• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Circle Jan. 15 on your calendar!

OC Freedom

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2014
Messages
646
Location
ADA County, ID
The anti-gun crowd talks crap about anybody who carries a firearm - except cops - which is to be expected (paranoid, criminals about to snap at any time, etc, etc).
Some of the concealed carry only crowd talks crap about anyone who open carries in any way - cowboy, compensating, cop wannabe, etc, etc, etc.
Some of the pistol only open carry crowd talks crap about long gun open carry.

How many anti-gun people do you hear complaining about other anti-gun people? Almost none. And that is one of the big reasons they win.

In my opinion - it's the fact that we point at others and exclaim "Look at the moron! They are hurting us more than helping us" that hurts us more than the guy wearing the gas mask or the guy safely carrying the LAR-PDS.

I understand what you are saying and division among the 2nd amendment supporters does not help our cause, I do see your point and agree with this. I will try to convey my knee jerk reaction to the pictures posted by KOMO.

The pro-gun folks participating in the rally need to realize that some of the state Representatives are sitting on the fence on gun issues and need to see us at our best. This is a rally at the Capitol and not a hunting trip; so should one not dress appropriately for the occasion? When I attend the theater for a play, or Church, or invited to a dinner function, well my attire reflects on the circumstances that I am involved in. I know people are on a budget and not everyone can afford a nice suit, but we as representatives of the pro-gun movement can do better and should.

The fellow wearing a gas mask has every right too wear it anytime he wants, and I will support that, but I still think his actions are moronic. The question is does this help or hinder the impressions our fence sitting Representatives see us as pro 2nd Amendment activist?

To address handguns and rifles being carried at the rally, I expected as much, and believe that everyone should, for is it not the point of the rally (gun freedom).

I personally don't care if people want to carry a rocket launcher strapped across their back while grocery shopping and smoking weed at the same time, I support their right to do so. No victim, no crime.
 

Alpine

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
671
Location
Idaho
I watched this guy all day. I can say this, I was very nervous by his behavior and was on high alert. Carrying a long gun to these rallies serves no positive purpose.

Hey Nick,

I saw you and Jeff in the audience but didn't get a chance to say hi before it was over. Good to see you guys made it.

Komo has updated their story to include this statement from WSP:
Bob Calkins, a spokesman for the Washington State Patrol, said that unless directed otherwise by the Legislature, the patrol will continue to allow people to openly carry weapons into the public galleries. However, he noted that those who openly carry will be required to keep their pistols holstered, and those with rifles will have to keep them pointing directly at the ceiling or directly at the floor.

"We're not going to allow any behavior with a firearm that might constitute an obvious protest, such as the handing back and forth, where individuals have indicated very clearly that that's a political demonstration in opposition to Initiative 594," he said.


I am going to call Bob and ask him to release another statement specifically mentioning 9.41.270
 

Alpine

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
671
Location
Idaho
No. I just don't want to see someone eventually shot and killed who happened to bring a firearm into the Capitol and then unholstered/unslung it and started brandishing it.
 
Last edited:

Alpine

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
671
Location
Idaho
Not mine, I wasn't around these clowns directly, though I saw it from a balcony.

I figured they wouldn't shoot, but given their TERRIBLE LACK OF MUZZLE DISCIPLINE I could see WSP might decide to err on caution.

#2 rule of guns: never point them at anything you aren't willing to destroy.
 

Alpine

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
671
Location
Idaho
If a gun is holstered with no hands on it then when its muzzle sweeps people it is not as serious. These are fine lines and when you sweep people with your muzzle while holding the gun in the ready position it is very bad etiquette even among pro-gun people, and likely to get you arrested when the police see you do it.
 

Alpine

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
671
Location
Idaho
The point was that both the street and the Capitol should be the same.
 

Jeff Hayes

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
2,569
Location
Long gone
150115_Gun_Protest_1.jpg

I am sorry but that would have alarmed me, holstered or slung weapons never have bothered me likely never will but carrying at the low ready like that is not acceptable.

This idiot just put us back years IMHO, years that I and so many others have worked hard to promote OC often at risk of being arrested. Why should the rest of us risk so much for so long?

We need to shun the people that act like this or we will be about as relevant as PETA on a cattle ranch.

I suggest we not plan another rally at the capitol grounds for several years the children do not seem to be able to control themselves. I will not attend nor will I ever again financially contribute to another rally I do not like shooting myself in the foot much less doing it on purpose.
 
Last edited:

amlevin

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
5,937
Location
North of Seattle, Washington, USA
So, if you were standing just inside the entrance to the capitol building door when he walked in like that would you have shot him before he made it all the way in? Why not? Why would your life be threatened by him any more in your business than at the capitol building?

If the guy's actions rose to the level warranting fear in a REASONABLE person....than why wasn't he arrested by one of the several law enforcement officers there that day? Seems like you are being less reasonable than the law enforcement officers there.


1. I prefer to stay away from groups like this. More and more participants seem to be using less and less common sense. It's not a matter of "If" there will be a problem in the future but just "When".

2. This dufus was most likely not observed by police officers when this picture was taken.

As for being less reasonable than the police officers there? Yes, I am. It's "my @$$" and they get paid to put themselves in harms way. I choose to avoid it.
 

amlevin

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
5,937
Location
North of Seattle, Washington, USA
If you felt that your life was in danger, then why the hell didn't you leave? It's like those people that like to run up to anyone they see carrying a gun and exclaim how much it scares them.


Quick question: "Why are you so ardently defending the actions of the dufus in the picture?"

It's actions like that, especially when captured on "film" that cost "Normal" gun carriers more of their freedoms.

It tends to put those that are otherwise indifferent to open carry of firearms on the "No 'effing' way" side of the discussion.

Tens of thousands of well behaved people can meet in public and express themselves with no consequences. Then one moron comes along, does something stupid, and suddenly all the good will created earlier is G-O-N-E. Why is that so hard to recognize?
 

Mr45ACP

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2015
Messages
15
Location
Kuna, Idaho
When I look at the above image I wonder if that is the image the pro gun crowd including my self wishes to portray? Personally, that is not the image I wish to put forth. I think it harms the cause.
 

gogodawgs

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Oct 25, 2009
Messages
5,669
Location
Federal Way, Washington, USA
In my opinion this person was carrying in a dangerous fashion, that violates the tenets of the Spencer decision and .270.

I feel as though this type of behavior does not advance the cause for liberty or open carry and does nothing to undo 594.
 

Alpine

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
671
Location
Idaho
In my opinion this person was carrying in a dangerous fashion, that violates the tenets of the Spencer decision and .270.

I feel as though this type of behavior does not advance the cause for liberty or open carry and does nothing to undo 594.
I agree. Previous case law establishes that slung or holstered OC is lawful but taking your firearm into your hands and brandishing in this fashion is often what crosses the line on .270

I have no problem with OC where people leave their pistols and rifles holstered or slung. But when you carry them in your hands at the ready position that generates reasonable alarm.
 

Primus

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
3,939
Location
United States
Amazing how none of the Washington State Patrol were concerned enough to detain him in any way.... or maybe they were just too afraid.
Or maybe they didn't see him do his bad a** walk through the door with with his guns and roses anthem blaring in the back..

Nah your right. His 45 rd (cuz 30 is never enough. Especially when you can't shoot worth a damn) magazine scared all the 5-0 and showed them who's boss hoss.

This is twice you've advocated for fellow gun enthusiasts to get locked up. What's your deal?

You wanted people to get locked up under 594 to prove a point. Now want this guy to get grabbed for brandishing? Talk about us being our own worst enemy.....
 

Primus

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
3,939
Location
United States
I did not once ever suggest that Jason A McMillon‎ should have been arrested and locked up. Please provide a citation to where I did.
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?p=2121725

WA Legislature considering banning open carry in chambers

[quote name="Jeff Hayes" post=2121720]Carrying an LAR at the low ready is not lawful, Spencer kinda proved that. Open carrying is just fine, I have no problem with that, but that is not wha......



Here's just one instance you refer to him getting arrested. Also twice in this thread you've brought up the police there.

No one else has except in response to you bringing them up and their failing to act.
 

rapgood

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2012
Messages
598
Location
Stanwood, WA
I watched this guy all day. I can say this, I was very nervous by his behavior and was on high alert. Carrying a long gun to these rallies serves no positive purpose.
+1
In my opinion this person was carrying in a dangerous fashion, that violates the tenets of the Spencer decision and .270.

I feel as though this type of behavior does not advance the cause for liberty or open carry and does nothing to undo 594.
Yes it does violate .270 as held in Spencer.
I agree. Previous case law establishes that slung or holstered OC is lawful but taking your firearm into your hands and brandishing in this fashion is often what crosses the line on .270

I have no problem with OC where people leave their pistols and rifles holstered or slung. But when you carry them in your hands at the ready position that generates reasonable alarm.
such has been the holding in several Washington cases on violations of .270.
 
Top