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Thread: Police mistakenly shoot 911 caller during manhunt

  1. #1
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    Police mistakenly shoot 911 caller during manhunt

    Doesn't say if it was Open Carry or not.. but still - one more reason to never go to Vancouver WA

    http://www.nwcn.com/story/news/local...pect/18885169/

    VANCOUVER, Wash. - A man who called 911 to report that he had seen a shooting suspect was mistakenly shot by responding law enforcement officers on October 31, Vancouver police said Tuesday.

    The man had told police that he spotted 59-year-old John Kendall in the 700 block of Northeast Blanford Drive. A manhunt was under way at the time for Kendall, who deputies said had shot his neighbor earlier that morning.

    Background: Suspect dead, two injured in Vancouver shootings

    Investigators then confirmed Kendall's cell phone was in the immediate area according to the Vancouver Police Department.

    A SWAT team arriving at the scene spotted a man who matched Kendall's description. They were unaware that the citizen who called 911 was still there.

    "Law enforcement personnel watched as the citizen (believed to be Kendall) exited his vehicle and circled behind his trunk," police explained. "Fearing that he armed himself, law enforcement fired multiple shots at the individual in order to stop the perceived threat before the citizen could enter the woods."

    The man was shot in the leg. He took cover behind a gravel pile and fired a shot back, then he called 911 again, this time to report that he had been shot.

    Officers made contact with the man and provided first aid until he was taken to a local hospital for treatment.

    Kendall was found nearby a short time later with an apparent self-inflicted gunshot wound. He was dead before police arrived, but he and his vehicle were obscured from the view of the SWAT team, according to the police statement.

    The man shot by police asked not to be identified. Investigators said there was no apparent connection between him and Kendall.

    A regional major crimes team was continuing the investigation.

    The law enforcement personnel involved were identified as Corporal Chris Leblanc, 47; Officer Brian Frances, 38; and Deputy Anthony Spainhower, 39. They were placed on administrative leave, per routine in this type of investigation.

    The other victim, the neighbor hurt in the initial shooting, was hospitalized with critical injuries to her face and said she will likely lose her right eye.
    Last edited by devldogs55; 11-12-2014 at 03:33 PM.

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    The old "shoot anyone we see" syndrome ....

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    "Fearing that he armed himself, law enforcement fired multiple shots at the individual in order to stop the perceived threat ....
    So how come we cannot shoot when it's just a perceived (read "we think it might happen but have no evidence to support that notion or that an actual threat exists") threat but they do?

    Would someone please FOIA the second 911 call and put it up where we can hear it.

    911. What is your emergency.

    Yeah. A whole bunch of [expletive deleted] just shot at me for no [expletive deleted] reason. I'm behind my car and shooting back at them, I need an ambulance - they got me in the leg.

    Sir, please put down the gun. Those are police officers who just want to make sure they go home at the end of their shift.

    Normally I don't pick on the cops until/unless there is good documentation that they screwed the pooch. But it sure sounds like they did in this case.

    stay safe.
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    Fearing that he armed himself, law enforcement fired multiple shots at the individual in order to stop the perceived threat ....


    A fear that he armed himself is not relevant. Probably something someone inserted into the story. If they reasonably thought they guy was the shooting suspect, and they thought he was going to flee, then it follows that he was an imminent danger (to any and everyone), and deadly force is justified, police officer or not.

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    [/I][/COLOR][/SIZE]

    A fear that he armed himself is not relevant. Probably something someone inserted into the story. If they reasonably thought they guy was the shooting suspect, and they thought he was going to flee, then it follows that he was an imminent danger (to any and everyone), and deadly force is justified, police officer or not.
    Fleeing felon rule...

    Can't say I agree with the use here. I have problems with shooting guys without at least giving them chance to cooperate.

    But I wasn't there so clearly they saw something I didnt.
    "The wicked flee when no man persueth: but the righteous are as bold as a lion" Proverbs 28:1

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    But I wasn't there so clearly they saw something I didnt.

    "I wasn't there" the ultimate in "good cop" cop outs. no pun intended.

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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    [/I][/COLOR][/SIZE]

    A fear that he armed himself is not relevant. Probably something someone inserted into the story. If they reasonably thought they guy was the shooting suspect, and they thought he was going to flee, then it follows that he was an imminent danger (to any and everyone), and deadly force is justified, police officer or not.
    I couldn't disagree more. Just being worried that someone is armed; just being worried that someone is a shooting suspect; and just being worried that someone is the bad guy does not ever - under any law in this country - justify the use of deadly force. Cops aren't special.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Fleeing felon rule...

    Can't say I agree with the use here. I have problems with shooting guys without at least giving them chance to cooperate.

    But I wasn't there so clearly they saw something I didnt.
    I don't think that the cops fled ... except to go home.

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    Cops aren't special.


    It's got nothing to do with being a cop. And it's got nothing to do with being "worried". I didn't say that.

    If anyone reasonably believes someone poses an imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm (to anyone else), then lethal force is justified, no challenge (stop! put your hands up!) required.

    This is basic self defense stuff. If you're not aware of the most basic laws surrounding self defense, please turn your guns in to the government.

    Do you know why some people tend to advocate for cops after a self defense shooting? It's because if the cops loose the ability to defend themselves in a certain situation, the rest of us have lost that ability too. Think on that for a while.

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff. State View Post
    "I wasn't there" the ultimate in "good cop" cop outs. no pun intended.
    Well what was left unsaid is you weren't there either so you didn't see what they saw either.

    Difference is I'm willing to acknowledge that instead of pretending I know something I don't.

    Want a hug?
    "The wicked flee when no man persueth: but the righteous are as bold as a lion" Proverbs 28:1

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I don't think that the cops fled ... except to go home.
    Boom! That's why I love you mcbeth. Well I love your cat since he tells you to type this stuff.
    "The wicked flee when no man persueth: but the righteous are as bold as a lion" Proverbs 28:1

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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    This is basic self defense stuff. If you're not aware of the most basic laws surrounding self defense, please turn your guns in to the government.


    It sounds like you may want to take your own advice, my friend. What about this story sounds like the police had a REASONABLE fear for their lives? He did not display a weapon until AFTER they fired at him; he did not act aggressively towards them, in fact he moved away from them and hid. There is no way they had a REASONABLE fear for their lives - unless something that wasn't posted in this story happened. Even still, going off what is written is all we have at the moment.
    Last edited by devldogs55; 11-12-2014 at 05:44 PM.

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by devldogs55 View Post
    Cops aren't special.
    Sorry to rain on your idyllic view devildogs55. The police are on administrative leave because they are very "special". If the roles had been reversed and the citizen had shot the police based on the flimsy excuse given here, do you think the citizen would be free?
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Unfortunately you're right. I should have said cops SHOULDN'T be special.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundar View Post
    do you think the citizen would be free?
    And still getting paid???
    Last edited by devldogs55; 11-12-2014 at 06:05 PM.

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    Money in the bank

    I can see that this 911 caller, may have a good chance of having his medical bills paid for plus a large settlement
    coming from the Vancouver PD. I hope he makes out on this deal.

    ..................Jack

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    Yet again the police fail to protect and in fact harm the citizen. Some idiot with a badge just thought it was a good idea to shoot the first person he saw with a gun. The ole shoot first get away with it later routine.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    So how come we cannot shoot when it's just a perceived (read "we think it might happen but have no evidence to support that notion or that an actual threat exists") threat but they do?
    snipped
    Seems to me that the above would merely be a 'hunch' and certainly NOT by itself RAS.
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    There is no way they had a REASONABLE fear for their lives


    It's not THEIR lives they have to be in fear for. It's anyone's. If they thought that was their man, and they thought he was going to leave and harm more people, that's all they need. It sounds like that's what they're hanging their hat on.



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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    Yet again the police fail to protect and in fact harm the citizen. Some idiot with a badge just thought it was a good idea to shoot the first person he saw with a gun. The ole shoot first get away with it later routine.
    Using just the facts we have available - which basically is the news report - I wonder where you picked up that the cops actually saw a gun until the guy started returning fire.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    It's about the same as the newspaper ladies and the Surfer getting shot, and shot at, in LA during Dorner.

    Scared little bullies running around with guns is not a safe environment for any human being or house pet.

    You got one great "family", primus. You must be proud. .
    Last edited by Jeff. State; 11-12-2014 at 07:55 PM.

  21. #21
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Using just the facts we have available - which basically is the news report - I wonder where you picked up that the cops actually saw a gun until the guy started returning fire.

    stay safe.
    You are right, but from the info the officer seems to claim, he thought he might have, could have had, was going to have a gun.
    It is well that war is so terrible – otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Can't say I agree with the use here.

    I have problems with shooting guys without at least giving them chance to cooperate.
    This is called "conversational distance" because you generally don't shoot someone unless you have spoken with them. This sounds more like an ambush than anything. I was under the impression that they were to go out and "apprehend" the BG, not snipe them.

    You shoot at me? I do not give a rats a$$ what kind of suit you are wearing, I will return fire and I will hit you. So, LEOs, think about the fact that a great number of us are tired of your ..........well you know the rest.

    This, ladies and gentlemen is why you stay on the line when you call 911. Do not hang up until there is resolution. This is very important if you have a big a$$ pistol hanging off your belt as I do.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

  23. #23
    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff. State View Post
    It's about the same as the newspaper ladies and the Surfer getting shot, and shot at, in LA during Dorner.

    Scared little bullies running around with guns is not a safe environment for any human being or house pet.

    You got one great "family", primus. You must be proud. .
    I do have a great family. Your part of it too brother. All Americans are my family .

    Just because they share my occupation does not make them close relatives. Especially if they act like such.
    "The wicked flee when no man persueth: but the righteous are as bold as a lion" Proverbs 28:1

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    Regular Member Primus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    It's not THEIR lives they have to be in fear for. It's anyone's. If they thought that was their man, and they thought he was going to leave and harm more people, that's all they need. It sounds like that's what they're hanging their hat on.


    [/COLOR]
    I agree. Only problem I have is if your going to shoot a fleeing felon you better be damn sure that's the felon. Not just a dude that looks like him.

    But your spot on with the concept.
    "The wicked flee when no man persueth: but the righteous are as bold as a lion" Proverbs 28:1

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    I do have a great family. Your part of it too brother. All Americans are my family .

    Just because they share my occupation does not make them close relatives. Especially if they act like such.
    Primus I have spent enough time at policeone to know Blue "family" is all that counts. Only the most egregious of crimes committed by "Brothers" will be criticized and usually swept under the carpet as quick as possible.


    Family? Y'all are Hatfields the rest of us are McCoys.

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