operable phrase in his post was "lived in". This indicates a situation that occurred in the past. I don't follow mcbeth enough to know about his comings and goings though.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    Classic understated Nap response. That picture is worth a thousand words.......squared.

    Only problem that I see, Peter, is that you did not supply a stamped return envelope for his reply
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    abuse of county power!

    Oh, yeah, another example of abuse of our Liberties by county zoning nazis, drunk on power, and leading so-called county supervisros around by the nose on one issue or the other. These supervisors are presented these ordinances by zoning officials, who have careers invested in doing such things TO the People, and the part-time supes who are neither lawyers nor knowledgeable about the Constitution are too intimidated by these "professional" planners to speak against their initiatives on the monthly agendas. Every month it is one more assault against our American dream after another!

    My own example, you may remember here on OCDO, is how my Virginia county threatened me with legal action if I did not cease any camping on my own farm (86 acres) with a single camper! Even one day/night is prohibited! Tents are also prohibited, unless I agreed to apply for for and be granted a "campground permit" by the county, for a $1,350 fee, plus whatever upgrades they might require! Fortunately for me and my family including 3 boys, the Rutherford Institute of Charlottesville has taken my case and is defending our Liberty on this issue! We go to court September 23! We could use any support that day in Suffolk! Pray for Liberty to prevail!
    Last edited by Old Virginia Joe; 08-29-2014 at 12:57 PM.
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Virginia Joe View Post
    Oh, yeah, another example of abuse of our Liberties by county zoning nazis, drunk on power, and leading so-called county supervisros around by the nose on one issue or the other. These supervisors are presented these ordinances by zoning officials, who have careers invested in doing such things TO the People, and the part-time supes who are neither lawyers nor knowledgeable about the Constitution are too intimidated by these "professional" planners to speak against their initiatives on the monthly agendas. Every month it is one more assault against our American dream after another!

    My own example, you may remember here on OCDO, is how my Virginia county threatened me with legal action if I did not cease any camping on my own farm (86 acres) with a single camper! Even one day/night is prohibited! Tents are also prohibited, unless I agreed to apply for for and be granted a "campground permit" by the county, for a $1,350 fee, plus whatever upgrades they might require! Fortunately for me and my family including 3 boys, the Rutherford Institute of Charlottesville has taken my case and is defending our Liberty on this issue! We go to court September 23! We could use any support that day in Suffolk! Pray for Liberty to prevail!
    Had no idea that the county had actually charged you.

    IMO it is absurd to restrict such limited use, especially on rural property.

    Suggest that you start a separate thread with details on the charge and where/when the hearing - post here too and link to the new thread.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Virginia Joe View Post
    Oh, yeah, another example of abuse of our Liberties by county zoning nazis, drunk on power, and leading so-called county supervisros around by the nose on one issue or the other. These supervisors are presented these ordinances by zoning officials, who have careers invested in doing such things TO the People, and the part-time supes who are neither lawyers nor knowledgeable about the Constitution are too intimidated by these "professional" planners to speak against their initiatives on the monthly agendas. Every month it is one more assault against our American dream after another!

    My own example, you may remember here on OCDO, is how my Virginia county threatened me with legal action if I did not cease any camping on my own farm (86 acres) with a single camper! Even one day/night is prohibited! Tents are also prohibited, unless I agreed to apply for for and be granted a "campground permit" by the county, for a $1,350 fee, plus whatever upgrades they might require! Fortunately for me and my family including 3 boys, the Rutherford Institute of Charlottesville has taken my case and is defending our Liberty on this issue! We go to court September 23! We could use any support that day in Suffolk! Pray for Liberty to prevail!
    That's good news Joe!
    I'll try to make it to the trial.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    carpooling from Richmond to Suffolk General District Court 9/23

    I have 2 seats open in the Gimpmobile.

    Of all the times I have ferried Grapeshot around, I have not killed him - yet.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  25. #25
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    I have 2 seats open in the Gimpmobile.

    Of all the times I have ferried Grapeshot around, I have not killed him - yet.

    stay safe.
    That's because you want me to hear the end of your story.

    Putting my bid in for SG.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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