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Thread: You don't need your gun

  1. #1
    Regular Member Griz's Avatar
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    You don't need your gun

    St. Louis Police chief calls for the law-abiding to leave their guns at home.

    http://www.gunssavelife.com/?p=16406

    Think I will bring it with me anyway.

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    If the 400 cameras that Dimwit Dotson talked about are so good then why is the Loo crime rate so high?

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    The linked article implies that Dotson had some direct command and control over Ferguson. Obviously, he is not the chief in Ferguson. But perhaps it refers to the "protests", violence and incidents that occurred within the City of St. Louis during the rest of the Ferguson stuff.

    There has long been a perceived disconnect between most of the "street cops" in St. Louis and the St. Louis police leadership. I remember the first two reported uses of a CC weapon after CCW passed in MO were both in St. Louis, both resulted in shots fired and both stopped attempted muggings, at least according to contemporary reporting. In both incidents the St. Louis police leadership, more accurately referred to as the St. Louis PD political leadership, were wringing hands about the delicate snowflakes who were starting school in the fall and getting their lives together and whatever, who were injured while attempting a violent crime and more guns on the street. The victims in both cases reported that the on the scene street cops all but congratulated them on effective use of self-defense. It was well remarked at the time that there was a complete disconnect between the beat cop and the downtown leadership. I would assume this is still predominately true.

    Dotson, from all appearance, is a political tool who says the things that please his liberal minded political masters. But one has to remember that inside the I-270 loop, St. Louis politics is often little different than Chicago and New Jersey. It is a strangled city surrounded by a county containing 91 separate municipalities and unincorporated areas. They can't consolidate like Indianapolis, facing similar conditions in the late 60s, did so very successfully. The interior of St. Louis city is further divided into little fiefdoms vehemently defended by the arrogant and intractable council members who typically accomplish little more than a room of screaming children fighting over who gets to play with the firetruck next recess. The county municipalities don't want to give up their fiefdoms, the unincorporated areas don't want to be strangled by regulation and none of them want to inherit St. Louis' numerous structural problems.

    None of that is to defend Dotson, however, St. Louis City and its County is a unique animal in many aspects. Dotson is so didactic that I assume he believes at least a good portion of is proselytizing and he is such a jerk about it that I am loathe to give him any benefit of the doubt. However, St. Louis City and County are the local government equivalent of a Facebook status of "it's complicated".

    All that being said, and I have a lot of friends, history and time in and around St. Louis (as well as a wife who has generational roots), I always carry 2 extra mags when going to St. Louis, even to white bread South County away from the MetroLink routes.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gutshot View Post
    None of us should lose sight of the fact that the Governor of Md. is a Republican and the City of Baltimore is and has been run by Democrats for decades. There is no love lost between these two political factions and either side would love to shift the blame for this situation and the responsibility for dealing with it on to the other. If I were Hogan, Id let Baltimore deal with there own problems. If the state gets involved in this sooner or later the whole thing will be the Republicans fault. I know some will say that Hogan has a responsibility to the citizens of Baltimore, but those citizens elected this city government, let those elected officials deal with the result of their corrupt policies.

    I think you may have intended to post in the Maryland forum about the Baltimore riots?
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    You know, I believe to the contrary when, while I was passing through STL to see the Arch, I stopped for direction at a gas station, who said to leave immediately and go to a particular gas station further away since I was white, and would probably be robbed in the next 5 minutes if I stuck around any longer.

    that tells me I NEED my guns when going to STL, thanks..

  6. #6
    Regular Member Griz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezek View Post
    You know, I believe to the contrary when, while I was passing through STL to see the Arch, I stopped for direction at a gas station, who said to leave immediately and go to a particular gas station further away since I was white, and would probably be robbed in the next 5 minutes if I stuck around any longer.

    that tells me I NEED my guns when going to STL, thanks..
    my wife has had that very same conversation in the same area. still can't convince her to carry.

  7. #7
    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
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    You don't need your gun

    I always think of Chevy Chase in Family Vacation when I hear 'St Louis'. Looks like nothing has changed in 30 years. Only other noteworthy item is how the Federal Judge 'fixed' E St Louis? schools with $1 billion he stole from property owners-assume he is retired on his Federal pension in FL while schools are still cheating students out of their education.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by HPmatt; 05-01-2015 at 08:09 AM.
    Men live without other security than what their own strength and their own invention shall furnish them"
    -Thomas Hobbes 1651

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    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezek View Post
    You know, I believe to the contrary when, while I was passing through STL to see the Arch, I stopped for direction at a gas station, who said to leave immediately and go to a particular gas station further away since I was white, and would probably be robbed in the next 5 minutes if I stuck around any longer.
    that tells me I NEED my guns when going to STL, thanks..
    It has been many years since I visited St Loo. The last time we were there, we got a flat tire on the rental in a very dicey neihborhood. Sweet Baboo watched over me with pistol in hand while I quickly replaced it and got out of the goramm area.
    I did not leave anything behind and will not be returning.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie View Post
    ...goramm...
    You just made my morning.

  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    I find it sad that so many have had bad experiences in St. Louis. North City and more and more, North County, are quite sketchy. Besides that, problem areas tend to be in pockets, often surrounded by wonderful tourist areas, dining opportunities and night life. South and west county areas are generally as safe as any near suburban area elsewhere. St. Charles City and County is truly suburban and feels as safe as any populated suburban area I have visited. It is 15 minutes and a world away from the north city crime.

    There are some truly wonderful things in and about the St. Louis metro area. Unfortunately, it is not wise to wander off too far from tourist corridors trying to find hidden jewels as you could find yourself in a pocket of "oh heck no - turn around" a few blocks away from stunning homes and world class tourist attractions.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  11. #11
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gutshot View Post
    Are he and his men going to leave their's at home?
    No, they will just continue to create the justification for their own existence by inciting (and subsequently encouraging) riots, while discouraging any means of addressing the problem which don't involve more law enforcement.

    Americans can learn to get along, but not until the police stop standing in the way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Griz View Post
    my wife has had that very same conversation in the same area. still can't convince her to carry.


    this was actually before I acquired my SR9 so I didn't have a sidearm at the time. So end result, I left immediately... with keys between fingers to act like jabbing utensils if necessary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie View Post
    ...goramm...
    Quote Originally Posted by jackrockblc View Post
    You just made my morning.

    That makes 3 of us. Shiny.
    "Somebody ever tries to kill you, you try and kill em right back!" - Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9026543 View Post
    If the 400 cameras that Dimwit Dotson talked about are so good then why is the Loo crime rate so high?
    More firearms in the hands of honest, law-abiding citizens --> fewer and less violent crimes per capita.

    How is it POSSIBLE that college graduates like St. Louis Metro Police Chief Sam Dotson find themselves incapable of understanding this simple, repeatedly verified truth? Do they attend a special brain-washing class designed to actually turn them into blithering idiots?
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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    Regular Member Richieg150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    More firearms in the hands of honest, law-abiding citizens --> fewer and less violent crimes per capita.

    How is it POSSIBLE that college graduates like St. Louis Metro Police Chief Sam Dotson find themselves incapable of understanding this simple, repeatedly verified truth? Do they attend a special brain-washing class designed to actually turn them into blithering idiots?
    Pretty much hits the nail on the head !!
    Psalm 144:1 Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight:
    Psalm 144:2 My goodness, and my fortress; my high tower, and my deliverer; my shield, and he in whom I trust; who subdueth my people under me. Pro 14:15 The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going.

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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    Do they attend a special brain-washing class designed to actually turn them into blithering idiots?

    Yes. It's called "college".
    "Somebody ever tries to kill you, you try and kill em right back!" - Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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