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Thread: Safety Conference for Places of Worship in Chesterfield County.

  1. #1
    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    Safety Conference for Places of Worship in Chesterfield County.

    From the Chesterfield County Police Facebook page:

    Please HELP us by sharing this information with the leaders of YOUR place of worship located in Chesterfield County. We would love to see ALL places of worship represented at our Safety Conference in August.
    For more information, contact our Crime Prevention Unit at 804-318-8699.Click image for larger version. 

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    The Church of JMB(PBOHN) intends to register. I wonder if any of the purdy followers will want to go. However, since they have decided to hold the meeting at a school* I am beginning to smell shenanigans afoot.

    stay safe.

    * - http://www.edline.net/pages/ctchull
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    The Church of JMB(PBOHN) intends to register. I wonder if any of the purdy followers will want to go. However, since they have decided to hold the meeting at a school* I am beginning to smell shenanigans afoot.

    stay safe.

    * - http://www.edline.net/pages/ctchull
    Yep, it's to be held in a school. They don't want your kind
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Yep, it's to be held in a school. They don't want your kind
    I'll just go get in the cattle car now. Avoid the rush.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    ... JMB(PBOHN) ...
    Who??
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    Lone Star Veteran DrMark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty-or-Death View Post
    Who??
    LOL

    To attend his church, you'd wear a 1911...

  7. #7
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty-or-Death View Post
    Who??
    JMB = John Moses Browning
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    JMB = John Moses Browning
    Say it right! John Moses Browning (Peace Be On His Name).

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Activist Member Wolf_shadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Say it right! John Moses Browning (Peace Be On His Name).

    stay safe.
    +1000

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
    Yes I carry a Bible and a Gun, your point.
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    Benjamin Franklin said, "A government that does not trust it's citizens with guns is a government that should not be trusted."



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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Say it right! John Moses Browning (Peace Be On His Name).

    stay safe.
    And don't forget: his main temple is in Ogden, UT.

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    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    Having learned that the location is a school, I'm contemplating carrying an empty holster to the conference.
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty-or-Death View Post
    Having learned that the location is a school, I'm contemplating carrying an empty holster to the conference.
    Be aware of other potential gotchas = ammo and knives.

    Fresh batteries in recorder always a plus.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Be aware of other potential gotchas = ammo and knives
    No ammo restrictions, are there?
    *I am not a lawyer. Nothing from me shall be construed as a magic cloak of legal advice. It's ultimately your tucas that's on the line. Keep examining the law anyway. The gov't, made up of people like us, is supposed to work for us, not against us. Let's find, correct, and avoid the wrongs before they're actively used against us, or we become innocently trapped by them. We're to be the masters. Let's vigilantly keep tabs on our servants who seek to rule us.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristCrusader View Post
    No ammo restrictions, are there?
    Might depend on how deep you want to go to test it.

    "the possession of contraband or any suspicious substance which may be illegal...
    https://www.chesterfield.gov/police.aspx?id=2522
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Say it right! John Moses Browning (Peace Be On His Name).

    stay safe.
    Does my Browning 1935 Hi-Power count as new and wonderfully empowering as it corrects all that is wrong with the 1911 design.

    May the force be with you.
    Personal Defensive Solutions professional personal firearms, edge weapons and hands on defensive training and tactics pdsolutions@hotmail.com

    Any and all spelling errors are just to give the spelling Nazis something to do

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    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    So my county is starting a program to partnership with places of worship that's similar to neighborhood watch, and they're calling is Worship Watch. They launched it today at the Safety Conference about which I posted in the OP.

    At a QA time after the first session, attendants immediately asked about carry in church. The speaker gave an unclear statement that basically implied that a church can make its own rules, and if a church allows it, CHP holders can carry, but you have to have a permit.

    I took him to task on that during our lunch intermission and he remained adamant that he was correct. Even after showing him the code, he wasn't grasping what I was saying, which was the code says nothing about concealing or a requirement for a permit. He said he'd get back to me, and he did before the next session started.

    He couldn't find anything in the code, but what he referenced was the AG opinion on church carry (at least they were aware of it) which does suggest CC. Anyway, I just reiterated my recommendation that they not say a CHP is required, and they stated they would reiterate the law. And they did just that, gave out the code reference 18.2-283 at the afternoon session.
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    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    I'll also add that they did discourage one attendee who asked about posting gun-buster signs at their worship house. At first they encouraged the placement of signs, then back-peddled pointing to the Aurora shooter's decision making process as a reason to not advertise a GFZ.
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty-or-Death View Post
    I'll also add that they did discourage one attendee who asked about posting gun-buster signs at their worship house. At first they encouraged the placement of signs, then back-peddled pointing to the Aurora shooter's decision making process as a reason to not advertise a GFZ.
    Sounds like they were winging it, ill prepared.

    Why does that not surprise me?
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    When I asked one of the speakers why the conference speakers didn't speak more to the question of carry in church, noting that there are more questions than answers about it (one attendee called it the elephant in the room), he said the CCPD couldn't do more than speak to what the law says in this public forum. He added that, in a more private setting, like during a security assessment for a place of worship, they'd be more free to answer questions.

    It seemed to me that liability was less, and control of information was more, their cause for concern here. I estimate there were at least 200 shepherds in attendance, yet they were treated in this regard like sheep.
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    I was requested by my pastor and several other church members…,

    to attend a meeting given by the Richmond Fire and Police departments, and a Security professional some months ago concerning safety in places of worship in response to an incident that occurred shortly before. There was food there, so that made a large number of the participants quite happy. It was a three hour long program, the first two hours consisting of a panel of Fire and Police department brass expounding on their resume`s and patting themselves on the back, followed by pretty much telling the guest what they were going to do in the case of an active shooter/emergency. They never really offered any advice on how a place of worship might be proactive in anticipating or handling such an emergency, which I suspect by the few questions that followed, was the main reason many guest were in attendance (except maybe the free food).

    The Security professional gave an excellent lecture and offered lots of good information and material on the matter of increasing safety and awareness in places of worship.

    By contrast, about the only material the police offered was a pen and a "How did we do?" questionnaire.

    I told them it would be nice they could continue to offer the venue (and the food of course), do away with the first two hours and the "experts", keep the Security professional, and get lost until somebody calls for them to come and clean up.

    So, to recap, it was pretty much what I figured (and told my pastor) it would be, and that I would not be going to any more of those "seminars".

    sidestreet

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    we are not equal, we will never be equal, but we must be relentless.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    Does my Browning 1935 Hi-Power count as new and wonderfully empowering as it corrects all that is wrong with the 1911 design.

    May the force be with you.
    It does.

    But depending on whether it is a FN or some knock-off determines just how much wonderfully empowering it is.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  22. #22
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    I wish I had gone in spite of being told I would not be welcome there and could expect to be asked to leave if I posed the questions I submitted ahead of time.

    Sounds as if Liberty-Or-Death covered some of them, and quite well.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  23. #23
    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    Okay so this is sort of a brain dump of the content.

    The slideshow was a bit disjointed, each speaker contributing their part separately. It was full of statistics and heavy on laying out the need for a safety program, but light on ways for meeting the need. It seemed intentionally vague, in the hopes they are invited for assessment and consultations at which they can be less vague.

    There were several printed pieces distributed. There were information flyers for Personal Safety, Shopping Safety, Project Lifesaver, & Larceny from Auto. A crime prevention notepad, an emergency numbers fridge magnet, CCPD automobile waste bag (win!), a speaker biographies page, and a conference agenda page.

    I found this laminated piece ridiculous: http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/a...ocket_card.pdf I look forward to your comments on that piece of DHS work.

    It went hand in hand with the video they played, found here: http://www.chesterfield.gov/runhidefightvideo/

    There were also "vendors" distributing their information including Crime Solvers, CCPD Chaplains, CERT, and CC Fire & EMS.

    The only conference specific papers apart from the bios and agenda were a Worship Watch trifold brochure and another checklist page which was an excerpt of one panel on that brochure. The brochure is below, forgive the glare on the glossy paper.



    If you examine the brochure closely, you will see it was last edited 2 weeks prior, and had several subtle and one glaring error. I agree this entire conference was poorly prepared.

    The chesterfield.gov site oddly has nothing yet for this Worship Watch program, not even this brochure. The contact info on the brochure is as follows:

    Chesterfield County Police Department
    Business Watch Coordinator
    2730 Hicks Road
    N. Chesterfield, VA 23235
    (804) 318-8699
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  24. #24
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Liberty-or-Death

    Seriously, there should have been a duct tape warning before viewing your links - my head really hurts now.

    Activity shooter situation - I should raise my hands after laying down anything in them? Not only NO, but NOWAYINHELL !!

    The nice policemans and EMTs will arrive with all of their tools to clean up the mess and brag about their response times. I have a big hint for them: We are the 1st responders; we can make a difference; we can contribute to an early favorable resolution.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  25. #25
    Regular Member Liberty-or-Death's Avatar
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    Speaking of tape, I forgot about this one. They didn't want folks sitting in the balcony area.
    Last edited by Liberty-or-Death; 08-27-2015 at 11:58 PM.
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