Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: It's an opportunity to educate...

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Colorado Springs, Colorado, USA
    Posts
    6,787

    It's an opportunity to educate...

    As in this Walmart checkout lady. This may have been discussed on OCDO before, but perhaps not as a "Why Open Carry" topic. Some hindsight on what I might have said differently:

    Lady: "We don't know yet, so we're trying to find out..."

    Me: "I'd be happy to provide you with links to both Walmart Corporate Policy, as well as to state and federal law."

    Lady: "You're not a cop."

    Me: "Actually, I'm a writer. I sometimes serve as an usher at my church."

    Lady: "In New York, I know about the rules."

    Me: "Different state, different rules."

    Lady: "Well, it doesn't matter. I don't feel comfortable with someone in the store, with a gun, and there's a lot of people around. I'm from New York, and I don't feel comfortable with a gun around."

    Me: "Actually, it does matter. Open carry is legal here in Virginia, and Walmart policy is to abide by local and state law."

    Lady: "I don't understand what's the purpose of coming to a grocery store with a nine millimeter or a nine Glock. That's why I'm uncomfortable."

    Me: "Well, I'm uncomfortable with bad guys. The purpose, the reason why we law-abiding citizens carry firearms, is for self-defense. Bad guys do exist. We wear seat belts for the same reason. Getting into an accident is unlikely, but we buckle up just the same."

    There's nothing wrong with putting people on defensive, provided it's done politely and with respect. If you find yourself on the defensive, you're behind the power curve.

    There are some people, however, with whom you'll never win, and at those times, it's often best to simply state (keeping the upper hand), "While I respect your opinion, Sir/Ma'am, please respect mine. I will continue to open carry commensurate with local, state, and federal law."

    https://youtu.be/ku3UjRr9YPQ
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

  2. #2
    Regular Member solus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    here nc
    Posts
    6,866
    video is almost 3 years ??

    your point?

    ipse
    Last edited by solus; 04-28-2015 at 04:33 PM.
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  3. #3
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    White Oak Plantation
    Posts
    12,272
    You wear a seat belt cuz the cops will give you a ticket if you do not. A seat belt only comes in handy if you get in a wreck, if you never get in a wreck why do you need to wear a seat belt...why do you get a ticket for not using something that you may never need to rely upon.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  4. #4
    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    3,318
    "I'm sorry for the indoctrination you've suffered, but people should not forfeit their rights to accommodate unreasonable sensibilities."
    Advocate freedom please

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southeast, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    5,974
    What was said at the very end? I couldn't understand it.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  6. #6
    Regular Member Trakanon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    22
    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post

    Lady: "I don't understand what's the purpose of coming to a grocery store with a nine millimeter or a nine Glock. That's why I'm uncomfortable."

    Me: "Well, I'm uncomfortable with bad guys. The purpose, the reason why we law-abiding citizens carry firearms, is for self-defense. Bad guys do exist. We wear seat belts for the same reason. Getting into an accident is unlikely, but we buckle up just the same."
    I think many people have been lulled into a false sense of security because they have lived their entire lives without ever been the victim of a crime of any kind. Bad guys being bad is something they see on TV or hear about happening to other people, so it's something they feel immune to. Seeing someone armed likely shatters that world view. They think that the police will swoop in at the first sign of trouble and save the day. But the reality is that when violent crime goes down, the first responder is you, the armed citizen, not the police that show up 5-7 minutes later.

  7. #7
    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    6,520
    "And I think people should mind their own f---ing business; so I guess neither of us is getting what we want today."
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Thru Death's Door in Wisconsin
    Posts
    13,151
    Quote Originally Posted by Trakanon View Post
    I think many people have been lulled into a false sense of security because they have lived their entire lives without ever been the victim of a crime of any kind. [ ... ]
    That is not false security, but is actual experience of security. The Pareto Distribution (extreme stuff is infrequent, 80%/20%, 20%/80%, trivial stuff all the time) applies as well to social frequency distributions.

    Vilfredo Pareto (1848 - 1923) Italian polymath. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_principle

    It is why I am absolutely unconcerned of SHTF, asteroids, EMP, et cetera. It hasn't happened yet and isn't likely to happen in my lifetime or ever.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  9. #9
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    Planet Earth
    Posts
    17
    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    That is not false security, but is actual experience of security. The Pareto Distribution (extreme stuff is infrequent, 80%/20%, 20%/80%, trivial stuff all the time) applies as well to social frequency distributions.

    Vilfredo Pareto (1848 - 1923) Italian polymath. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_principle

    It is why I am absolutely unconcerned of SHTF, asteroids, EMP, et cetera. It hasn't happened yet and isn't likely to happen in my lifetime or ever.
    That is a very dangerous mindset to have.

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Thru Death's Door in Wisconsin
    Posts
    13,151
    Quote Originally Posted by Wild Dog View Post
    That is a very dangerous mindset to have.
    Really? Care to provide some precise statistics on those hazards?

    Wild Dog is busy chasing his dangerous tail, that he'll never catch.

    Read Nassim Nicholas Taleb on The Impact of the Highly Improbable and Things That Gain From Disorder.

    http://www.amazon.com/Black-Swan-Imp.../dp/1400063515

    http://www.amazon.com/Antifragile-Th.../dp/0812979680

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nassim_Nicholas_Taleb

    I am a sustaining contributor to The Wikimedia Foundation.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 06-07-2015 at 09:13 AM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  11. #11
    Regular Member HPmatt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Dallas
    Posts
    1,597

    It's an opportunity to educate...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Really? Care to provide some precise statistics on those hazards?
    With rise of Chinese, Norks and Iranians w ICBM capabilities, and the CME coronal Mass Ejections of Malmo 2003, Quebec 1989 and the Carrington event of 1859, the risk of loss of electricity for and extended period of weeks, months is growing in probability to threaten our civilization here in the US.

    Now what we personally can do about it - is very little, it worth discussing the threat - with say the Texas legislature - to urge them to harden the Texas electrical generating plants and grid from this event.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by HPmatt; 06-07-2015 at 09:35 AM.
    “Men live without other security than what their own strength and their own invention shall furnish them"
    -Thomas Hobbes 1651

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Thru Death's Door in Wisconsin
    Posts
    13,151
    So much for education. There are none so blind as those that will not see. The clue-by-four is in Taleb's books.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  13. #13
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    White Oak Plantation
    Posts
    12,272
    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    So much for education. There are none so blind as those that will not see. The clue-by-four is in Taleb's books.
    ...and, I never let my schooling interfere with my education.

    Sound advice...me thinks.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    northern wis
    Posts
    3,194
    Could it happen, can it happen, well it happen and to what extent.

    That's a good question.

    Just last August we lost power for 5 days and had a 11 inches of rain in 5 days. With out my generator and the 10 gallons of gas I had on hand I would have lost a freezer full of food. My basement would have been flooded and I would have lost a lot of valuable goods.

    Being prepared is a good idea what one prepares for how much one prepares is up to the person doing so.


    If one wants to play the odds of some thing happening so be it but then one well not prepare for a lot of things because the odds of them happening are really low.

    Carry a firearm for self defense is one of them. Unless one travels to or lives in a high crime area the odds of using one in a self-defense situation is very low.

    Each to their own.
    Personal Defensive Solutions professional personal firearms, edge weapons and hands on defensive training and tactics pdsolutions@hotmail.com

    Any and all spelling errors are just to give the spelling Nazis something to do

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Thru Death's Door in Wisconsin
    Posts
    13,151
    IOW Whateveerr. Talk to da han'!
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Logan 5's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    690
    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    As in this Walmart checkout lady. This may have been discussed on OCDO before, but perhaps not as a "Why Open Carry" topic. Some hindsight on what I might have said differently:

    -snip-

    There's nothing wrong with putting people on defensive, provided it's done politely and with respect. If you find yourself on the defensive, you're behind the power curve.

    There are some people, however, with whom you'll never win, and at those times, it's often best to simply state (keeping the upper hand), "While I respect your opinion, Sir/Ma'am, please respect mine. I will continue to open carry commensurate with local, state, and federal law."
    Ok, several things to consider, a couple that have already been brought up but I do not see answered yet-

    1. This is an old video. Why now?
    2. Why did you stay when she had a fit? Just leave and take your business elsewhere.
    3. Why did you even bother going there to begin with?
    Lifetime member, Gun Owners of America (http://gunowners.org/)
    Lifetime member, Jews for the Preservation of Firearm Ownership (http://jpfo.org/)
    Member, Fraternal Order of Eagles since 8/02 (http://www.foe.com/)

    Registering gun owners to prevent crime, is like registering Jews to prevent a HOLOCAUST.

    I am not a lawyer in real life, or in play life. So anything I say is for debate and discussion only.

  17. #17
    Newbie
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Dallas TX
    Posts
    7
    Lady: "In New York, I know about the rules."

    Here in Texas we have a saying. Love New York! Take I-30 East...

    Getting the populace used to seeing people armed is my main reason for O/C. It will take time and goodwill on our part but eventually it will be seen as normal.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •