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Thread: Female owner of gun range bans muslims

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    Regular Member OC Freedom's Avatar
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    Female owner of gun range bans muslims

    A follow up story since she has placed a ban on Muslims in her gun range. WOW, what a woman

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/01/28...cmp=latestnews

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    Activist Member JamesCanby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    The range is probably indeed violating the public accommodations provision of the federal Civil Rights Act of 1964, though that’s not completely clear. The Act applies to only particular classes of businesses: [qv]
    [ ... ]
    But, in any event, Arkansas antidiscrimination law is broader, and does cover shooting ranges that are generally open to the public: ... http://law.justia.com/codes/arkansas...-1/16-123-102/

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/v...clude-muslims/
    OTOH, if the range operates as a private club, it is exempt and can pick and choose which persons are allowed to use the range. Most ranges I know require membership.
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    Regular Member Kopis's Avatar
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    Funny article


    In the five months since Jan Morgan banned Muslims from her gun range in Hot Springs, Ark., business has boomed and predictions of a lawsuit brought by federal civil rights enforcers have so far proved inaccurate.
    Morgan claims business has “quadrupled” with people from out of state coming to the range and some even offering donations for what they predict will be a legal battle. She also said she has been threatened, which she responded to by posting her home address on the range website and daring those issuing threats to do so in person.

    “I am the infidel your Imam warned you about,” Morgan wrote under an image of her packing heat.
    i half suspect business was down so she did this as a publicity stunt. Free advertising. Hot springs is mostly rednecks who will come out of the woodworks to support her.

    .... but she has gotten threats, which she brushed off.
    duh, she's obviously armed and well trained.

    result in a hostile environment for ordinary Muslims in Arkansas
    i used to live there. it's just hostile for muslims period.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesCanby View Post
    OTOH, if the range operates as a private club, it is exempt and can pick and choose which persons are allowed to use the range. Most ranges I know require membership.
    I'm shaking my head at this one ....

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    Interestingly, while the government will presume to tell the owner that she can't discriminate, it will also turn around and hold her liable if one of her customers does something untoward while using the range or perhaps even with a gun purchased at the store. She is expected to discriminate individually against anyone who gives the slightest hint that he might do something bad, but is barred from discriminating against groups that she believes may pose a higher risk of having members likely to do something bad. We don't trust her judgment when it comes to groups, but will require almost super-human judgment and prescience when it comes to individuals. Makes sense to me.

    Personally, I think her blanket ban of everyone she suspects of being Muslim is about as intelligent as the typical public-school "zero tolerance" policy. OTOH, it is her business and I think it rather presumptuous of anyone else to tell her how to run it so long as she is running it peacefully. And I say this as a member of a religion probably only slightly less unpopular in her neck of the woods than is Islam.

    Charles

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    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by utbagpiper View Post
    ...And I say this as a member of a religion probably only slightly less unpopular in her neck of the woods than is Islam.
    I think you greatly exaggerate the perception - from my experience in Texas- that Mormons are to be feared for wanting to cut off heads of unbelievers. Houston, Dallas, Austin, and El Paso included. Might be some resentment (of anyone) in deep East Texas woods like Liberty or Woodville, but certainly not medium to larger towns in Texas.


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    Wow. A religious test for a gun range.

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    Regular Member The Truth's Avatar
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    Xenophobes are funny, if not a little bit pathetic.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator
    So in actuality you have no evidence that anything wrong took place, you only believe that it could be spun to appear wrong. But it hasn't been. The truth has a funny way of coming out with persistence, even if it was spun negatively the truth would find its way because these people will not accept less.
    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    The truth causes some people so much pain they can only respond with impotent laughable insults. Life must be rough for those people.

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Just a guess, but I think I hear the whistle of two trains on the same track.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HPmatt View Post
    I think you greatly exaggerate the perception - from my experience in Texas- that Mormons are to be feared for wanting to cut off heads of unbelievers. Houston, Dallas, Austin, and El Paso included. Might be some resentment (of anyone) in deep East Texas woods like Liberty or Woodville, but certainly not medium to larger towns in Texas.
    I do exaggerate a bit, I'm sure. But maybe not as much as some may suppose.

    While anti-discrimination laws and such will keep a damper on various feelings of unkindness, they are still far too common. Mormons are not generally to be feared over any threat of physical violence. But to some sects, Mormons present an even greater risk: the risk of drawing away "real Christians" into a cult such that those Christians lose their souls by being tricked into worshiping the "wrong" Jesus. And it isn't like the incidents involving the Polygamous FLDS in Waco did much to engender even mainstream Mormons to many who are still not quite sure that the LDS Church ended the practice of polygamy some 100 years ago.

    This is, of course, mostly off topic, and mostly in good fun on my part, except to point out that when I suggest a business owner in the South be legally permitted to engage in peaceful discrimination that I and others find offensive, it is with full knowledge that said business owner may very well apply such discrimination to me and mine. It isn't like I'm just ok with the other guy being denied service while I presume I would never have an issue. I believe there are a few, rare business owners who deny service to me on pretty much equal basis to those rare, few business owners who would deny service to Muslims or any other minority group.

    To paraphrase something Jefferson supposedly said about mandatory education: I think it is better (at least in 2015 and the future) to tolerate the rare case of a business owner discriminating, than it is to give government the power to prevent all such discrimination.

    On some issues, my libertarian side pokes through a bit.

    Charles

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    Regular Member twoskinsonemanns's Avatar
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    A despicable policy. I wouldn't give them my business. Of course she has the right to do it and I respect it.
    "I support the ban on assault weapons" - Donald Trump

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twoskinsonemanns View Post
    A despicable policy. I wouldn't give them my business. Of course she has the right to do it and I respect it.
    That is the way I see it, her business, her right, but I find it disgusting.
    It is well that war is so terrible – otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by utbagpiper View Post
    <snip>

    On some issues, my libertarian side pokes through a bit.

    Charles
    U a registered Libertarian Charles?

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    Regular Member The Truth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    Just a guess, but I think I hear the whistle of two trains on the same track.
    Sic semper evello mortem tyrannis.

    μολὼν λαβέ

    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator
    So in actuality you have no evidence that anything wrong took place, you only believe that it could be spun to appear wrong. But it hasn't been. The truth has a funny way of coming out with persistence, even if it was spun negatively the truth would find its way because these people will not accept less.
    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    The truth causes some people so much pain they can only respond with impotent laughable insults. Life must be rough for those people.

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    Regular Member twoskinsonemanns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    That is the way I see it, her business, her right, but I find it disgusting.
    This exactly.
    "I support the ban on assault weapons" - Donald Trump

    We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission - Ayn Rand

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    U a registered Libertarian Charles?
    Nope.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    The only thing worse than bigots is a state getting involved.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
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    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
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    Regular Member ron73440's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    The only thing worse than bigots is a state getting involved.
    Great way to put it.
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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    bigot: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance
    This term is too often flung at folks. She stated exactly why she prohibits Muslims on her website. http://janmorganmedia.com/2014/09/bu...lim-free-zone/

    Does she hate Muslims? I do not know. I suspect that her being labeled a bigot to be uncivil and bigoted.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member Custodian's Avatar
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    She is a certifiable cutie to be reasonably xenophobic.

    I can't hate on any woman who handles guns too much Or owns a firearm related business.

    After reading her reasons, I get why she does what she does as a private business owner.

    You know if only someone else had the guts to be just as concerned about a cadre of middle eastern men being taught how to fly planes without learning how to land, in oh say around the years 2000 to 2001? And perhaps just maybe we'll barring them from learning?

    In the end, her business, her livelihood, her cause, her call.
    Last edited by Custodian; 01-30-2015 at 12:20 PM. Reason: no spellcheck
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    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
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    I think she should adjust her stance to one similar to the Texas House Rep from Killeen/Ft Hood - pledge allegiance to US and its laws and denounce islamic terrorism - under Israeli flag...

    http://www.bigcountryhomepage.com/st...V0WwmF3yVeeg1w


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    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
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    Of course Koran allows muslims to lie in order to advance Islam...so a pledge by a muslim really doesn't mean anything you could trust - from your status as an infidel.


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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    This term is too often flung at folks. She stated exactly why she prohibits Muslims on her website. http://janmorganmedia.com/2014/09/bu...lim-free-zone/

    Does she hate Muslims? I do not know. I suspect that her being labeled a bigot to be uncivil and bigoted.
    Perhaps I should have said perceived bigot. I could care less what she does with her private property. Some want to call her a bigot for her refusal to serve someone else and many would call in the state for the solution. Which is the worse thing that could be done even if she was a 100% bigot, racist, xenophobe, homophobe etc....
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Perhaps I should have said perceived bigot. I could care less what she does with her private property. Some want to call her a bigot for her refusal to serve someone else and many would call in the state for the solution. Which is the worse thing that could be done even if she was a 100% bigot, racist, xenophobe, homophobe etc....
    The loss of private property rights is the harbinger of the loss of freedom IMHO. More people should not care what she does with her private property, once the public cares and regulates private property freedom is no longer an option.
    Throw me to the wolves and I will come back leading the pack.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    The loss of private property rights is the harbinger of the loss of freedom IMHO. More people should not care what she does with her private property, once the public cares and regulates private property freedom is no longer an option.
    Exactly!
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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