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Thread: NY Gov. sued by veteran cop after insomnia treatment prompts gun confiscation

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    NY Gov. sued by veteran cop after insomnia treatment prompts gun confiscation

    A U.S. Navy veteran and retired police detective is suing New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo and other state officials for confiscating his gun permit and four handguns after he voluntarily sought medical treatment for insomnia.

    Four days after leaving the hospital, New York State police informed the Suffolk County clerk’s office that Mr. Montgomery had been determined to be a mental defective and was prohibited from owning any firearms.

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/250931668/...v-Cuomo#scribd

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...somnia-treatm/

    http://dailycaller.com/2015/01/02/ve...-for-insomnia/
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    He likely supported the laws ... sucks to be him.

    He should be in jail.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    He likely supported the laws ....
    That thought hadn't occurred to me, and I'd bet you are right.
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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    I can't really imagine that you'd sit in a hospital for four days with insomnia unless there is more to the story. I think there's more to the story.

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    Regular Member Grim_Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    I can't really imagine that you'd sit in a hospital for four days with insomnia unless there is more to the story. I think there's more to the story.
    I've personally had to deal with long bouts of insomnia. Some as long as 5+ days and required medication to force me to actually sleep. It's been proven that being awake for 17-19 hours or more has the same effect on a person as being drunk.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1739867/

    RESULTS—After 17-19 hours without sleep, corresponding to 2230 and 0100, performance on some tests was equivalent or worse than that at a BAC of 0.05%. Response speeds were up to 50% slower for some tests and accuracy measures were significantly poorer than at this level of alcohol. After longer periods without sleep, performance reached levels equivalent to the maximum alcohol dose given to subjects (BAC of 0.1%).
    CONCLUSIONS—These findings reinforce the evidence that the fatigue of sleep deprivation is an important factor likely to compromise performance of speed and accuracy of the kind needed for safety on the road and in other industrial settings.
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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Right, but I don't check myself into the hospital because I'm drunk.

    So why was he in the hospital for 4 days?

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    Regular Member Grim_Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    Right, but I don't check myself into the hospital because I'm drunk.

    So why was he in the hospital for 4 days?
    Because if after 24 hours of no sleep, you might as well be dealing with .08 BAL, 4 days of no sleep is a major medical issue that needs medical attention.

    http://www.everydayhealth.com/condit...nt-sleep-days/

    Extreme sleep deprivation can cause a whole host of mental and physical effects. Most important of them include hallucinations, delusions, cognitive impairment, heart attack, stroke and what's known as "micro-sleeps" which is where you fall asleep without your knowledge for only seconds or minutes at a time (like blacking out).

    More then likely, the mental effects of sleep deprivation are what the .gov latched onto in order to rip this guy's rights away which is complete BS.

    Several days after his first doctor’s visit, Mr. Montgomery went to the emergency room at Eastern Long Island Hospital, still suffering from insomnia. He was diagnosed with depression and insomnia, prescribed medication and told to follow up with a doctor if symptoms did not improve, The Daily Caller reported.

    On May 23, Mr. Montgomery was back in the doctor’s office with the same complaint and was monitored at the facility for 48 hours.

    Now Mr. Montgomery is alleging in the suit that hospital staff mistakenly listed him as an involuntarily admitted patient, which triggered a portion of the SAFE Act that requires health professionals to report individuals who are deemed threats to themselves or to others according to mental health directors, the Daily Caller reported.

    That notification is then reported to the department of criminal justice services.

    But Mr. Montgomery’s suit claims that there is no documentation that he was diagnosed with mental health issues.

    He was labeled as “mildly depressed,” but “insight, judgment, and impulse control are good,” the assessment reads, The Daily Caller reported.

    Four days after leaving the hospital, New York State police informed the Suffolk County clerk’s office that Mr. Montgomery had been determined to be a mental defective and was prohibited from owning any firearms.
    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    He likely supported the laws ... sucks to be him.

    He should be in jail.
    Actually, he had just moved to New York in order to be closer to family. So it's not likely that he had voted one way or the other on this.
    Last edited by Grim_Night; 01-04-2015 at 09:49 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    Right, but I don't check myself into the hospital because I'm drunk.

    So why was he in the hospital for 4 days?
    Sleep deprivation is a interrogation technique. Used to place the detainee in a reduced mental acuity state so as to be more agreeable to commands or suggestions...very effective.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    The answer to my question was he didn't spend four days in a hospital. I misread the OP.

    I know the effects of long term sleep deprivation. I went 7 days when I was 18 to see what it was like.

    I also suffer sleep disorders, which made it easier for me to conduct my little experiment.

    He spent 2 days in the hospital, being observed. That makes much more sense.

    Further he alleges the issue was a clerical error on the hospital's part, which also makes sense.

    More to the story.

    All of that was probably in the linked articles, but I can't read them because I'm on dial up. Most websites are flat out inaccessible for me. I only use things like Tapatalk since it only loads text, making it easier for my connection to handle.

    Anyway, thanks Grim for quoting the article. It made everything so much clearer.

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    Regular Member rightwinglibertarian's Avatar
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    This is a classic example of why permits should never be required or issues

    Four days after leaving the hospital, New York State police sent a letter to the Suffolk County clerk’s office stating “has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been involuntarily committed to a mental institution” and that he was prohibited from possessing any firearms.
    Unless he's been convicted of a crime then the letter is not worth the paper it's written on. May this suit be one of many that rules the (un)SAFE Act illegal as it always was.
    "Which part of shall not be infringed is so difficult to understand"?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rightwinglibertarian View Post
    This is a classic example of why permits should never be required or issues



    Unless he's been convicted of a crime then the letter is not worth the paper it's written on. May this suit be one of many that rules the (un)SAFE Act illegal as it always was.
    Well, he just handed over his guns to them, proving that he was indeed crazy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JTHunter View Post
    Much as it pains me to agree with this person, in this first part, I do agree.



    HOWEVER, why would you castigate this man? He is the one that has been wronged by a highly corrupt and flawed system. He hasn't actually done anything wrong, even IF he did support the flawed NYS system.



    Not a good idea David.
    Since he supported these laws....he should be in jail- for treason

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Since he supported these laws....he should be in jail- for treason
    Again, how did a man who just moved into the state with his family support the laws that got him into trouble?

    1. New York's (un)SAFE act was signed into law by Cuomo Jan. 2013.
    2. Mr. Montgomery moved to New York state from a different state shortly before May 6th 2014 in order to be closer to family.

    People are making assumptions about this man without any supporting facts.

    How did this man support an unjust law when he wasn't even a resident of the state at the time of it's enactment?
    Last edited by Grim_Night; 01-05-2015 at 12:52 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grim_Night View Post
    Again, how did a man who just moved into the state with his family support the laws that got him into trouble?

    1. New York's (un)SAFE act was signed into law by Cuomo Jan. 2013.
    2. Mr. Montgomery moved to New York state from a different state shortly before May 6th 2014 in order to be closer to family.

    People are making assumptions about this man without any supporting facts.

    How did this man support an unjust law when he wasn't even a resident of the state at the time of it's enactment?
    see p 145 of the complaint - he lived in the state, just moved from one location to another.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    Right, but I don't check myself into the hospital because I'm drunk.
    The effect is LIKE being drunk, as in seriously impaired.

    Severe insomnia is a horrendous mental and physical challenge just to get through basic daily life. THAT's why he checked himself in.

    So why was he in the hospital for 4 days?
    My experience with insomnia and the medicos revealed most docs and mental health people haven't the slightest freakin' clue as to how best to treat the insomnia.

    I do:

    1. Medicate (many are available)
    2. Get on a consistent schedule. This requires the full, unwaivering support of friends, family, and your boss.
    3. Get plenty of exercise each and every day.
    4. Hydrate and eat well. No alcohol (screws up insomnia something fierce).
    5. Maintain this routine for at least three weeks ever you're settled into it and getting decent sleep.
    6. Very slowly (1 to 2 weeks) wean off the meds, but leave the other elements in place.

    If I ever meet up with the flight surgeon who royally screwed up my last couple of years in the Air Force, I WILL punch him in the nose for being such a brain-dead blithering idiot. You don't play around with what you don't know. Leave it to the professionals.
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    Uggh! Conventional wisdom.

    The conventional wisdom brayed here is that insomnia is analogous to inebriation as a rationale to disarm someone else. Tsk tsk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    The conventional wisdom brayed here is that insomnia is analogous to inebriation as a rationale to disarm someone else. Tsk tsk.
    Should be the owner's choice, not the government's.

    And you shouldn't "tsk tsk" someone without having properly ascertained where they're coming from, Nightmare. You know better than that.
    Last edited by since9; 01-06-2015 at 12:58 PM.
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    A special pleading is a fallacious argument.
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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    He knew the politics of NY state, he had a choice. Vote the bums out, or move out, or never go there in the first place.

    Unless they want our sympathy New Yorkers act like they are not part of the country anyway.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    Right, but I don't check myself into the hospital because I'm drunk.

    So why was he in the hospital for 4 days?
    Not unless its a bar called "hospital" ... they got the cure for what ails ya...

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Well, he just handed over his guns to them, proving that he was indeed crazy.
    Well...... I don't know. He could play hardball and then have SWAT raid his house. Sure, he could maybe defend his property from a couple of people trying to rob him of his guns but not SWAT. Not unless he had a major Militia on standby
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    Quote Originally Posted by rightwinglibertarian View Post
    Well...... I don't know. He could play hardball and then have SWAT raid his house. Sure, he could maybe defend his property from a couple of people trying to rob him of his guns but not SWAT. Not unless he had a major Militia on standby
    SWAT is full of heroes when they raid gov't section 8 housing at 5am of some drug-head mother and 10 kids in cribs -- rushing in the morning tossing in their smokey and flash bangs.

    Not so much when they deal with a ready and sober freedom loving person.

    My state po po threatened to send a SWAT team to my house ... when I informed them that many would die attempting to breach my land and dwelling they thought maybe it would be a bad idea and cancelled their party. Of course, they had no legal right to enter my land ~~ why die when you are in the wrong I figure was their mentality. No heroes visited me...I was saddened by their flip-flop.

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    SWAT is full of heroes when they raid gov't section 8 housing at 5am of some drug-head mother and 10 kids in cribs -- rushing in the morning tossing in their smokey and flash bangs.

    Not so much when they deal with a ready and sober freedom loving person.

    My state po po threatened to send a SWAT team to my house ... when I informed them that many would die attempting to breach my land and dwelling they thought maybe it would be a bad idea and cancelled their party. Of course, they had no legal right to enter my land ~~ why die when you are in the wrong I figure was their mentality. No heroes visited me...I was saddened by their flip-flop.
    Do you have any bridges or swamp land for sale?
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    Do you have any bridges or swamp land for sale?
    Well, I drove through NY and got insomnia ... who do I sue for that?

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