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Thread: Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?

  1. #1
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?

    EPA dumps millions of gallons of mine waste into a river.

    Great job government!

    http://www.voicesofliberty.com/artic...a-toxic-spill/
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  2. #2
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    Quit blaming the state.

    The state is our savior. It protects us. You owe it your loyalty and support. Lots of support.

    <uh-oh! my keyboard is beginning to smoke...>
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  3. #3
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    LOL....the savior provides moral hazard just like the BP oil spill. Then claims we didn't clap enough for it and thats why it went awry.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    LOL....the savior provides moral hazard just like the BP oil spill. Then claims we didn't clap enough for it and thats why it went awry.
    When I clicked on the thread after seeing you had replied, my intention was to carry forward playing the statist and bashing you for your anti-state stance.

    But, when I saw the post, there was just nothing I could say. Too true. Too true.
    Last edited by Citizen; 08-10-2015 at 08:32 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  5. #5
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Without the state how would we even know the waters are polluted?
    "Never mind the 3 eyed fish and your children with 4 arms, nothing to see hear move along move along".
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  6. #6
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    When I clicked on the thread after seeing you had replied, my intention was to carry forward playing the statist and bashing you for your anti-state stance.

    But, when I saw the post, there was just nothing I could say. Too true. Too true.
    Well darn didn't mean to spoil the fun.....lol.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  7. #7
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    Well,,,

    I was shocked to hear the first news of this.

    They said that the EPA was there "inspecting" the dam...
    But then instead,,, they apparently just dug a big a$$ hole through IT!!! During their inspection...
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    I was shocked to hear the first news of this.

    They said that the EPA was there "inspecting" the dam...
    But then instead,,, they apparently just dug a big a$$ hole through IT!!! During their inspection...
    EPA wanted control of ALL waterways, including on private land.. guess if you want control of something you have to pollute the CRAP out of it.. that will make sure those pesky citizens stay away.

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    There goes Coors. No more sparkling waters.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken56 View Post
    There goes Coors. No more sparkling waters.
    That's strange, since Golden CO is over 100 miles as the crow flies upstream from Durango.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    "Never mind the 3 eyed fish and your children with 4 arms, nothing to see hear move along move along".
    As an example there was the Love Canal debacle.
    http://www2.epa.gov/aboutepa/love-canal-tragedy
    Better to not open your mouth and be thought the fool, than to open it and remove all doubt.

    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  12. #12
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    ^ Tip of the iceberg ^
    Better to not open your mouth and be thought the fool, than to open it and remove all doubt.

    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    "Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?"

    The business that polluted the mine in the first place?

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    "Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?"

    The business that polluted the mine in the first place?
    And yet in an amazing feat of corporate compliance they took all the steps required of them to hold the contamination and prevent it from entering the river.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    And yet in an amazing feat of corporate compliance they took all the steps required of them to hold the contamination and prevent it from entering the river.

    stay safe.
    The mine has been closed since 1923 and the toxins have been leaching into the surrounding area since then. The right wing news outlets like to word the news reports like the EPA cause the earthen dam to collapse on purpose. They were collecting the sludge for proper disposal when the heavy equipment disturbed the earthen dam that contained the sludge.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    The mine has been closed since 1923 and the toxins have been leaching into the surrounding area since then. The right wing news outlets like to word the news reports like the EPA cause the earthen dam to collapse on purpose. They were collecting the sludge for proper disposal when the heavy equipment disturbed the earthen dam that contained the sludge.
    Who put the moral hazards in place not to hold the corporation liable for their pollution?


    Oh yea the state.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  17. #17
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    LOL Moral hazard is caused by the ignorance of one party being worse than the other party (to the contract). The state has caused and enforced the ignorance of the dependent class.
    Yes indeed, deliberately they have dumbed down the masses.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  18. #18
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Yet you hold the masses' corporate entity culpable in favor of the state? A bit of hypocrisy.
    Um what? I don't favor the state ever.

    The corporate entity was allowed to pollute by the state.

    The state then polluted greater than the private company ever would have without state protection.

    In common law courts private companies were sued and lost for pollution and had to pay damages to those they harmed. Nothing like that happens now.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  19. #19
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Only the state defines, and calls it, pollution. Harm, where is the harm? From here, you're talkin' to da han'.
    Well as long as you are fine catching fish and drinking water from your homestead downstream, there is no harm.....
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  20. #20
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Um what? I don't favor the state ever.

    The corporate entity was allowed to pollute by the state.

    The state then polluted greater than the private company ever would have without state protection.

    In common law courts private companies were sued and lost for pollution and had to pay damages to those they harmed. Nothing like that happens now.
    GOLD!!! The state gets real agreeable and then turns a blind eye for their share of that shinny yellow rock.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  21. #21
    Regular Member Maverick9's Avatar
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    EPA likely did it on purpose. They wanted to justify a $500 million Superfund site.

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/wp-c...a-575x1989.jpg

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    Regular Member O2HeN2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    That's strange, since Golden CO is over 100 miles as the crow flies upstream from Durango.

    stay safe.
    Actually Coors is on the other side of the Continental Divide, so a completely different watershed.

    O2
    When seconds count, the police are mere minutes away...
    They'll never take your "hunting rifle", they'll call it a "sniper rifle" first.
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  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O2HeN2 View Post
    Actually Coors is on the other side of the Continental Divide, so a completely different watershed.

    O2
    Don't tell me, tell Ken56.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  24. #24
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Interesting seems I missed some fun.

    "Words contribute to the public conception of us".

    Geologist predicts ahead of time EPA had an agenda....

    http://www.silvertonstandard.com/news.php?id=847

    FUQ- "Based on my 47 years as a professional geologist, it appears to me the Epa is setting the town and your area up for a possible Superfund Blietzkrieg."
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    "Local and mine industry stakeholders successfully lobbied EPA to keep the area off the Superfund National Priorities List, partly out of concern for the region’s tourist industry. Instead, cleanup efforts have been coordinated by a volunteer consortium called ARSG, the Animas River Stakeholders Group."

    "The seeds of trouble for Gold King were sown in 1996, when Sunnyside was permitted to shut down its treatment plant— an effective but expensive way to stop pollution from mine discharges — and switch to the less costly method of simply plugging the mine works with concrete."

    http://www.popsci.com/secret-history...src=SOC&dom=tw

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