FBrinson
Regular Member
Proof?
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History of bumper stickers
- Thread starter WalkingWolf
- Start date
Proof?
I would take exception to that and noticed the broad brush you used.
Discounting the humorous, tongue-in-cheek, suggestions, there remains an extremely small few that might be seen as supporting "the end justifies the means" tactics or philosophy. Your comment does quite well describe the perceived position of the antis though.
By and large, the people on this forum understand the difference between breaking the law/harming someone and being good responsible stewards.
utbagpiper
Banned
Citations or evidence to support your broad brush against "most of the people on this forum"?
I find your post insulting, as well as rather ironic. Why would you want any association with a group of people whom you believe to have so low regard for private property rights as you accuse the members of this forum of?
For that matter, since you clearly cannot post anything to support your claim against "most of the people on this forum", I challenge you to post any evidence of widespread disregard for the property or persons of anti-gunners by pro-gun activists in this nation generally. It seems we are far more likely to see OC activists harassed by gun haters than anything the other direction.
But do feel free to back up your offensive claims with whatever citations or evidence you can muster.
Charles
DrakeZ07
Regular Member
Hey, a lot of people use a broad brush by painting every single liberal as being anti-gun, just giving you guys a taste of your own medicine. #DealWithIt.
J_dazzle23
Regular Member
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2013
- Messages
- 643
By definition, in compliance with current social norms and mores, to identify yourself as "liberal" would include being anti-personal possession of firearms.
democrat=/=liberal
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You are essentially saying that two wrongs make a right and flexing muscle you do not possess.
Deal with it I will, if I must.
utbagpiper
Banned
First of all, two wrongs don't make a right.
Secondly, sometimes stereotypes exist for a reason. I would be thrilled if the Democrats and Republicans would work to prove each is the most pro-RKBA party in existence and that both are more pro-RKBA than any third party. But the reality is that one is hard pressed to find pro-RKBA democrats elected to office. Would that you could persuade a lot of your fellow liberals to insist on democrat candidates supporting RKBA as the essential civil right it is.
Thirdly, I'm among those who has made very clear that I and the organization I run are strictly single issue. Among our principals is a conservative, a libertarian, and a (pro-RKBA) liberal.
Finally, what do you mean by "you guys?" Are you deliberately trying to separate yourselves from the RKBA and OC community here at OCDO? And if so, yet again, I have to ask why you are maintaining association with those with whom you don't want to have association? I can only imagine how liberals, homosexuals, or atheists on this list would react if a God-fearing, heterosexual, conservative were to use a term like "you guys" or "you people" in reference to them.
You should demonstrate at least that level of maturity and civility you expect to receive from others.
Charles
J_dazzle23
Regular Member
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2013
- Messages
- 643
Originally Posted by Grapeshot
No need to pile on - the point has been made and my warning issued.
Please return to the OP of this thread.
It is not copyrighted nor trade marked (well maybe a little) - anyone may use it.
stealthyeliminator
Regular Member
Am I the only one that thinks the point of the OP was completely missed?
I could be wrong, but I understood WW to be addressing the... discrepancy, between the substantiveness and volume of speech.
I don't think that WW meant to say that there is never a need for more than a few words to communicate or discuss an idea. What he's saying is that too often people, especially politicians, use a large volume of words to communicate almost or actually no idea, no meaning, sometimes even to the point of completely avoiding answering or addressing whatever question or issue prompted them to speak in the first place.
eta - Sometimes all that is actually needed is a short and direct response. Not always, but probably far more often than a short and direct response is given.
I could be wrong, but I understood WW to be addressing the... discrepancy, between the substantiveness and volume of speech.
I don't think that WW meant to say that there is never a need for more than a few words to communicate or discuss an idea. What he's saying is that too often people, especially politicians, use a large volume of words to communicate almost or actually no idea, no meaning, sometimes even to the point of completely avoiding answering or addressing whatever question or issue prompted them to speak in the first place.
eta - Sometimes all that is actually needed is a short and direct response. Not always, but probably far more often than a short and direct response is given.
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utbagpiper
Banned
The thread has certainly wandered off of the OP's intended thesis. But that thesis was quite well covered in the first few posts.
Sometimes a bumper sticker is fine. But in many cases, bumper sticker responses lead to bumper sticker politics: shallow without any nuance or real thought.
And besides, this is a discussion board, not a twitter feed.
Charles
WalkingWolf
Regular Member
Ayup! That is it in a nutshell. Bumper stickers just limit the amount of words that will fit on a bumper to convey a message. Politicians should have word limit, or at least be forced by the media to get to, and actually make a point.
I am pretty much a walking bumper sticker, blunt to the point. IMO the BOR were bumper sticker amendments. Short and to the point.
utbagpiper
Banned
Politicians pander to voters; the media panders to advertisers and consumers.
I'll take a nice, long Lincoln-Douglas style debate over focus-group-perfected sound bites any day. But most voters won't; so we won't ever get real depth.
At the risk of being too verbose, I think the problem boils down to how most voters "grade" politicians. They start all candidates at 100 and knock off points for every disagreement. The guy who never really agreed with them, but never disagreed, gets 100% while the guy who strongly agreed 9 times and disagreed on one small issue gets 90% and loses to their vote.
A more prudent course, IMO, is to start all candidates at 0 and then add points for correct positions. In this case, the respective scores are 0 and 90 and the 90 wins.
A more complex twist on this is to start at zero and add points for good positions while subtracting points for really bad positions, doing nothing for areas of disagreement that don't really matter much.
The entire constitution is short and to the point. Good constitutional language requires that as it addresses high level principles. Statutes will, of necessity be longer as they address specifics.
Brevity can be a real gift in many situations. Heaven knows liberals have perfected the art of grabbing emotions using sound bites.
But to truly teach or explain--as opposed to simply asserting--can take more than just a sound bite. Good teachers have long known about different learning styles and are able to explain a concept at least a couple of different ways so that everyone has a chance of seeing an explanation that makes sense to them.
Charles
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
Some people are windbags.
I used to have a variety of bumper stickers on my first truck, until one day a fella got his panties in a wad over my opinions and picked a fight. My grandpa pointed out to me that if I don't like his response to my opinion, maybe I should consider how he learned of my opinion. When you sit and think about it for a bit, it does make sense.
So unless you're ready for a fight, don't be so willing to express your opinion.
Say, now that I think of it, that is EXACTLY what Grape has told me one or twice....
utbagpiper
Banned
I'd settle for abolishing sound bites from politicians in favor of real answers.
OC for ME
Regular Member
"Bumper sticker" politics: Yes or No...he or thee...the ballot box. How many of our fellow citizens (that actually vote) really take the time to educate themselves about that which directs their future?
I ask every politician I happen to engage just one question..."What is your position on RSMo 21.750.3?" I get a 1000 yard stare back and then explain what that RSMo is and my disappointment that he/she knew nothing about it, never heard of it. Then I ask, what "...shall not be questioned" means to them." Again, I am usually disappointed in their response.
Bumper sticker politics comes in handy since the memory of a political critter is around that of a dog's. Simple, short and to the point slogans usually are easy to remember, even for a political critter.
The issue I have with "long Lincoln-Douglas style debates" is that constitutional principals are rarely held up as the foundation of any politicians platform.
I ask every politician I happen to engage just one question..."What is your position on RSMo 21.750.3?" I get a 1000 yard stare back and then explain what that RSMo is and my disappointment that he/she knew nothing about it, never heard of it. Then I ask, what "...shall not be questioned" means to them." Again, I am usually disappointed in their response.
Bumper sticker politics comes in handy since the memory of a political critter is around that of a dog's. Simple, short and to the point slogans usually are easy to remember, even for a political critter.
WalkingWolf
Regular Member
One of the most decisive/effective short phrase shaped the election that gave Billy Boy his first win, "It's the economy stupid". And that was actually a bumper sticker, the other was "Read my lips".