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At what range should one sight his hand gun i for.

Firearms Iinstuctor

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northern wis
Uhm... I have been doing something wrong, apparently for decades. I sight for what I think will be my intended use of my carry pistols. That being: damn close to 50 feet max. Why? If you are shooting farther the question will undoubtedly be: why didn't you run away? In court at least. If you are a target / competition / hunter / pistol shooter then it may very well make sense to shoot long distance with a pistol and have your sights adjusted for such uses. YMMV. ;)

ETA - also note the good ol boy who did the shooting took a pistol (357 mag six inch barrel) that he could conceal to his friends RV, as not to draw attention to himself. Then fired from cover to ambush the loon who was attempting to ambush the officer.

So distance training with a pistol may have its defensive uses in isolated cases. :cool:

Even if you sight in for farther distances your with in a half inch of your point of aim at 50 feet.

I have been carrying a handgun for self defense and defense of others for 33 years on the job. Shooting them for another 10 plus

When I first started in in Law enforcement the standard qualifying courses all had a 50 yard stage the better shooters had no trouble keeping their rounds in the center. The best were shooting perfect scores.

I do most of hand gun training up close and personal but enough distance stuff to be confident shooting at longer ranges.

Or when I needed to I place the front sight on that nice 8 point buck at 65 yards with my 4 inch 41mag touched her off and took out both lungs. Or the coyote at 49 yards with my 3913 , or the one at 32 steps with my 2 inch revolver off hand after running a mile, practice does pay off.

All the above shots were double action I rarely shoot a double action revolver single action and double single action autos only after the first shot.
 
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cloudcroft

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"If you are shooting farther the question will undoubtedly be: why didn't you run away?" -- FreeInAZ

...we were talking about one particular self-defense scenario where L-D (Long Distance) shooting would come into play, not your USUAL situation. True, WE personally would be in no danger -- just watching other people get shot -- but some of us just MAY want to get involved and at least TRY to stop the psycho-shooter. So "running away" would not be an option. Don't care if the police, DA or judge doesn't get that but at least any saved victims would, and that's enough for me. But I should add, however, that if any of said saved victims talked to me afterwards, they WOULD be berated for not carrying themselves...

The only other POSSIBLE L-D shooting situation I can think of would be defending oneself against low-flying alien spacecraft (which calls for FMJ ammo, no HPs please). This is an important skill to have when visiting the Roswell, NM, area, I assure you. I always am on at least moderate alert when I visit there. Especially during their UFO Convention-Fiesta every July. ;-)


***********************************************

"All the above shots were double action I rarely shoot a double action revolver single action and double single action autos only after the first shot." -- Firearms Iinstuctor


I'm just the opposite: I never was able to shoot a revolver well in DA mode. Couldn't hit jack. So for L-D shots, I would ALWAYS go SA, as I need the best breaking trigger possible. That's one reason I like the 1911 -- SA only! No choice! For me, DA is for close up when you (almost) can't miss.

I don't know how people like Ed McGivern (1930s) could be so GOOD with DA revolvers (and shooting two revolvers at the same time)...he definitely was AMAZING!

[picture of Ed McGivern taken from http://harisingh.com/newsSharpShooter.htm

I have a little Beretta 3032 (Tomcat, inox) that I carry when I can't carry my larger primary semi-auto, and as per its design, it's DA for the first shot, SA after that. Works for me in that I can have a round in the chamber (unlike I do with my primary carry gun which I never carry chambered) but it's VERY safe due to the long DA trigger pull (like a revolver) for the first shot, so that in itself makes it almost impossible for a ND (Negligent Discharge) to happen, as one must intentionally DA a heavy trigger pull to fire it. Also, should my SA (Situational Awareness) slip at some point and someone gets too close to me, the Beretta is ready to go in DA mode so I can get the first shot off quickly with a good chance of hitting the target because the range is so close. After the first shot then, when the gun goes to SA trigger, I can place subsequent shots more precisely.

It goes to show that one's tactics may change depending on what gun he/she is carrying that day. My tactics when carrying the Beretta are very different that carrying my larger primary gun. The ammo is also different as well.

As I regularly try to explain to people, it's not just the gun/caliber you carry (hardware), it's also how you're going to USE it (tactics). You need BOTH parts -- hardware & tactics -- present to have a complete & effective self-defense response.

*****************************************

P.S. As for "sighting-in a handgun for a particular range" I don't mess with the sights, meaning the FRONT sight: If I need to shoot farther (L-D), I just raise the front sight up a bit. Besides, none of my handguns I presently own have adjustable sights anyway, so if any elevation corrections need to be done, it's done as they do in The Great State of Kentucky. ;-)

As long as the (fixed) sights DO shoot to point-of-aim at the usual close self-defense distances, I'm happy. If not, it's often a windage issue and I can press the dovetail rear sight right or left to fix it. As for elevation, I just GUESS. And once on, fire for effect. But with a flat-shooting handgun caliber, you sure don't have to guess very much, and since the bullet isn't dropping much, you're likely to get a solid torso hit at "great" (for a handgun) distances. You don't have to kill a "distant" psycho-shooter, just incapacitate him so he stops. So a solid hit -- lethal or not -- is the goal.

Besides, I don't want to be adding metal to my front sight OR filing it down for a specific distance...
 

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The Truth

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I blasted off a few magazines through my .460 Rowland yesterday, and my goodness that is a flat shooting pistol! I love it more every time I take it out. The max distance at the range was 57 feet and the pistol shot just as well out that far as it did at 15 feet, didn't matter if it was a heavy bullet or a light bullet. I want to start shooting it up to 100 yards though since that's pretty much what I bought it for.
 

Firearms Iinstuctor

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I blasted off a few magazines through my .460 Rowland yesterday, and my goodness that is a flat shooting pistol! I love it more every time I take it out. The max distance at the range was 57 feet and the pistol shot just as well out that far as it did at 15 feet, didn't matter if it was a heavy bullet or a light bullet. I want to start shooting it up to 100 yards though since that's pretty much what I bought it for.

Flat shooting to 57 feet or 19 yards amazing.
 

WalkingWolf

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Jul 31, 2011
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North Carolina
Very close range I do not use sights, combat range I use just the front sight. Like Skid I don't plan on shooting any bad guys at 100 yards.
 

cloudcroft

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El Paso, TX (formerly Colorado Springs, CO)
wittmeba,

Thanks for the notice -- fixed it.


*******************

Truth,

I'm jealous of your laser: Mine drops a ghastly 7" @ 200 yards...but at least it's still going 1200fps so I'll just have to be happy with that. ;-(


********************

WW,

Neither do we...it's just that we're not so limited in our thinking -- or plans. Besides, if I knew AHEAD of time I'd need to be shooting L-D, I'd bring a rifle. We all would.

You use what you have with you...


*********************



Merry Christmas to all...
 
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Firearms Iinstuctor

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I bought Ed McGivern's book back when I was 20 decades ago there is many very good ideas, techniques one can learn from it if your going to shoot double action revolvers.
 

cloudcroft

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El Paso, TX (formerly Colorado Springs, CO)
True...but I doubt even Ed would be able to duplicate Truth's shooting @ 19 yards.

Sorry, Truth, just kidding! :)


And yes, some of the dinosaurs (gone now) were a wealth of information, like Bill Jordan and Elmer Keith, to name only two...and you wouldn't want to get into a gunfight with ANY of those guys, even when they were older.

Merry Christmas...
 
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Firearms Iinstuctor

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I read most of their stuff and others over the years picking up and adapting, things that I still use. Most of all they inspired me to try and experiment. McGivern fast and accurate double action shooting Elmer long distance along with others have made me a better hand gun shot over wider variety of situations.
 

davidmcbeth

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Very close range I do not use sights, combat range I use just the front sight. Like Skid I don't plan on shooting any bad guys at 100 yards.

Well, I plan to shoot bad guys @ 100 meters, but I use my rifle for that...handgun? Very short range. People messing with sights must be going out for match competitions.

Here's a query: what % of your range time is with your rifle(s) v. handgun(s)? I go about 60% rifle, 20% handgun, 20% shotgun (when I bring all 3 to range).
 

Firearms Iinstuctor

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Well, I plan to shoot bad guys @ 100 meters, but I use my rifle for that...handgun? Very short range. People messing with sights must be going out for match competitions.

Here's a query: what % of your range time is with your rifle(s) v. handgun(s)? I go about 60% rifle, 20% handgun, 20% shotgun (when I bring all 3 to range).

The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry.

I live on my range I always have spent more time on perfecting my skills with a handgun then rifle or shotgun as though skills are harder to maintain. Skills used and learn from shooting a handgun are easier to transferred to rifle and shotgun then the other way.

Even though I have shot many 10s of thousands of rounds through all three and spent thousands hours of time with each.

Except when I have a use for a rifle or shotgun they are not kept as handy as the handgun I am wearing so what one is more likely to be the one, that one has when needed.

I have found those "People messing with sights " are those who expect the best performance from their equipment they are not satisfied with a gun that doesn't shoot to the point of aim. Often they have the skills to use the better performance.

Why would not one sight their handguns in any less then one would sight their rifle in I am not satisfied with a rifle or shotgun with sights on not shooting to the point of aim why would one want or be satisfied with ones hand gun being off.

Each to their own
 
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