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Thread: Question about PA Laws

  1. #1
    Regular Member rscottie's Avatar
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    Question about PA Laws

    I am trying to find the answer to a question concerning PA. Quite simply, I was told that if someone broke in to your vehicle and stole your firearm that was secured in your vehicle, you would lose your LCTF.

    I cannot find anything in PA law that says you are legally responsible for the criminal acts of criminals.

    The only thing they have given me as proof is a link to a letter from Philadelphia from 2008. Here is that link.

    http://www.thecrimsonpirate.com/rtkb...ponreceipt.pdf

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    At least they let you know: a permit to carry is a privilege, not a right !

    So if you don't get a permit, is it a right then? lol

    If someone steals your car or firearm from your car, I do not see this as a reason for pulling a permit.

    Revocation.--A license to carry firearms may be revoked by the issuing authority for good cause. A license to carry firearms shall be revoked by the issuing authority for any reason stated in subsection (e)(1) which occurs during the term of the permit. Notice of revocation shall be in writing and shall state the specific reason for revocation. Notice shall be sent by certified mail to the individual whose license is revoked, and, at that time, notice shall also be provided to the Pennsylvania State Police by electronic means, including e-mail or facsimile transmission, that the license is no longer valid. An individual whose license is revoked shall surrender the license to the issuing authority within five days of receipt of the notice. An individual whose license is revoked may appeal to the court of common pleas for the judicial district in which the individual resides. An individual who violates this section commits a summary offense
    http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/...tn=9&subsctn=0

    Question is .. having a firearm stolen is "good cause" for revocation I guess.

    I would think that you should be able to leave a gun on your hood and expect people to follow the law and not steal it...but the law is crazy when it comes down to guns


    http://scholar.google.com/scholar_ca...en&as_sdt=4,39

    here's a case ^^ does not define "good cause" past a generalized idea. You can zip over and see the "how cited" cases and read...


    http://scholar.google.com/scholar_ca...42743022242#kq

    ^^ this one shows that the revocation processes for restoring the permit is an admin review by a court. ...noting: On appeal, Caba is entitled to challenge the Sheriff's factual findings. In the context of administrative law, courts review fact finding by the local agency to determine whether substantial evidence in the record supports the finding, not for an abuse of discretion.

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    Regular Member rscottie's Avatar
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    The reference that I linked to was from Philadelphia from 2008. I am trying to determine if it is actual law or if they are just saying this with no law giving the ability to do a revocation on someone that has a firearm stolen from their vehicle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rscottie View Post
    The reference that I linked to was from Philadelphia from 2008. I am trying to determine if it is actual law or if they are just saying this with no law giving the ability to do a revocation on someone that has a firearm stolen from their vehicle.
    You won't find any law that is specific to why a revocation will be justified from this specific query. But to note...courts will give some deference to the authority that takes the permit away unless it is solely a question of law. If the authority has routinely revoked permits for this reason, then this may be enough to sustain the revocation.

    I really did not rely upon your link for any of my postings.

    If you want to find out if there has ever been an instance in which an authority did revoke for the reason you are examining, get ready to do some legwork...

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    Regular Member rscottie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    You won't find any law that is specific to why a revocation will be justified from this specific query. But to note...courts will give some deference to the authority that takes the permit away unless it is solely a question of law. If the authority has routinely revoked permits for this reason, then this may be enough to sustain the revocation.

    I really did not rely upon your link for any of my postings.

    If you want to find out if there has ever been an instance in which an authority did revoke for the reason you are examining, get ready to do some legwork...
    I can't find anything based in the law that says if your gun is stolen from your vehicle, you automatically lose your LTCF.

    It appears that this is what the Police Commissioner is saying that he will do in Philadelphia. I am just trying to see from what law he would have that authority.

    I am not having much luck with Google.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rscottie View Post
    I can't find anything based in the law that says if your gun is stolen from your vehicle, you automatically lose your LTCF.

    It appears that this is what the Police Commissioner is saying that he will do in Philadelphia. I am just trying to see from what law he would have that authority.

    I am not having much luck with Google.
    Well, you can go to a local courthouse and search under the statue ... I would not think alot of google cases would have this. Maybe a lower court (google does not have lower courts usually, only appellate & supreme courts). The librarian might help.

    The commissioner likely has this authority under the law to make such a ruling (from statue that was linked in a previous post). If such a ruling would be correct is another issue...needing research.

    I don't think it would be myself.
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 09-22-2014 at 11:24 PM.

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