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Thread: It's this kind of hubris that got us kicked out of Starbucks

  1. #1
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    It's this kind of hubris that got us kicked out of Starbucks

    And it's still going on . . . they asked not to be involved politically, but we couldn't leave it alone. We had to shove it down their throats and co-opt their image. Great job guys . . .

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    Regular Member Maverick9's Avatar
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    That's not hubris, it's Style!

    SB should pay that guy.

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    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    I've seen the shirts.

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    Just a thought, but I believe that image was around a long time before Starbucks "asked"* that people no longer carry guns openly in their stores.

    *
    For these reasons, today we are respectfully requesting that customers no longer bring firearms into our stores or outdoor seating areas—even in states where “open carry” is permitted—unless they are authorized law enforcement personnel.

    I would like to clarify two points. First, this is a request and not an outright ban. Why? Because we want to give responsible gun owners the chance to respect our request—and also because enforcing a ban would potentially require our partners to confront armed customers, and that is not a role I am comfortable asking Starbucks partners to take on. Second, we know we cannot satisfy everyone. For those who oppose “open carry,” we believe the legislative and policy-making process is the proper arena for this debate, not our stores. For those who champion “open carry,” please respect that Starbucks stores are places where everyone should feel relaxed and comfortable. The presence of a weapon in our stores is unsettling and upsetting for many of our customers.
    http://www.starbucks.com/blog/an-ope...e-company/1268

    From the sounds of the letter, it was not only pro-gun people but also anti-gun people trying to drag SB into the mix and they didn't like it. But the open carry events probably weighed more heavily in the decision to "ask" people to stop open carry in the stores. Interesting there is nothing about concealed carry, another one of those if I can't see it, it must not be happening moments I guess.

    bob

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    Just a thought, but I believe that image was around a long time before Starbucks "asked"* that people no longer carry guns openly in their stores.


    Yeah. That's my point. In my opinion, that image and it's marketing played a large roll in Starbucks' final decision. Those responsible (like the guy in the jeep) should be held to account.
    Last edited by deanf; 08-30-2014 at 07:20 PM.

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    In this video, Starbucks is the cat, and the guy in the jeep and his ilk are the overbearing cock.


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    Every one is entitled to their opinion. In my opinion, that image had little to nothing to do with that decision by SB. It was driven by the increasing "Starbucks Appreciation Days" where both pro and anti gunners started getting nasty with each other. As soon as it began to look like SB was taking a side, i.e. the appreciation days, they were forced into making the announcement. The co-opting of their image had little to do with it or else they would have been filing cease and desist orders as soon as it became public. Who knows, maybe in a way they looked at it as free advertising within a community that they could not openly advertise toward.

    bob

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobR View Post
    Every one is entitled to their opinion. In my opinion, that image had little to nothing to do with that decision by SB. It was driven by the increasing "Starbucks Appreciation Days" where both pro and anti gunners started getting nasty with each other. As soon as it began to look like SB was taking a side, i.e. the appreciation days, they were forced into making the announcement. The co-opting of their image had little to do with it or else they would have been filing cease and desist orders as soon as it became public. Who knows, maybe in a way they looked at it as free advertising within a community that they could not openly advertise toward.

    bob
    +1

    Especially considering the image was adopted from an image the anti's had created first.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    I've never cared for Starbucks, nor the gunsncoffee parody, but my woman has that bumper sticker and a t-shirt. And she wants an od green sweatshirt from Outdoor Emporium... Which I'm probably buying her tomorrow. What's amattah, wanna fightuh bout it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BobR View Post
    Every one is entitled to their opinion. In my opinion, that image had little to nothing to do with that decision by SB. It was driven by the increasing "Starbucks Appreciation Days" where both pro and anti gunners started getting nasty with each other. As soon as it began to look like SB was taking a side, i.e. the appreciation days, they were forced into making the announcement. The co-opting of their image had little to do with it or else they would have been filing cease and desist orders as soon as it became public. Who knows, maybe in a way they looked at it as free advertising within a community that they could not openly advertise toward.

    bob

    Things were not helped by the fellows who showed up carrying ARs. I don't recall anybody raising a fuss about some guys wearing sidearms. I know the media attention was on the long guns. That's what the television cameras zoomed in on.

    But why discuss history?

    The I love guns and coffee logo has been around for a while, though I haven't seen it before on a spare tire cover.

    Remember, carrying a firearm is about personal protection. If you want to make a political statement, rent a billboard.

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    Activist Member golddigger14s's Avatar
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    Something that might be of interest to see the real story about what happened at Chipotles, and other places:
    https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/ope...0-%20Pros%20(1
    "The beauty of the Second Amenment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." Thomas Jefferson
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    I don't think the image (nor sidearms) were pivotal in Starbuck's forced decision at that time.

    But I am surprised that someone would choose to still purposely flaunt that symbol after Starbuck's change in policy.

    But this is the Internet, so that might be a very old picture, from the image's heyday.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    I don't even think that SBs has regular coffee .... never had one of theirs .. just what I heard

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    But this is the Internet, so that might be a very old picture, from the image's heyday.


    No, it's from today.

    But why discuss history?



    To learn.

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    Regular Member ()pen(arry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    And it's still going on . . . they asked not to be involved politically, but we couldn't leave it alone. We had to shove it down their throats and co-opt their image. Great job guys . . .
    Who is "we"? I had no part in the image you posted. I've never carried a long gun in Starbucks. What the **** are you on about?

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    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ()pen(arry View Post
    Who is "we"? I had no part in the image you posted. I've never carried a long gun in Starbucks. What the **** are you on about?

    I haven't either. But I will if I feel like it. Know why? Because it's my right and I can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wimwag View Post
    I haven't either. But I will if I feel like it. Know why? Because it's my right and I can.

    Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

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    Regular Member Bill45's Avatar
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    I would think that Starbucks could sue big time over mis-use of their logo. Copywrite infringement or some such thing. A million doller lawsuit changes mind quick.

    The license plate is ledgable, so finding the owner is not a problem for a lawfirm or anyone willing to fill out the proper form to get the info.
    Last edited by Bill45; 08-31-2014 at 11:10 AM.

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    Regular Member Ajetpilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.
    But...


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    Activist Member golddigger14s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.
    I can't believe you said that. Your statement sounds like it came straight from one of those people that says we should CC only. Will I carry a long gun? No, but I won't because it's heavy and uncomfortable. I carried a rifle too long when I was in the Army.

    Starsucks can't be too upset by the guns n coffee thing. I'ts only been around for about five or six years.
    Last edited by golddigger14s; 08-31-2014 at 12:24 PM.
    "The beauty of the Second Amenment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." Thomas Jefferson
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.
    What is this? A bumper sticker contest?

    I'm sure someone told the Founding Fathers the same thing.

    Different circumstances? Of course. Which is why we need more than just bumper sticker logic.

    And yes, I'm sure we agree on the actual subject at hand. I just hate that defense and hate to see it promulgated by a smart and active person like yourself.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

    The day I take advice from Dave Workman is the day I let a dog bite me in the nuts.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wimwag View Post
    The day I take advice from Dave Workman is the day I let a dog bite me in the nuts.
    Dave does have some good thoughts at times.

    Will wait for the video of the dog biting you.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  24. #24
    Regular Member Ajetpilot's Avatar
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    Dave has never been a proponent of exercising our rights to the fullest. From 2-21-2010:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ajetpilot View Post
    I'm just an old country boy, Dave, so you're going to have to help me out with your line of thinking.

    I take it that you believe OC is fine 24/7 as some of us do (me included, except the Post Office).

    You also believe that having one's picture taken while OC is fine.

    However, you think that someone who OCs all day everyday should disarm, or conceal, before having his/her picture taken at a National Park.

    I don't get it. Why should I disarm (or cover up) before I allow my picture to be taken at a National Park while celebrating the removal of a firearm restriction that has been in place in one form or another since 1936?

    No disrespect intended, but I think that sounds a little hypocritical.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Workman View Post
    Ajetpilot wrote:


    You can think what you want.

    Look, this is going to be a brand new experience for a lot of people who really don't share your enthusiasm for OC, or having any kind of a gun under any circumstances, open or concealed, in a national park. That goes for park rangers as well as park visitors who have gone along with the predictions of rowdy armed yahoos prancing around their park with a frigging gun on. If you want to live DOWN to that preconceived stereotype, you go right ahead.

    There's a learning curve, and if you don't understand that, or simply refuse to understand it, then you're not half as smart as I thought you are, and don't give me that old country boy crap.

    This learning curve needs to be a gentle one for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is that you and only you and like-minded people, even me, are going to have to allow these people to get used to an idea that they absolutely abhor with every fiber. Jump the gun on this (no pun intended) and all you will do is confirm everything the Brady Bunch and retired park employees and FOP and all the other anti-gunners have been blathering about.

    We, and that means YOU, need to prove these people wrong. The way to do that doesn't include posing for pictures. Amlevin and Deep Diver get this, why don't you?

    It's your job to avoid becoming a bad example. You're there like everyone else to enjoy existing park attractions, not be one.

    There's no need to celebrate. That's just an excuse to get a slap-happy photo of yourself with a gun on your hip by a national park sign. What does it accomplish, really, other than to be able to say you did it?

    A lot of people worked their butts off for this, including me. Most of that work was done way behind the scenes, with no fanfare, no spotlight.

    The NRA and VCDL and CCRKBA and a lot of grassroots activists didn't invest all the effort just to give some people an ego stroke.
    I, and a lot of other OC folks, did have our pictures taken in National Parks on the first day the federal government allowed us to exercise our constitutionally guaranteed right, and despite Dave's dire predictions, there was no bad press. I continue to enjoy our National Parks while OC, and I continue to have my picture taken. In fact, I was in Olympic National Park last month. I have never had any problem with visitors or rangers.

    So, I am not very concerned with Dave's proclamations.

  25. #25
    Regular Member wimwag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajetpilot View Post
    Dave has never been a proponent of exercising our rights to the fullest. From 2-21-2010:





    I, and a lot of other OC folks, did have our pictures taken in National Parks on the first day the federal government allowed us to exercise our constitutionally guaranteed right, and despite Dave's dire predictions, there was no bad press. I continue to enjoy our National Parks while OC, and I continue to have my picture taken. In fact, I was in Olympic National Park last month. I have never had any problem with visitors or rangers.

    So, I am not very concerned with Dave's proclamations.


    Exactly my point. That and he's a permission slip pimp.

    Edit: Supporting the 2A only when it advances one's career is nothing but lip service. You cannot be pro gun part time.
    Last edited by wimwag; 08-31-2014 at 01:51 PM.

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