Is the life of a cop worth more than the life of a non-cop?

stealthyeliminator · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
...
And the baby got burned by ACCIDENT. I would never defend an intentional harming of a kid. Ever. They ASKED and were TOLD no kids present. No kids ever been there. Clearly that was a lie or a mistake on the part of the informant. So it was not malicious by any means on the cops. That's what I defended, it was not intentional. Period.
...

As is the case with firearm discharges, it was not accidental but negligent. The officer that made the toss is responsible for what happened.

Primus · Sep 23, 2014

stealthyeliminator said:
As is the case with firearm discharges, it was not accidental but negligent. The officer that made the toss is responsible for what happened.

I agree to an extent.

The ONLY reason I don't fully agree is because they DID investigate to see if kids were present. They were lied to.

If they DIDNT bother to ask/check then I'd agree they should be screwed.

stealthyeliminator · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
I agree to an extent.

The ONLY reason I don't fully agree is because they DID investigate to see if kids were present. They were lied to.

If they DIDNT bother to ask/check then I'd agree they should be screwed.

I'm not convinced that being provided misinformation morally justifies collateral damage.

Edit: I'm glad you seem to be looking at it with an open mind. Something for both of us to ponder, I suppose.

davidmcbeth · Sep 23, 2014

MSG Laigaie said:
Odd, My Military Training taught me the opposite. I served in both US Navy and US Army, being taught, and later teaching that Human life is sacrosanct. Life taking is important business and not to be taken lightly. May I ask, David, what Branch and country did you serve?

USAF ... my unit has killed a lot of people! I was overseas, my unit is stil functional and usually plays a role in most bombing campaigns in the EU/middle east/ russian/ and even Atlantic theater.

My squadron would not have been able to do its job if we gave any value to human life. Our job was to kill kill kill if called upon.

Primus · Sep 23, 2014

davidmcbeth said:
USAF ... my unit has killed a lot of people! I was overseas, my unit is stil functional and usually plays a role in most bombing campaigns in the EU/middle east/ russian/ and even Atlantic theater.

My squadron would not have been able to do its job if we gave any value to human life. Our job was to kill kill kill if called upon.

That's why you need a scope to shoot 200yds never carried a rifle.

sudden valley gunner · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
I agree to an extent.

The ONLY reason I don't fully agree is because they DID investigate to see if kids were present. They were lied to.

If they DIDNT bother to ask/check then I'd agree they should be screwed.

So it would have been ok if it harmed an adult?

Primus · Sep 23, 2014

sudden valley gunner said:
So it would have been ok if it harmed an adult?

No. It not "ok" to hurt ANYONE unless they are being aggressive or pose a danger directly to you or more importantly someone else.

But is it "more" ok if it was the drug dealer or whoever they were looking for? I'd say yes only because they are the reason they were there in the first place. As opposed to a sleeping kid who is clearly innocent.

Goal is still no injuries to anyone.

stealthyeliminator · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
No. It not "ok" to hurt ANYONE unless they are being aggressive or pose a danger directly to you or more importantly someone else.

But is it "more" ok if it was the drug dealer or whoever they were looking for? I'd say yes only because they are the reason they were there in the first place. As opposed to a sleeping kid who is clearly innocent.

Goal is still no injuries to anyone.

What if there were only an "alleged" drug dealer?

If yes, the it's "more" ok to harm someone that another person has made an accusation against, even long before fact finding has been done by his peers and he's been found guilty of said accusation? I would tread lightly with these questions, we're getting into dangerous waters.

Primus · Sep 23, 2014

stealthyeliminator said:
What if there were only an "alleged" drug dealer?

If yes, the it's "more" ok to harm someone that another person has made an accusation against, even long before fact finding has been done by his peers and he's been found guilty of said accusation? I would tread lightly with these questions, we're getting into dangerous waters.

I agree with you a 100% on that one.

My point was just if someone SEES you do a drug deal your still innocent right? Well if based on someone seeing that deal a cop initiates an act against your house you are MORE responsible then your kid for said act.

Thats all I'm getting at.

sudden valley gunner · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
No. It not "ok" to hurt ANYONE unless they are being aggressive or pose a danger directly to you or more importantly someone else.

But is it "more" ok if it was the drug dealer or whoever they were looking for? I'd say yes only because they are the reason they were there in the first place. As opposed to a sleeping kid who is clearly innocent.

Goal is still no injuries to anyone.

stealthyeliminator said:
What if there were only an "alleged" drug dealer?

If yes, the it's "more" ok to harm someone that another person has made an accusation against, even long before fact finding has been done by his peers and he's been found guilty of said accusation? I would tread lightly with these questions, we're getting into dangerous waters.

+1

Primus it is not up to you to decide the level of harm ok to a person, especially without due process. The act of serving a warrant violently is so abhorrent to due process that only those offering up apogia for the horrendous acts of their profession couldn't see it.

There is no situation where this type of negligence by a "civilian" would ever be tolerated.

Primus · Sep 23, 2014

sudden valley gunner said:
+1

Primus it is not up to you to decide the level of harm ok to a person, especially without due process. The act of serving a warrant violently is so abhorrent to due process that only those offering up apogia for the horrendous acts of their profession couldn't see it.

There is no situation where this type of negligence by a "civilian" would ever be tolerated.

You should read my reply since I agreed and explained to him what I meant.

davidmcbeth · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
That's why you need a scope to shoot 200yds never carried a rifle.

Oh YOU ... I shoot fine @ 200yds w/iron sights ... just with certain guns, I prefer optics.

I'll bet you have a scope on your handgun ... I think this is yours....

http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/arms...191_01_s_w_15_2_38_special_with_scope_640.jpg

Really it does not matter ... the guy who gets a bullet in the brain won't care if you use holo sights, a 20x analog sight, or iron sights...

davidmcbeth · Sep 23, 2014

Primus said:
No. It not "ok" to hurt ANYONE unless they are being aggressive or pose a danger directly to you or more importantly someone else.

But is it "more" ok if it was the drug dealer or whoever they were looking for? I'd say yes only because they are the reason they were there in the first place. As opposed to a sleeping kid who is clearly innocent.

Goal is still no injuries to anyone.

I'm a drug dealer .. how many aspirin ya want ... pm me

Primus · Sep 23, 2014

davidmcbeth said:
Oh YOU ... I shoot fine @ 200yds w/iron sights ... just with certain guns, I prefer optics.

I'll bet you have a scope on your handgun ... I think this is yours....

http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/arms...191_01_s_w_15_2_38_special_with_scope_640.jpg

Really it does not matter ... the guy who gets a bullet in the brain won't care if you use holo sights, a 20x analog sight, or iron sights...

How'd you get a photo of my carry gun??

WalkingWolf · Sep 23, 2014

Drug dealers are the scum of the earth, drunk cops are the soldiers of God. (sarcasm)

state hater · Sep 24, 2014

WalkingWolf said:
That act was reckless, barbaric, brutal, and totally uncalled for on any charge, let alone a drug charge. Maybe we will get lucky and Karma will visit each of those officers.

I think that relatives of the baby should curb stomp every cop responsible for mutilating, and nearly killing, said baby.

state hater · Sep 24, 2014

J_dazzle23 said:
Interesting that you brought this up now. Just the other day in my local area, a man attempted to rob a bank and took two hostages. He drove 10 miles down the road, ditched the car and hostages, and ran into the woods. City officers and the fbi both started a manhunt until they found him.

At least in my immediate area, it seems that even the threat of a lay persons life has warranted the same response that the murdering of one of their own would merit.

Interesting coincidence as far as timing is concerned.

When a cop is killed "in the line of duty," oftentimes the car carrying the corpse will be paraded around in an obnoxiously circuitous route, scores of miles out of the way (Alex Jones mentioned some small town cop's funeral convoy from about 100 miles from Austin, being diverted through Austin DURING RUSH HOUR, to remind the peasants that they're worthless scum who are obligated to be inconvenienced when one of their gods dies, and neither he nor his wife could get to their kids at the end of the school day, and said kids ended up getting picked up around 7 PM thanks to these bastards). They're full of themselves, and I'm not going to have any of it.

Fallschirjmäger · Sep 24, 2014

Fallschirmjäger said:
You mean a massive manhunt with 'shelter in place' advisories, police in armored vehicles, helicopters constantly flying overhead, and everyone dressed to the nines in their super ninja outfits? Nope, I'm sure that's not happening.

You find that sort of massive manpower response any time some regular ol' citizens been shot, nuthin' special about it at all.

OC for ME said:
Here we go...again.
LEAs do not give a rip about the citizenry if it is not in their own self interest. I certainly hope at least one citizen will seek a redress of wrongs and that at least one judge holds those POS cops to account.

Emotions are sometimes difficult to convey with the written word. I would ask that the gentleman read the post again this time imagining a sarcastic tone with an eye roll at the end.

J_dazzle23 · Sep 24, 2014

state hater said:
When a cop is killed "in the line of duty," oftentimes the car carrying the corpse will be paraded around in an obnoxiously circuitous route, scores of miles out of the way (Alex Jones mentioned some small town cop's funeral convoy from about 100 miles from Austin, being diverted through Austin DURING RUSH HOUR, to remind the peasants that they're worthless scum who are obligated to be inconvenienced when one of their gods dies, and neither he nor his wife could get to their kids at the end of the school day, and said kids ended up getting picked up around 7 PM thanks to these bastards). They're full of themselves, and I'm not going to have any of it.

Riveting tale.

Why didn't you ruin the procession, since you aren't going to have any of it?

I don't care how people choose to respect those that pass away, cop or not.

It takes a special kind of @sshole to fling crap at anyone that is dead.

state hater · Sep 24, 2014

WalkingWolf said:
Drug dealers are the scum of the earth, drunk cops are the soldiers of God. (sarcasm)

A lot of sheeple don't realize that drug dealers are often peaceful business people.

Is the life of a cop worth more than the life of a non-cop?

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