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Thread: Judge says he was profiled, harassed while entering courthouse

  1. #1
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    Judge says he was profiled, harassed while entering courthouse

    Not gun related but has to do with ID.
    We are not required to show ID on the streets even when OC but are
    to go into the court house? Is this just a Judges order or is there a law?
    If this brakes a forum rule please remove it.
    http://www.wlwt.com/news/judge-says-...house/29850106

    Mike

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    He is not required to show ID at all...he could have gone through the security screening process if he did not want to show ID.

    Yet the gov't workers as special..many places, this courthouse too, allows people with a work ID to show it and get into the bldg w/o going through any security beyond that.

    It annoys me to no end...why am I being searched (and a metal detector is a search under the 4th) when idiots get to go right through unharassed?

    If a security man sees a judge that he knows is a judge...they just let them in w/o the need to show ID - or that was how it was previously done before the new guy did not know he was a judge.

    Now, when I did guard duty in the military ... I was instructed to insure to see everyone's ID at a checkpoint. The base commander refused to show me ID .. I refused him entry. Of course, crap hit the fan. My defense? How did I know that he was not discharged 5 minutes before he came to my checkpoint. The base commander thought that over for a while. No reprimand was issued against me (no medal issued either though).

    Now the judge will have to show ID ... and all the other judges will love him for it -- screw these judges. Go through the same screening as you and me....you could have been fired 5 minutes ago.
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 11-21-2014 at 11:36 AM.

  3. #3
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Probably the bigger story is the judge apologized to the deputy after having a sit-down with the deputy and his supervisor. As well as an order that everybody means everybody and that includes judges.

    Lots of controlled spaces use either distinctive IDs or lapel pins for the "privileged few", or go to the added cost of card-reader activated entry control.

    If the judge wants to be passed through on visual (face) recognition he ought to get to know the deputies by face and name the same as he expects from them. As a squad/platoon NCO I had to be able to recognize and name every Marine I was responsible for - from the front, from the back, and inside a gasmask. Platoon leaders had to do the same. Company commanders had to do it for all platoon leaders plus the company admin staff. It can be done.

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    I'm sure at the beginning of the judge's meeting the cop and his boss that the judge was expecting an apology from the deputy. And in the end he figured out why he was wrong.

    In the military you best know your CO is on-sight. And the base commander too, which I did. But I was just following orders...luckily my supv. was a by-the-book kinda of guy and defended my actions in following my orders of requiring ID to enter the base.I was just given a "dismmmisssed!" command like Col. Klink .. no apology. My meeting was to discuss if court martial would have been appropriate as I turned down a Art. 15 for "disobeying an officer's order" (ie commander's order to let him onto the base w/o showing ID) and to re-request I sign the Art. 15 papers. Since the base was a joint American-foreign base with 2 co-commanders and I would not let in the foreign commander w/o ID, I think it was more of a "we'll punish this guy as a show of good faith", PR kinda crap. Fun times..

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    This is not military. This is a bldg. that is open to the public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ps1mhd View Post
    This is not military. This is a bldg. that is open to the public.
    Well, the judge's notion that he was being profiled was wrong, the story said so ... do you have any concerns about what happened there?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ps1mhd View Post
    This is not military. This is a bldg. that is open to the public.
    This practice is not unique to Hamilton County, or just Ohio courthouses for that matter. You either go through the metal detector/scanner on the way in, or go through a check point where some form of employee ID for the building must be shown.

    I'm guessing that even the big urban based counties in YOUR state...oops, commonwealth...do things this way nowadays.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian D. View Post
    This practice is not unique to Hamilton County, or just Ohio courthouses for that matter. You either go through the metal detector/scanner on the way in, or go through a check point where some form of employee ID for the building must be shown.

    I'm guessing that even the big urban based counties in YOUR state...oops, commonwealth...do things this way nowadays.
    Yes I have been in court houses, city halls, and police station (last two OC)
    and had to pass through metal detectors.
    But never had to show ID. You don't have to show (or even have one)
    on the street when stopped even with RAS or PC.
    Why should we have to show one to get into a public place?

    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian D. View Post
    This practice is not unique to Hamilton County, or just Ohio courthouses for that matter. You either go through the metal detector/scanner on the way in, or go through a check point where some form of employee ID for the building must be shown.

    I'm guessing that even the big urban based counties in YOUR state...oops, commonwealth...do things this way nowadays.
    Seems like the OP doesn't understand.

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    To get through a Hamilton County court house checkpoint (not general public metal detector entrances) you need an courthouse issued badge. Those badges are issued to court personnel, practicing attorneys and reporters.

    Public citizens have to go through metal detectors, BUT they cannot be ask for ID. That is a violation of your First Amendment right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by color of law View Post
    To get through a Hamilton County court house checkpoint (not general public metal detector entrances) you need an courthouse issued badge. Those badges are issued to court personnel, practicing attorneys and reporters.

    Public citizens have to go through metal detectors, BUT they cannot be ask for ID. That is a violation of your First Amendment right.
    Thank you that is what I was looking for.

    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by ps1mhd View Post
    Thank you that is what I was looking for.

    Mike
    As long you are happy with what he said ....

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    As long you are happy with what he said ....
    Are you questioning my factual answer? It's just a question.

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    Quote Originally Posted by color of law View Post
    Are you questioning my factual answer? It's just a question.
    I think we agree on the facts...

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    Regular Member XD40sc's Avatar
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    Your papers komrad.

    So the deputies at the security checkpoint must look at the ID of every single person that enters. What does that tell them? Do they have the name of every single wanted person committed to memory so they can do what?

    What about people without government issued ID, such as a 15 or 16 year old that doesn't have a license yet? Even my grandson who when 13 was mistaken by a cop as someone old enough to drive, (asked if he was driving at an accident scene).

    The courthouse here scans for weapons (metal detector) but doesn't check ID.

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    Quote Originally Posted by XD40sc View Post
    Your papers komrad.

    So the deputies at the security checkpoint must look at the ID of every single person that enters. What does that tell them? Do they have the name of every single wanted person committed to memory so they can do what?

    What about people without government issued ID, such as a 15 or 16 year old that doesn't have a license yet? Even my grandson who when 13 was mistaken by a cop as someone old enough to drive, (asked if he was driving at an accident scene).

    The courthouse here scans for weapons (metal detector) but doesn't check ID.
    oh boy....another one

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    Quote Originally Posted by XD40sc View Post
    Your papers komrad.

    So the deputies at the security checkpoint must look at the ID of every single person that enters. What does that tell them? Do they have the name of every single wanted person committed to memory so they can do what?

    What about people without government issued ID, such as a 15 or 16 year old that doesn't have a license yet? Even my grandson who when 13 was mistaken by a cop as someone old enough to drive, (asked if he was driving at an accident scene).

    The courthouse here scans for weapons (metal detector) but doesn't check ID.
    Let me break this down for you.

    General public and those without ID: Use entrance with metal detectors.

    Personnel with facility ID: Use checkpoint entrances, where ID is checked. No detectors.

  18. #18
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ps1mhd
    Yes I have been in court houses, city halls, and police station (last two OC) and had to pass through metal detectors.
    But never had to show ID. You don't have to show (or even have one) on the street when stopped even with RAS or PC.
    Why should we have to show one to get into a public place?
    Try entering a federal courthouse. They demand you show ID.
    Wish someone would challenge that!

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    Quote Originally Posted by bc.cruiser View Post
    Let me break this down for you.

    General public and those without ID: Use entrance with metal detectors.

    Personnel with facility ID: Use checkpoint entrances, where ID is checked. No detectors.
    I see you wrote this slow .... good job stating again what was said previously, just in a different format

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