Department of Social & Health Services denying right to open carry

mnrobitaille · Jul 21, 2015

Went to the Kennewick CSO today at approximately 2:45 p.m. to conduct some business. As I was checking in, the security personnel & a couple of the administrative staff clearly announced for all to hear that I had to remove my sidearm to my vehicle as firearms are not allowed there in the building. How they approached it was in a threatening posture to me, especially since the security officer nearly knocked my wife over. I calmly explained to them that I was following the regulations as written in both the RCWs & WACs. However the response was they were above the law & could do whatever they wanted, though one administrator did say he'd look up the regulations.

(All I was doing was standing to be signed in, with the sidearm holstered on my hip)

Alpine · Jul 21, 2015

If they refuse to budge and won't admit you're right you'll need video/audio.

Grim_Night · Jul 22, 2015

I will speak from experience on this one. The DSHS office in Tacoma has signs on their doors saying no weapons or firearms. I walk into and out of that building with no issues at all while open carrying. I have been asked to leave only once. After which, I was told flat out that I was free to come and go with no further hassles. I have since never even been stopped by security. If they have any signs or "policy" against weapons or firearms, they are in the wrong and unenforceable.

Let them call the police. It is a public building owned by the state. You are violating no law and they cannot force you to leave nor can they trespass you for open carrying on the property or in the building. IF they even call the police, they are risking a lawsuit.

phoneguy · Jul 22, 2015

Call the SAF on this

The SAF has put them on report a fews years ago. Please call and tell them.

deanf · Jul 22, 2015

If they refuse to budge and won't admit you're right you'll need video/audio.

For what?

mnrobitaille · Jul 22, 2015

I know a lot of the acronyms/abbreviations for the state offices, but SAF is not one of those.

I did go onto the main DSHS website & file a complaint, stating that nowhere in the RCWs or WACs does it say that it's not allowed to carry in the CSOs & also quoted them Article 1, Section 24 of the State Constitution.

phoneguy said:
The SAF has put them on report a fews years ago. Please call and tell them.

massivedesign · Jul 22, 2015

mnrobitaille said:
I know a lot of the acronyms/abbreviations for the state offices, but SAF is not one of those.

I did go onto the main DSHS website & file a complaint, stating that nowhere in the RCWs or WACs does it say that it's not allowed to carry in the CSOs & also quoted them Article 1, Section 24 of the State Constitution.

SAF = The Second Amendment Foundation. They do a really good job of making sure govt doesn't step out of line. www.SAF.org

MSG Laigaie · Jul 22, 2015

Grim_Night said:
Let them call the police. It is a public building owned by the state. You are violating no law and they cannot force you to leave nor can they trespass you for open carrying on the property or in the building. IF they even call the police, they are risking a lawsuit.

Citizenship is a Verb, mnrobitaille. You are the "injured party", what shall you do now?
,

mnrobitaille · Jul 22, 2015

massivedesign said:
SAF = The Second Amendment Foundation. They do a really good job of making sure govt doesn't step out of line. www.SAF.org

Just got done writing a nice descriptive e-mail about the occurrence, & I reiterated in the e-mail that both the security personnel & administrators approached the situation aggressively.

I do not see how the mere presence of a holstered firearm warrants an aggressive response, whereas another member of my party almost gets injured.

Alpine · Jul 22, 2015

deanf said:
For what?[/COLOR]

The video/audio may be required for any complaint as the people who did this to them might deny they treated them a certain way or even asked them to leave.

MSG Laigaie · Jul 22, 2015

mnrobitaille said:
I do not see how the mere presence of a holstered firearm warrants an aggressive response, .

I believe a little research will give you a judge/judge like person used almost the exact same words.

http://www.fedagent.com/case-law-up...ysis-of-the-free-to-leave-standard-of-seizure

"More importantly, where a state permits individuals to openly carry firearms, the exercise of this right, without more, cannot justify an investigatory detention. Permitting such a justification would eviscerate Fourth Amendment protections for lawfully armed individuals in those states.”

mnrobitaille · Jul 28, 2015

I received a call back from the Kennewick CSO Administrator concerning the situation, & how the voicemail sounded, he was not pleased.

Hopefully either tomorrow or Thursday I will be able to speak with him (hopefully in person).

mnrobitaille · Jul 30, 2015

good contact

Had the contact with the Kennewick CSO Administrator via phone this afternoon. The response from him was that the situation was handled wrong & inappropriately. I explained to him again what happened, & that I was not the one causing the warranting alarm, but that the security officer & administration staff present were. He reiterated several times that he was sorry my constitutional rights were violated, & from the sounds of it, he'll be training/coaching the staff about the state regulations, as well as getting in contact with the security company to conduct additional training for their personnel.

golddigger14s · Jul 30, 2015

We have a new verb in our midst.

solus · Jul 30, 2015

hopefully, the county administrator will enjoy the security team they hired will be provided appropriate training to preclude another from experiencing what you did ~ one can hope!

good job

ipse

MSG Laigaie · Jul 30, 2015

golddigger14s said:
We have a new verb in our midst.

Out*******standing job, Troop! This is what works. See a problem......act on it, and fix a problem. Again, good on you mate.

sudden valley gunner · Jul 30, 2015

MSG Laigaie said:
Out*******standing job, Troop! This is what works. See a problem......act on it, and fix a problem. Again, good on you mate.

+1

Jeff Hayes · Jul 30, 2015

mnrobitaille said:
Had the contact with the Kennewick CSO Administrator via phone this afternoon. The response from him was that the situation was handled wrong & inappropriately. I explained to him again what happened, & that I was not the one causing the warranting alarm, but that the security officer & administration staff present were. He reiterated several times that he was sorry my constitutional rights were violated, & from the sounds of it, he'll be training/coaching the staff about the state regulations, as well as getting in contact with the security company to conduct additional training for their personnel.

Thats how it is done, welcome to the verbs, you are in good company BTW.

Jeff Hayes · Jul 30, 2015

golddigger14s said:
We have a new verb in our midst.

+1

Boomboy007 · Aug 2, 2015

MSG Laigaie said:
Out*******standing job, Troop! This is what works. See a problem......act on it, and fix a problem. Again, good on you mate.

Ditto

Department of Social & Health Services denying right to open carry

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