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Thread: VA OC activist targeted for camping violations on his own farm

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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    Angry VA OC activist targeted for camping violations on his own farm

    I have received moderator blessings to bring this to your attention. I previously mentioned on OCDO how Isle of Wight County came after me when I let a disabled hunting friend of mine from Norfolk park his camper on my 86 acre farm so he could spend the night when he came over an hour away to hunt two days in a row, instead of driving back and forth. You know, hunting early morns, and hunting til dusk and all that. Long days. He was a cancer survivor missing half a lung, had rheumatoid arthritis, and hepatitis, so he was pretty weak. Someone made a complaint that we had someone "living" in the camper. I showed the county evidence that was not true. The county threatened legal action against me if we did not cease using the camper for even a single night, UNLESS I applied for and was granted a county "campground permit," which costs $1,350, plus whatever improvements to the land they would require. I refused to pay, so we quit camping until I could get the ridiculous ordinance changed. I spoke with each county supervisor privately, and when faced with this situation, they each (except one) spoke sympathetically to me, encouraging me to bring it up through channels to the board, and they would revise the stupid ordinance. So, I went to 6 meetings of planning commission and board of supervisors over eight months, garnering media and citizen support along the way. After 8 months, they refused to even make a motion to change the ordinance! So, I contacted The Rutherford Institute out of Charlottesville, Va., to help. My reasonable use of my property was being denied. They agreed to take my case pro-bono! We go to court Sept 23 in Suffolk. The county response is that we have no standing to sue them, because I never paid for the permit! WTH?! They say I should have applied for the permit, and THAT would give me standing. TRI does not agree with this absurdity, but the county quotes a case they say provides precedent. We shall see. So, they hope to have it thrown out on 9-23. A citizen, they believe, has to allow his money to be taken for frivilous causes, before he can sue for relief. Meanwhile, my three elementary age sons and I are denied the rights to use our dearly paid for property in the all-American way. This same ordinance which prohibits camper trailers also prohibits even tents in the same sentence! When we began fighting the county and the local paper ridiculed the county for what they were doing, the county started grabbing straws, pointing out how the camper was hooked to utilities. They say that proved someone was living there. Big deal! The utilities were already there from when I had my own mobile home there, legally permitted, from many years before I built my house elsewhere on the farm. Why should I be denied to use my investment in infrastructure? The ordinance mentions nothing about use of utilities, so this is just a red-herring to distract from the fact that the ordinance prohibits ANY camping overnight in ANY fashion on my land, either me, or my friend. Incidentally, my friend just died Dec 20, when he fell and got dangled upside down in his deer tree-stand on our farm. He died being denied the use of his camper, which allowed him to rest when he needed to. You connect the dots. Anyway, we could use the support if anyone has the time to come that day. Thanks so much.
    There are many google references to my case, if you want to research this.
    VCDL, Army Vet, Virginia Native

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    "We must all hang together, or assuredly we will all hang separately."

    Barring a rise in the river, we'll see you there. (I'm guessing a 9 AM start time.)

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    http://news.oldva.org/?p=91155

    VA OC activist targeted for camping violations on his own farm



    Last year there was a tremendous battle in the General Assembly to pass Sunday Hunting. The reasons boiled down to one major item. PROPERTY OWNERS RIGHTS.
    We own the land, pay taxes which we shouldn’t have to and as long as what we’re doing doesn’t infringe on someone else’s rights, should be left alone.
    There are still a lot of Dragons to slay though, and this is a good one.
    I’ve known about this case for a while and the bottom line is it’s the result of County Nazi’s grubbing for more fee’s from property owners. It should make an interesting case.

    From the plaintiff’s internet postings.
    I have received moderator blessings to bring this to your attention. I previously mentioned on OCDO how Isle of Wight County came after me when I let a disabled hunting friend of mine from Norfolk park his camper on my 86 acre farm so he could spend the night when he came over an hour away to hunt two days in a row, instead of driving back and forth. You know, hunting early morns, and hunting til dusk and all that. Lon

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    Activist Member Wolf_shadow's Avatar
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    Hope to make it over. Off that day barring Mrs needing something.

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  5. #5
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    "We must all hang together, or assuredly we will all hang separately."

    Barring a rise in the river, we'll see you there. (I'm guessing a 9 AM start time.)

    stay safe.
    Co-pilot/shotgun seat requested.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Co-pilot/shotgun seat requested.
    Sorry, but no can do. I'm fresh out of long stories and do not anticipate having one on that date.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    "The county response is that we have no standing to sue them, because I never paid for the permit!"

    I bet if you had paid the permit fee their response would have been "Well, you paid for the permit, so you must have agreed with it." This is a load of crap and if I can make it, I will be there to support you. Otherwise, good luck and Godspeed.

  8. #8
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Sorry, but no can do. I'm fresh out of long stories and do not anticipate having one on that date.

    stay safe.
    That has never caused you pause before.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Well, standing is required. The OP should post the case citation (and link to it). And the ordinance...

    The question is: were you aggrieved by the opposing party. If so, then you have standing. If not, then you do not have standing.

    I think you were aggrieved myself but also acknowledge that there could be case law supports that you were not.

    If you lose and the case is tossed..its a big "Welkome to Amerika comrade!"

    Time to file a notice of trespass ! Keep them off your land. And serve one upon the noisy neighbor.

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    Regular Member ProShooter's Avatar
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    I would take the $1,350 and build an electrified fence to keep prying eyes off my property.

    A moat with gators and piranhas isn't a bad idea either.
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    Regular Member The Wolfhound's Avatar
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    I knew I felt a lurch in the force....

    Originally Posted by skidmark
    Sorry, but no can do. I'm fresh out of long stories and do not anticipate having one on that date.

    stay safe.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    That has never caused you pause before.
    The planet has just shifted on its axis!
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 09-05-2014 at 12:10 PM. Reason: Formatting
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    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
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    I don't know if this helps at all but this just hit the presses:


    U.S. court strikes down Los Angeles ban on living in cars-
    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...cision-appeals

    Not binding in VA I think, but could still be referenced for guidance if applicable? One of the persons arrested was living in an RV... I know it's a completely different wording of the law involved here, but I figured something may come from letting you know of it.
    Last edited by Baked on Grease; 09-10-2014 at 03:50 PM.
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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baked on Grease View Post
    I don't know if this helps at all but this just hit the presses:


    U.S. court strikes down Los Angeles ban on living in cars-
    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...cision-appeals

    Not binding in VA I think, but could still be referenced for guidance if applicable? One of the persons arrested was living in an RV... I know it's a completely different wording of the law involved here, but I figured something may come from letting you know of it.
    That's interesting! Thanks for thinking and addressing my situation. I will forward this on to my looyahs right now, in case there is some way we can use this. Every little bit helps!
    VCDL, Army Vet, Virginia Native

    Hey, Libtards, it's the "Bill of Rights," not the "Bill of Needs" . . . . .

    If the 2A does not apply to modern weapons, then the 1A does not apply to modern communications like the Internet! How do you like them apples!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baked on Grease View Post
    I don't know if this helps at all but this just hit the presses:


    U.S. court strikes down Los Angeles ban on living in cars-
    http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...cision-appeals

    Not binding in VA I think, but could still be referenced for guidance if applicable? One of the persons arrested was living in an RV... I know it's a completely different wording of the law involved here, but I figured something may come from letting you know of it.
    I actually lived in a car (a 1975 Olds Delta 88 -- it had a freaking basement! lol) for a period of 6-9 mos (the nice winter months of course). While I was a youth and had a choice to make : $$ for housing or $$ for schooling ... I choose schooling.

    So I know that a person sleeping an a car gets hassled a lot. You find a place to park and sleep for only a short period of time before they tell you to move along. Most cops were nice, others total dillweeds.

    I did not mind living in the car (I still took daily showers, etc) ... it was kinda nice, even when freezing. No telemarketers calling, saving cash ... nice.
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 09-11-2014 at 04:21 PM.

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    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I actually lived in a car (a 1975 Olds Delta 88 -- it had a freaking basement! lol) for a period of 6-9 mos (the nice winter months of course). While I was a youth and had a choice to make : $$ for housing or $$ for schooling ... I choose schooling.

    So I know that a person sleeping an a car gets hassled a lot. You find a place to park and sleep for only a short period of time before they tell you to move along. Most cops were nice, others total dillweeds.

    I did not mind living in the car (I still took daily showers, etc) ... it was kinda nice, even when freezing. No telemarketers calling, saving cash ... nice.
    I did the same for a time, fell on hard times and lived out of a 15 year old beatup car for a while (thankfully while single). Sometimes it really is the best choice considering someone's circumstances to do this for a short time to get back on their feet.
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

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    Regular Member twoskinsonemanns's Avatar
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    If it does get tossed I imagine you just go back to using the camper. Then if they do anything about it wouldn't that give a reason for a case?
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    Regular Member rightwinglibertarian's Avatar
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    OP I have shared this on my news page on three platforms. If I get the moderator go ahead I will post links. Rather wait than get inter trouble for advertising
    "Which part of shall not be infringed is so difficult to understand"?

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rightwinglibertarian View Post
    OP I have shared this on my news page on three platforms. If I get the moderator go ahead I will post links. Rather wait than get inter trouble for advertising
    You would not be advertising a product or service - posting cross links on a story of interest is fine.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member rightwinglibertarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    You would not be advertising a product or service - posting cross links on a story of interest is fine.
    well it is a service I guess but no more than a news aggregator. In any case here it is on

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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rightwinglibertarian View Post
    well it is a service I guess but no more than a news aggregator. In any case here it is on

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    VCDL, Army Vet, Virginia Native

    Hey, Libtards, it's the "Bill of Rights," not the "Bill of Needs" . . . . .

    If the 2A does not apply to modern weapons, then the 1A does not apply to modern communications like the Internet! How do you like them apples!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Virginia Joe View Post

    There are many google references to my case, if you want to research this.
    https://www.rutherford.org/publicati...r_landowners_r

    Citing the right of property owners to have a certain amount of sovereignty over what takes place on their own property, The Rutherford Institute has filed a lawsuit on behalf of a Virginia landowner who was prohibited from allowing a friend to camp on his 86-acre farm for a hunting excursion.



    http://www.cfact.org/2014/01/22/land...hunting-guest/

    In yet another example of a busy-body local government harassing a law-abiding citizen, officials in Isle of Wight County, Virginia are trying to prohibit a farmer from allowing a disabled friend to stay overnight on his property in an RV. The farmer wanted to give his friend and guest an opportunity to go hunting on his 86-acre farm.



    http://www.inquisitr.com/1110652/pro...-hunting-rule/

    Camping in your backyard with friends could be a thing of the past in Virginia. A property rights lawsuit began after Isle of Wight County officials was cited for operating an unauthorized campground on his farm. Joseph Ferguson was more than a little bit shocked when he faced legal penalties for allowing a pal for spend the night and go hunting on the property.

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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    one week and counting . . . . . .

    To keep you all informed who plan to go to the hearing, it is next week, Tuesday Sept 23, at 9:00 am, at the Suffolk Circuit Court room (even though it is filed in Isle of Wight County---a little confused as to why that is). A local attorney, backed by the Rutherford Institute will be representing me.
    VCDL, Army Vet, Virginia Native

    Hey, Libtards, it's the "Bill of Rights," not the "Bill of Needs" . . . . .

    If the 2A does not apply to modern weapons, then the 1A does not apply to modern communications like the Internet! How do you like them apples!?

  23. #23
    Founder's Club Member Hawkflyer's Avatar
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    First let me offer condolences on the loss of your friend.

    Why is it that nobody seems to listen when one of the frogs in the pot notices the temperature of the water is rising? As a Native Virginian I am embarrassed that ANY county in my state would pass a law prohibiting a person from camping on his own farm. I might understand if we were talking about a townhouse lot or even a 1/2 acre lot in a subdivision, but this case is ridiculous and serves to show just how bad things are getting.

    Best of luck with your fight
    Regards
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    Regular Member Old Virginia Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkflyer View Post
    First let me offer condolences on the loss of your friend.

    Why is it that nobody seems to listen when one of the frogs in the pot notices the temperature of the water is rising? As a Native Virginian I am embarrassed that ANY county in my state would pass a law prohibiting a person from camping on his own farm. I might understand if we were talking about a townhouse lot or even a 1/2 acre lot in a subdivision, but this case is ridiculous and serves to show just how bad things are getting.

    Best of luck with your fight
    Regards
    Thanks for the condolenses. He was a fine gentleman.

    These zoning employees have to "do something" TO us, to make a resume, so they can be promoted and have a career, so they email their buddies all over the country, saying "look what I did in my county!" Like a toddler pointing to his pile of poop on the floor, proudly! THIS is what we are dealing with here. These people need to be shut up! They work for us, but the elected officials are the novices, and the employees are the professionals here, and they tell the elected officials what to do and how they should vote to pass all this crap!
    VCDL, Army Vet, Virginia Native

    Hey, Libtards, it's the "Bill of Rights," not the "Bill of Needs" . . . . .

    If the 2A does not apply to modern weapons, then the 1A does not apply to modern communications like the Internet! How do you like them apples!?

  25. #25
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Why such a requirement exists? Follow the money. Believe it or not counties have very little income other than property taxes in most cases. Any burden they can place on citizens that generate revenue will be placed until the citizenry pushes back. What is disgusting is that a sheriff and his deputies would enforce such a edict.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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