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Another Rookie Cop, Another Tragic End to Life

wizzi01

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
127
Location
Detroit
A 12yr old boy?

Look, the law says he cannot even have a gun .. so the cop should rely upon that and come to the conclusion that its a bb-gun or something of a similar nature.

I would have zero problems with a guilty verdict and hanging.

Yeah why not look up Nathaniel Abraham. An 11 year old boy at the time found guilty of shooting an 18 year old.
 

wizzi01

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
127
Location
Detroit
Public servants surrender their rights for powers delegated them by their public masters.

And sometimes people do stupid things and win stupid prizes, like what happened here. So next time you get pulled over or stopped and the officer tells you to put your hands up I expect you to fully not comply and reach for your pistol without saying a word.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
Red herring. Bad one.

No its not. It is an example and a question ( a Socratic one) meant to make you think, one you are evading because it shows you to be yet again ignorant of how rights work and how a constitutional government and their agents (which you are one) are not equal in rights.

Wanna try again?
 
Last edited:

Primus

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
3,939
Location
United States
No its not. It is an example and a question ( a Socratic one) meant to make you think, one you are evading because it shows you to be yet again ignorant of how rights work and how a constitutional government and their agents (which you are one) are not equal in rights.

Wanna try again?
Sure. Wait one. Driving and tough to type on my "iPad" lol
 

Primus

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
3,939
Location
United States
No its not. It is an example and a question ( a Socratic one) meant to make you think, one you are evading because it shows you to be yet again ignorant of how rights work and how a constitutional government and their agents (which you are one) are not equal in rights.

Wanna try again?
Ok here's the deal my love... Any rights I give up as an agent either as police or military I give up voluntarily as part of the employee/employer relationship. Here's a secret. Your not the employer. The government agency is.

I'm no more your employee then the wal mart greeter is to a guy who buys 1 share of the public stock. Can you dictate their rights? No.

When in the military you give up 1st (can't speak unless spoken to) the 2nd (can only carry guns they give you when they give it how they give it) 4th (barracks inspection baby) etc

The rights aren't given up because you say so or even the constitution. They are given because another military agent says so. Period.

Now police. Again, employee employer relationship. I agree to only carry city gun on duty. I agree not to tel you to get f**** in uniform. If I didn't want to agree I wouldn't work there. Just like wal mart employees, dominos workers, etc.

Now I'll ask again. Show me the cite that says I give up HUMAN rights? Show me where it says I can't defend myself as a "servant". Please. Ever notice the whole myth about no duty to act? That's because my human right to life is not forfeit because YOU say so. If I choose to forfeit it for you then that's on me (I would in a new York minute yes even for you). No constitution says I have to die in a fire for you or any other manner of death. Its a choice.


Now I GLADLY "serve" my public and city. That's a choice. I do it willingly and to the best of my ability. But not because of fear you personally might fire me.

So one more time... Show me a cite that shows MY rights are affected. Other thens maybe my union contract or jph duties written. Constitution and other documents say how I can affect YOUR rights....

Still love ya.

P.S why is the supposed pro freedom guys are so quick to demand their "servants" obey them?
 

Primus

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
3,939
Location
United States
Ok here's the deal my love... Any rights I give up as an agent either as police or military I give up voluntarily as part of the employee/employer relationship. Here's a secret. Your not the employer. The government agency is.

I'm no more your employee then the wal mart greeter is to a guy who buys 1 share of the public stock. Can you dictate their rights? No.

When in the military you give up 1st (can't speak unless spoken to) the 2nd (can only carry guns they give you when they give it how they give it) 4th (barracks inspection baby) etc

The rights aren't given up because you say so or even the constitution. They are given because another military agent says so. Period.

Now police. Again, employee employer relationship. I agree to only carry city gun on duty. I agree not to tel you to get f**** in uniform. If I didn't want to agree I wouldn't work there. Just like wal mart employees, dominos workers, etc.

Now I'll ask again. Show me the cite that says I give up HUMAN rights? Show me where it says I can't defend myself as a "servant". Please. Ever notice the whole myth about no duty to act? That's because my human right to life is not forfeit because YOU say so. If I choose to forfeit it for you then that's on me (I would in a new York minute yes even for you). No constitution says I have to die in a fire for you or any other manner of death. Its a choice.


Now I GLADLY "serve" my public and city. That's a choice. I do it willingly and to the best of my ability. But not because of fear you personally might fire me.

So one more time... Show me a cite that shows MY rights are affected. Other thens maybe my union contract or jph duties written. Constitution and other documents say how I can affect YOUR rights....

Still love ya.

P.S why is the supposed pro freedom guys are so quick to demand their "servants" obey them?
P.S.S

Basically what I'm saying is your demanding allegiance and subservience. In return I'll give you duty.

Duty is a choice and much stronger then being subservient.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
More evasion.

You never answered the whole question, redirect the argument, change the subject subtly...etc......

Yet still admit you don't get full rights when you join the military as a public servant, same goes to any public employee......don't take a genius to figure that out.

No shite its voluntary nobody said it wasn't. Nice try though.

Who cares what you offer? Subservience is part of being a servant of the people.
 

Phoenix David

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2009
Messages
605
Location
Glendale, Arizona, USA
A 12yr old boy?

Look, the law says he cannot even have a gun .. so the cop should rely upon that and come to the conclusion that its a bb-gun or something of a similar nature.

I would have zero problems with a guilty verdict and hanging.

The law also says you can't sell crack so it should be assumed that they are selling individual use packets of rock salt?
The law also says you can't drive drunk so police should assume they are trying to avoid potholes and not stop them?
The law also says you can't hijack a airplane and fly it into buildings so lets stop all forms of screening at the airport?
The law also says your not allowed to rape babies so the police should assume tit was consensual?

I don't know if your just trying to rile people up or if you really believe that you said, I am going to assume you are trying to rile people up as most normal people don't think like that, if you really do have a thought process like that you really should get professional help before you do something to hurt yourself.
 

Phoenix David

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2009
Messages
605
Location
Glendale, Arizona, USA
P.S why is the supposed pro freedom guys are so quick to demand their "servants" obey them?

I wish it was that simple and I could get the fire department out here to mow my lawn and do the heavy lifting.

Some may be confusing obey with being polite and respectful with being subservient or just think because you are a "public servant" they are your boss.

Back to the OP, if you make a move towards what looks to be a weapon a reasonable assumption is that they are going to use it, carrying a weapon or what looks to be a weapon is not a game and the big boy rules apply. Based on the information provided it was unfortunate that the police officer shot him but it seems a reasonable reaction to what was presented.
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
P.S.S

Basically what I'm saying is your demanding allegiance and subservience. In return I'll give you duty.

Duty is a choice and much stronger then being subservient.

Disobey an order in the Army and you may have your freedom taken away (Leavenworth)...not going home that day.
Disobey an "order" in the police force and you may be fired ... you are still free to go home that day.

In the Army, you are expected to follow orders .. even if it means you likely may die.
Not so in the police dept....in fact, there is zero expectation of the same. Its just a job.

Yet some cops think that they live in a military society wherein people have to listen to every "command".

When I was in the military I was ordered to do things that people would say only a crazy person would actually carry out the act. What gets me is the Vietnam guys ... fighting for a piece of land, winning it and then abandoning the land just to fight over it again later...now that was messed up.

Cops have no duty to do anything .. a duty is something you cannot shirk ... any oath taken by a cop is not a true oath, its meaningless words.
 

bomber

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
499
Location
, ,
Raise your hand if you never did anything stupid when you were 12.

Raise your hand if you think a cop should be held more accountable for his judgement than a 12 year old.
 
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