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Thread: COSTCO Corporate Formally Bans Firearms

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    COSTCO Corporate Formally Bans Firearms

    Sadly, it appears Costco Corporate has bought into the insanely stupid anti-gun crowd mentality of the blitheringly idiotic left. Their membership page specifically states, "Costco policy prohibits firearms to be brought into the warehouse, except in the case of authorized law enforcement officers."

    That applies throughout all their stores in the United States.

    Perhaps they did this in response to the Sterling Shooting:

    When asked whether he believed five shots was excessive, Loudoun Commonwealth's Attorney Jim Plowman said "even after [Scott] was struck four times she continued to walk the floor for a little bit." According to the report detailing the incident, Scott had no reaction to the first shot. Unsure of whether he hit her, the deputy fired again. She then fell to the ground with both weapons still clutched in her hands.


    Well, which is it? Did "she continue to walk the floor for a little bit" or did she "fall to the ground" at the second shot? If so, why was she shot five times if the second shot successfully stopped her?

    Of the four deputies that responded to the store at Price Cascades Parkway, one was struck in the leg by one of the five shots fired during the incident. Plowman said it's likely the deputy was struck by a ricocheting bullet, but it's not exactly known how he was hit.


    Oh, hey - nice shooting, Tex! By the way, JHP bullets that impact center body mass do not ricochet. Very few ever do penetrate, and of those that do, there's not enough of the bullet or velocity left to do more than cause minor injury. Regardless, with "protection" like that, who needs criminals?

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    Until Costco reviews the findings from the Centers for Disease Control report on Gun Violence in America1 and revise their position to match reality -- armed citizens make for a polite society -- I will not be renewing my membership. As with all so-called "gun-free zones," Costco is no longer safe!

    1Guns are used for self-defense often and effectively. Specifically, “Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year … in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008,” says the report. The three million figure is probably high, “based on an extrapolation from a small number of responses taken from more than 19 national surveys.” But a much lower estimate of 108,000 also seems fishy, “because respondents were not asked specifically about defensive gun use.” Furthermore, “Studies that directly assessed the effect of actual defensive uses of guns (i.e., incidents in which a gun was 'used' by the crime victim in the sense of attacking or threatening an offender) have found consistently lower injury rates among gun-using crime victims compared with victims who used other self-protective strategies.”
    Last edited by since9; 06-01-2015 at 12:30 AM. Reason: adding some links
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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    Because of a shooting by LEO they want to ban non-LEO patrons from carrying? That's truly bizarre.

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    Regular Member Grim_Night's Avatar
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    Um... This is all old news. Costco has banned lawfully carried firearms from their "members" for as long as I can remember. It's in their contracts.
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    Quote Originally Posted by randian View Post
    Because of a shooting by LEO they want to ban non-LEO patrons from carrying? That's truly bizarre.
    No. COSTCO has never been gun friendly. Their reasoning is probably more bizarre and full of faulty logic than we can surmise. The most bizarre thing is that the company continue to thrive, despite its anti-gun stand. Same with Starbucks and a lot of other anti-gun companies. Such is life.

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    Regular Member cjohnson44546's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grim_Night View Post
    Um... This is all old news. Costco has banned lawfully carried firearms from their "members" for as long as I can remember. It's in their contracts.
    its not. The membership agreement I signed never mentions this at all, and no store I've ever been to has been posted. They want to ignore it so people who conceal can just be safely ignored, but they can claim a "policy" if someone complains or they get into "legal" issues.

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjohnson44546 View Post
    its not. The membership agreement I signed never mentions this at all, and no store I've ever been to has been posted. They want to ignore it so people who conceal can just be safely ignored, but they can claim a "policy" if someone complains or they get into "legal" issues.
    the agreement you signed and the signage at the entrance, you are agreeing to their security policies ~ small print no firearms!!

    pushed the issue, told it is corp policy, insisted on and took all my membership monies back from the MOD and never visited another costco...SAMs is soo much accommodating!!!

    ipse
    Last edited by solus; 06-01-2015 at 03:21 PM.
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    Regular Member Maverick9's Avatar
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    Around here I think they'd be astonished at the number of people carrying firearms in the store.

    Just a guess...

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    I carry in their stores all the time. I'm not in a position to change to Sam's Club (one of the battles I never win with my wife), so I just conceal. I think the locations around here realize the futility of posting signs, so I haven't seen any at a Costco in some time.

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    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
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    I too thought COSTCO's anti-2A was well known. It has been a victim disarmament zone since I became active in modern 2A back in 2006. But corporate policy and store enforcement policy do not seem to always be the same.

    I suspect the enforcement is store by store dependent in reality. I have CC in MO locations while printing and have noted others doing the same and nobody said a word. But had I been OC (which wasn't legal back then) I think it would have been a different story. I have also been to one in FL with my in-laws and I think I was the only one not carrying in there. Again, no OC, but those older folks print like Gutenberg sometimes.
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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    I find it interesting they are more than willing to sell GUN safes...

    http://www.costco.com/hardware-safes...:CatalogSearch
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

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  11. #11
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    Costco's corporate policy against guns has been in force since at least 2000 when I got a membership. Their stores in Utah are not posted and it wouldn't matter if they were. Private business policies against guns have no force of law in Utah. No crime is committed if one carries into a store in violation of store policies. Refusal to leave if asked could result in a trespass charge. I've never been asked to leave.

    I don't remember a trip to Costco when I didn't legally carry a gun. If I'm OCing that day, I will untuck my shirt to cover the top of the gun/holster and I've never had anyone say a word. During winter months, I generally CCC as I'm not much interested in wearing a gun belt over my coat. If I'm OCing or CCCing, I'm carrying a CC BUG. If I'm not OCing or CCCing, I'm still carrying the CC gun. Again, never had anyone say a word. I do not know whether this is due to lack of seeing the poorly "concealed" gun, or to just not caring.

    I respect those who boycott Costco or any other merchant over an anti-RKBA position. But for me, the benefits of Costco membership are too large to forego over a Corporate policy that has gone no further to actively attack my RKBA than to have an unenforced "no gun" policy in their stores and to support left wing politicians (as opposed to the right wing politicians who attack my RKBA). I believe the time and money I save shopping at Costco for the items they carry can be better applied to advancing RKBA than would be any benefit of denying Costco that money and spending more time and more money buying those items at other locations.

    Should Costco move to using their profits to actively attack my RKBA, I would have to re-evaluate my calculations on this one.

    Charles
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    I find it interesting they are more than willing to sell GUN safes...

    http://www.costco.com/hardware-safes...:CatalogSearch
    Yup. Even the home safe I have right now was purchased there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bernymac View Post
    No. COSTCO has never been gun friendly. Their reasoning is probably more bizarre and full of faulty logic than we can surmise. The most bizarre thing is that the company continue to thrive, despite its anti-gun stand. Same with Starbucks and a lot of other anti-gun companies. Such is life.
    How could you possibly call it bizarre that they stay in business? Look at all the so-called gun owners - and presumably 2nd Amendment supporters - in this thread alone that rationalize their continued support and a clearly anti-2nd amendment company.

    Excellent example of gun owners being their own worse enemy.

  14. #14
    Regular Member cjohnson44546's Avatar
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    I see it says it on the website… I'll ask them about it and probably cancel my membership, don't really need them anyways.

    When I signed up a few years ago it was never mentioned in the agreement, and of the 4 Costcos I've been in I always carry and never saw signs saying anything else. This link to their website is the first proof I've seen they are anti-gun other than people just claiming they have been in forums.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FTG-05 View Post
    How could you possibly call it bizarre that they stay in business? Look at all the so-called gun owners - and presumably 2nd Amendment supporters - in this thread alone that rationalize their continued support and a clearly anti-2nd amendment company.

    Excellent example of gun owners being their own worse enemy.
    And where do you shop that isn't anti-RKBA to one degree or another? I am not aware of any major retailers that do not prohibit their employees from carrying. Or is it ok to patronize a business that leaves their employees defenseless so long as they have any position on you carrying?

    Do you refuse to work for an employer who has an anti-gun policy? Or is it ok to contribute to the profit margin of some company that doesn't allow you to carry guns on the job?

    Do you check the gun policies of the service providers who send out employees to work on your AC, plumbing, trim trees, or put in new concrete? Did the contractor who built your home have a policy respecting the ability of his employees to carry firearms on the job?

    Does your favorite pizza delivery joint allow its drivers to carry firearms?

    Does Tennessee have constitutional carry? How it adopted State preemption over federal laws regarding the intra-State manufacture of guns as has Montana? How many restrictions on RKBA are you supporting by living in and paying taxes to a State that doesn't perfectly respect your RKBA?

    I believe that excepting possibly those who live in an area with an abundance of small, locally owned shops, and don't travel much, odds are that most all of us routinely patronize and/or work for companies that have less than perfect policies on RKBA and self-defense. Each of us has to determine where to draw the line.

    I can respect those who draw the line in a different place than I do when it comes to boycotts.

    I have a hard time with those who presume anyone who draws the line in a slightly different place than they do is some kind of "enemy".

    Charles
    Last edited by utbagpiper; 06-03-2015 at 01:03 AM.
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Sam's Club...eight located in UT in approximate locations to the nine Costcos. Starting down in Provo up north past SLC, options are available.

    Brand name(s0 Kirkland vs. Simply Right, Artisan Fresh and Daily Chef, formerly Member's Mark.

    I left Costco long long ago.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjohnson44546 View Post
    its not. The membership agreement I signed never mentions this at all, and no store I've ever been to has been posted. They want to ignore it so people who conceal can just be safely ignored, but they can claim a "policy" if someone complains or they get into "legal" issues.
    I carry in Costco (concealed) and will continue to do so. Store policy doesn't change law. I am law abiding, store rules don't change that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Sam's Club...eight located in UT in approximate locations to the nine Costcos. ...

    I left Costco long long ago.
    To each his own.

    Does Sam's club allow their employees to carry? Why are you ok patronizing a store that doesn't respect their employee's safety?

    Do the profits from Sam's club ever end up getting donated to anti-gun politicians?
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boundlessdyad View Post
    I carry in Costco (concealed) and will continue to do so. Store policy doesn't change law. I am law abiding, store rules don't change that.
    And who has the moral high ground when a company is well known for their position against firearms? The anti-gun crowd or pro-liberty crowd? If the antis see it, they'll just lump all of us together saying we break company x's policy.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    And who has the moral high ground when a company is well known for their position against firearms? The anti-gun crowd or pro-liberty crowd? If the antis see it, they'll just lump all of us together saying we break company x's policy.
    Not sure what you mean? It is concealed when I am in Costco so the antis wont see it. I am not flaunting moral superiority or even trying to make a point about 2A. For me it is just a personal choice. I feel protecting my loved ones is more important than obeying a store policy.

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boundlessdyad View Post
    Not sure what you mean? It is concealed when I am in Costco so the antis wont see it. I am not flaunting moral superiority or even trying to make a point about 2A. For me it is just a personal choice. I feel protecting my loved ones is more important than obeying a store policy.
    Kind of like this?

    http://www.abajournal.com/news/artic..._who_has_a_co/

    http://www.guns.com/2014/09/26/conce...-arrest-video/
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Store policy has the force of law, trespass law.
    (15) WE ADVOCATE FOR THE 'LAW-ABIDING' ONLY: Posts advocating illegal acts of any kind are NOT welcome here. Even if you feel that a law is unconstitutional we do not break it, we repeal it or defeat it in the courts.
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    Nope, nothing like that. Concealed means concealed. Your examples of 2 individuals who do not know how to properly conceal firearms have no bearing on me. I usually carry 2 guns on a daily basis and they are effectively concealed at all times. I support the rights of individuals to do as they see fit as long as they aren't breaking the law or hurting anyone. I support open carry and concealed carry as there are situations where either one can make more sense than the other.

  24. #24
    Regular Member Grim_Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Store policy has the force of law, trespass law.
    Actually, no, this is not entirely true. Depending on what state you are in, signs or "policy" have no weight of law (as is the case in Washington state). As many here will point out, if asked/told to leave then leave. If you stay after being asked/told to leave, THEN you are trespassing. I don't see anyone advocating violating the law here when someone states that they have or will disregard a store/corporate policy unless said policy has the full weight of established law backing it up (again, Washington state does not provide that backup).

    For me, this is a moot point as I don't spend money at Costco anyway.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Store policy has the force of law, trespass law.
    Not in Utah. URS 76-6-206 sets a pretty high bar for trespass in a place of public accommodation that is open to the public. It requires that entry first be "unlawful" and there is nothing unlawful in Utah about carrying a gun legally but in violation of the policies of a business open to the public. Having entered or remained unlawfully, a person must then intend to cause problems or commit crimes of some sort. Furthermore there is an affirmative defense against a commercial trespassing charge if the property was open to the public and the person's "conduct did not substantially interfere with the owner's use of the property".

    It isn't even clear that a request to leave from a place of public accommodation for no other reason than the unwanted presence of a firearm would be sufficient for a commercial trespassing charge to stick. However, if asked to leave, leaving quickly and quietly and not returning with an unwelcome gun is all but entirely assured to prevent any criminal charges, much less a conviction. In 20 years of political activism in Utah I'm not aware of a single charge, much less conviction, for commercial trespass for someone violating a no-gun policy in a store, while actually going about his shopping.

    Obviously, laws vary by States and in some States and under some circumstances (proper signage, for example) a private policy at a business has full force of law.

    But not in Utah. In Utah there are only two cases where private gun bans have force of law:
    1-At private residences;
    2-Inside houses of worship.

    In both cases "proper" notice must be given for the law to take effect. Proper is legally defined and for churches includes--among other more common options--being listed on one of our Government maintained webpages as having banned guns.

    But business property, places of public accommodation enjoy no such benefits.

    It is perfectly legal for me to carry into Costco stores in Utah. It is perfectly legal for them to revoke my membership if they discover me and want to do so. But even that would not necessarily keep me out of their stores. Under law, pharmacies cannot limit services to members and so are open to to everyone.

    As gun owners and OCers, we are responsible to KNOW the laws that affect us.

    I've spent 20 years reading Utah gun laws, figuring out how to repeal the bad laws while strengthening the good laws, and even helping to craft some of the language to move us incrementally toward proper respect for RKBA. Feel free to ask questions. But it would be likely be a mistake for you to think you know more of Utah gun laws than I.

    Now, if someone is just butt sore about some gun owners patronizing Costco despite a (generally) non-enforced gun ban, they should say so directly.

    Charles
    Last edited by utbagpiper; 06-04-2015 at 09:41 PM.
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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