Sprouts = gunbusters

Amigatec · Sep 20, 2014

twoskinsonemanns said:
For me it's about not giving them my business.

I find boycotts don't work, I'm only hurting myself. For every one that boycotts, there are 10 more that won't. MDA have tried that, it's not working for them either.

They can't be very serious about it, because the signs are hard to read.

twoskinsonemanns · Sep 20, 2014

Amigatec said:
I find boycotts don't work, I'm only hurting myself. For every one that boycotts, there are 10 more that won't. MDA have tried that, it's not working for them either.

They can't be very serious about it, because the signs are hard to read.

It's impossible for my boycott not to work. They are not receiving the profit they would have gotten from my purchase so it works. It certainly doesn't hurt me because there are 10 other companies that do not discriminate against armed citizens willing to sell me what I want.

KBCraig · Sep 20, 2014

Amigatec said:
There is nothing in the Constitution that gives them the right to infringe my rights. I have the same rights they do.

Yes you do, including the right to tell people they're not welcome on your property except under your terms.

It doesn't violate your rights when a property owner sets rules.

Let them try to post a sign that says "No Homosexuals Allowed" and see how far that goes.

The laws that prohibit discriminating against or refusing service to protected minority groups are anti-freedom.

Needless to say, I carried my gun in there just the day, I looked the sign, I deciced my rights are more important than there stupid sign.

No, you decided that your convenience was more important than their property rights. And, you gave anti-gunners your money.

Amigatec · Sep 20, 2014

KBCraig said:
Yes you do, including the right to tell people they're not welcome on your property except under your terms.

It doesn't violate your rights when a property owner sets rules.

The 2ad says "Shall not be infringed", nothing says except when somebody posts a sign. This is a GOD GIVEN right.

The laws that prohibit discriminating against or refusing service to protected minority groups are anti-freedom.

No, you decided that your convenience was more important than their property rights. And, you gave anti-gunners your money.

No I decided my 2AD rights shall NOT BE infringed. PERIOD!!!!!

What are they going to do call the cops??
Police: what's the problem?
SProust: We have a man with a gun.
Police: What's he doing?
Sprouts: Trying to buy some lettuce and onions.
Police: Does he have anything in his hand?
Sprouts: Yes he does.
Police: What does he have?
Sprouts: His Credit Card.

Police: Click and hangs up the phone.

Do you really think they are going to call the cops and have you escorted off the property?

Amigatec · Sep 20, 2014

twoskinsonemanns said:
It's impossible for my boycott not to work. They are not receiving the profit they would have gotten from my purchase so it works. It certainly doesn't hurt me because there are 10 other companies that do not discriminate against armed citizens willing to sell me what I want.

Do you really think the money you didn't spend in there is going to hurt them?

They aren't very serious about keeping the guns out, you have to really look to find the sign, they have posted no metal detectors at the doors, and have no cops running around the place. Because if they disarm me, are they going to disarm everybody that walks in the door?

These signs have the same force of law as a "No shirt, no shoes, no service" sign.

MKEgal · Sep 20, 2014

Amigatec said:
The 2ad (sic) says "Shall not be infringed", nothing says except when somebody posts a sign. This is a GOD GIVEN right.
... I decided my 2AD (sic) rights shall NOT BE infringed. PERIOD!!!!!

The Constitution prevents government agencies from infringing our rights.
Or at least, it's supposed to. They're very weak about protecting 2A rights.
It doesn't have any effect on private companies.
Unfortunately, the special protected groups do not yet include people exercising their 2A rights.

Do you really think they are going to call the cops and have you escorted off the property?

No, but if you get SWATted you could end up dead.
That appears to be what happened with the guy in Ohio, though he should have left the pellet gun in the box if he was planning to buy it, and should not have turned toward police with it in his hands.

Amigatec · Sep 20, 2014

I open carried into the Family Dollar for several months before I ever saw the gun buster sign, I have open carried in other places that were posted, and they never said a thing to me. If I present myself as a responsible gun owner there won't be any problems. The guy in Ohio was stupid you don't walk around with a gun, even a toy gun in Walmart. And the idiot that called the cops should be charged with murder.

Jordan6679 · Sep 20, 2014

I open carry in all 3 sprouts locations. An employee at the Bixby location once noticed and pointed out their sign, so I switched to the Harvard location where no sign is to be seen. I continue to carry full time. and shop at sprouts to get the killer deals on food. I carried into the new broken arrow location around 7pm last Thursday with no issue.

Glock 1st fan · Sep 21, 2014

Amigatec said:
I open carried into the Family Dollar for several months before I ever saw the gun buster sign, I have open carried in other places that were posted, and they never said a thing to me. If I present myself as a responsible gun owner there won't be any problems. The guy in Ohio was stupid you don't walk around with a gun, even a toy gun in Walmart. And the idiot that called the cops should be charged with murder.

I agree!

marshaul · Sep 21, 2014

KBCraig said:
Yes you do, including the right to tell people they're not welcome on your property except under your terms.

It doesn't violate your rights when a property owner sets rules.

The laws that prohibit discriminating against or refusing service to protected minority groups are anti-freedom.

No, you decided that your convenience was more important than their property rights. And, you gave anti-gunners your money.

+1

Amigatec said:
These signs have the same force of law as a "No shirt, no shoes, no service" sign.

So would you commit theft because nobody was watching?

You have no right to force yourself onto another's property contrary to his wishes. Period.

Only those with weak convictions (or, dare I say, weak morals) appeal to the force of law to justify behavior.

Now, it may be that those signs do not reflect the true wishes of the proprietor, but that is not what you argued.

twoskinsonemanns · Sep 21, 2014

Amigatec said:
The 2ad says "Shall not be infringed", nothing says except when somebody posts a sign. This is a GOD GIVEN right.

No I decided my 2AD rights shall NOT BE infringed. PERIOD!!!!!

What are they going to do call the cops??
Police: what's the problem?
SProust: We have a man with a gun.
Police: What's he doing?
Sprouts: Trying to buy some lettuce and onions.
Police: Does he have anything in his hand?
Sprouts: Yes he does.
Police: What does he have?
Sprouts: His Credit Card.

Police: Click and hangs up the phone.

Do you really think they are going to call the cops and have you escorted off the property?

It would got something like this:
Sprouts: Sir we have a no guns policy. Please leave the gun in your car or you cannot come in here.
You: Okay.

Amigatec said:
Do you really think the money you didn't spend in there is going to hurt them?

My goal isn't to hurt them. It's to prevent my hard earned money adding to their profit. It's works every time.

marshaul · Sep 21, 2014

twoskinsonemanns said:
My goal isn't to hurt them. It's to prevent my hard earned money adding to their profit. It's works every time.

Agreed. I might seeing the other side if were a big deal. But as it stands, most establishments are pleased to take our money.

It's not a "boycott", it's me choosing to reward business who welcome me with my limited supply of grocery dollars.

Amigatec · Sep 21, 2014

Again show me the Law where property rights trump the 2AD. What part of "Shall Not Be Infringed" do you NOT understand.

I'm waiting........................

Amigatec · Sep 21, 2014

marshaul said:
Agreed. I might seeing the other side if were a big deal. But as it stands, most establishments are pleased to take our money.

It's not a "boycott", it's me choosing to reward business who welcome me with my limited supply of grocery dollars.

If they were seroius about keeping guns out, there would post guards at the doors and have metal detectors. Instead they hide the signs so as to make it harder for people to see.
If they disarm me, they need to disarm EVERYBODY that walks in the door.

AFAIK the only private property in Tulsa that does this is the Day Center down town. They have guards, metal detectors and X-ray machines.

marshaul · Sep 21, 2014

Amigatec said:
Again show me the Law where property rights trump the 2AD. What part of "Shall Not Be Infringed" do you NOT understand.

I'm waiting........................

Your knowledge of the history and theory of rights, not to mention Constitutional law, is abysmal.

First of all, rights do not derive from the Constitution. Appeals to the Constitution are, therefore, of absolutely no relevance when discussing the existence or nature of rights.

The Bill of Rights is designed to limit government, not to grant you rights. It limits the government's ability to infringe on the second amendment. It doesn't say (or imply) a word about you having the right to force yourself onto private property.

Unless I missed it, and you can cite that part. I'm waiting........................

Amigatec · Sep 21, 2014

marshaul said:
Your knowledge of the history and theory of rights, not to mention Constitutional law, is abysmal.

First of all, rights do not derive from the Constitution. Appeals to the Constitution are, therefore, of absolutely no relevance when discussing the existence or nature of rights.

The Bill of Rights is designed to limit government, not to grant you rights. It limits the government's ability to infringe on the second amendment. It doesn't say (or imply) a word about you having the right to force yourself onto private property.

Unless I missed it, and you can cite that part. I'm waiting........................

You haven't quoted a damn thing, I asked you to show me the law where you can infringe my rights, you have failed to do that. You have just expressed your own opinion.

I'm still waiting.............

marshaul · Sep 21, 2014

Amigatec said:
You haven't quoted a damn thing, I asked you to show me the law where you can infringe my rights, you have failed to do that. You have just expressed your own opinion.

I'm still waiting.............

Are you 12?

The right to bear arms is not equivalent to the non-existent "right" to force your guns onto my property. You've already been called out for this willful conflation, now the onus is on you to cite the existence of (or justification for) your silly, imaginary "right".

Amigatec · Sep 21, 2014

My right is the US Constution.

As affirmed by the founding fathers, and upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States.

I'll ask you ONE MORE TIME show me where you or ANYONE else can infringe my rights??

Until you can don't bother replying to me.

Amigatec · Sep 21, 2014

I thought you told me I can't carry my gun into PRIVATE PROPERTY???

Here is the Law here in Oklahoma.

Notice PARKING LOTS ON PRIVATE PROPERTY CAN NOT BE MADE OFF LIMITS TO GUN!!!!!!

I have posted LAW here, I'm still waiting on you to prove me wrong!!!!

TITLE 21 § 1290.22. Business owner’s rights
BUSINESS OWNER’S RIGHTS
A. Except as provided in subsection B of this section, nothing contained in any provision of the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act, Section 1290.1 et seq. of this title, shall be construed to limit, restrict or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of any person, property owner, tenant, employer, or business entity to control the possession of weapons on any property owned or controlled by the person or business entity.
B. No person, property owner, tenant, employer, or business entity shall be permitted to establish any policy or rule that has the effect of prohibiting any person, except a convicted felon, from transporting and storing firearms in a locked vehicle on any property set aside for any vehicle.

marshaul · Sep 21, 2014

Amigatec said:
My right is the US Constution.

As affirmed by the founding fathers, and upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States.

I'll ask you ONE MORE TIME show me where you or ANYONE else can infringe my rights??

Until you can don't bother replying to me.

You seem to believe that rights come from government. They do not. They never have.

And you do not possess a right to force yourself onto my property.

You seem to think you can cite your way around the fact that the Bill of Rights limits government, and that it does not empower you. You cannot, for the weight of history (and jurisprudence, if that mattered) is on my side.

Sprouts = gunbusters

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