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Thread: Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?

  1. #1
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?

    EPA dumps millions of gallons of mine waste into a river.

    Great job government!

    http://www.voicesofliberty.com/artic...a-toxic-spill/
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  2. #2
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    Quit blaming the state.

    The state is our savior. It protects us. You owe it your loyalty and support. Lots of support.

    <uh-oh! my keyboard is beginning to smoke...>
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  3. #3
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    LOL....the savior provides moral hazard just like the BP oil spill. Then claims we didn't clap enough for it and thats why it went awry.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    LOL....the savior provides moral hazard just like the BP oil spill. Then claims we didn't clap enough for it and thats why it went awry.
    When I clicked on the thread after seeing you had replied, my intention was to carry forward playing the statist and bashing you for your anti-state stance.

    But, when I saw the post, there was just nothing I could say. Too true. Too true.
    Last edited by Citizen; 08-10-2015 at 09:32 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  5. #5
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    Without the state how would we even know the waters are polluted?
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  6. #6
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Without the state how would we even know the waters are polluted?
    "Never mind the 3 eyed fish and your children with 4 arms, nothing to see hear move along move along".
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  7. #7
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    When I clicked on the thread after seeing you had replied, my intention was to carry forward playing the statist and bashing you for your anti-state stance.

    But, when I saw the post, there was just nothing I could say. Too true. Too true.
    Well darn didn't mean to spoil the fun.....lol.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  8. #8
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    Well,,,

    I was shocked to hear the first news of this.

    They said that the EPA was there "inspecting" the dam...
    But then instead,,, they apparently just dug a big a$$ hole through IT!!! During their inspection...
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    I was shocked to hear the first news of this.

    They said that the EPA was there "inspecting" the dam...
    But then instead,,, they apparently just dug a big a$$ hole through IT!!! During their inspection...
    EPA wanted control of ALL waterways, including on private land.. guess if you want control of something you have to pollute the CRAP out of it.. that will make sure those pesky citizens stay away.

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    There goes Coors. No more sparkling waters.

  11. #11
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken56 View Post
    There goes Coors. No more sparkling waters.
    That's strange, since Golden CO is over 100 miles as the crow flies upstream from Durango.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

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  12. #12
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    "Never mind the 3 eyed fish and your children with 4 arms, nothing to see hear move along move along".
    As an example there was the Love Canal debacle.
    http://www2.epa.gov/aboutepa/love-canal-tragedy
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Love Canal The Truth Seeps Out, from the February 1981 Reason.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    As an example there was the Love Canal debacle.
    "You’re about to be untricked. If you believe that the guilty party in the Love Canal tragedy is the Hooker Chemicals & Plastics Corporation, which the Justice Department is suing, rather than the Niagara Falls Board of Education, which bought the dump from Hooker in 1953; or if you believe that Michael Brown’s famous book that has become the popular authority on the whole mess, Laying Waste: The Poisoning of America by Toxic Chemicals, sets out the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth about Love Canal, then you’ve been snookered."

    https://reason.com/archives/1981/02/01/love-canal
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  14. #14
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    ^ Tip of the iceberg ^
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    "Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?"

    The business that polluted the mine in the first place?

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    "Without the state who will pollute the rivers!?"

    The business that polluted the mine in the first place?
    And yet in an amazing feat of corporate compliance they took all the steps required of them to hold the contamination and prevent it from entering the river.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    And yet in an amazing feat of corporate compliance they took all the steps required of them to hold the contamination and prevent it from entering the river.

    stay safe.
    The mine has been closed since 1923 and the toxins have been leaching into the surrounding area since then. The right wing news outlets like to word the news reports like the EPA cause the earthen dam to collapse on purpose. They were collecting the sludge for proper disposal when the heavy equipment disturbed the earthen dam that contained the sludge.

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    Experts and federal environmental officials say they expect the river system to dilute the heavy metals before they pose a longer-term threat. Don't miss the comments!
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...m-threats.html

    It is too bad that we must now depend on the foreign press, not being captive of the FedGov agit-prop.

    The metals in the mine tailings have been leaching back into the geology from which they were concentrated during removal of their more valuable components. The solution to pollution is dilution.

    The first noted metal in many of the reports of the Gold King Mine spill is cadmium. Cadmium is present in diesel fuel that has been used in submarines from their beginning. While I was working, directing repair work operations, a federal monitor tried to raise the issue that cadmium is a deleterious material. He was laughed off the job.

    Another noted metal is lead. Metallic lead is quite innocuous. The infamous Roman plumbum problem was of lead sugars, organic compounds of lead.

    The EPA invented this problem of mine tailings from whole cloth, believing that there is no such thing as bad publicity. Paraphrasing Goebbels, The essential American leadership secret does not depend on particular intelligence. Rather, it depends on a remarkably stupid thick-headedness. The Environmental Protection Agency follows the principle that when one lies, one should lie big, and stick to it. They keep up their lies, even at the risk of looking ridiculous. (Aus Churchills Lügenfabrik ("From Churchill's Lie Factory"), Die Zeit ohne Beispiel.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 08-11-2015 at 05:00 PM.
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  19. #19
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beebobby View Post
    The mine has been closed since 1923 and the toxins have been leaching into the surrounding area since then. The right wing news outlets like to word the news reports like the EPA cause the earthen dam to collapse on purpose. They were collecting the sludge for proper disposal when the heavy equipment disturbed the earthen dam that contained the sludge.
    Who put the moral hazards in place not to hold the corporation liable for their pollution?


    Oh yea the state.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Who put the moral hazards in place not to hold the corporation liable for their pollution? Oh yea the state.
    LOL Moral hazard is caused by the ignorance of one party being worse than the other party (to the contract). The state has caused and enforced the ignorance of the dependent class.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  21. #21
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    LOL Moral hazard is caused by the ignorance of one party being worse than the other party (to the contract). The state has caused and enforced the ignorance of the dependent class.
    Yes indeed, deliberately they have dumbed down the masses.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Yes indeed, deliberately they have dumbed down the masses.
    Yet you hold the masses' corporate entity culpable in favor of the state? A bit of hypocrisy.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  23. #23
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Yet you hold the masses' corporate entity culpable in favor of the state? A bit of hypocrisy.
    Um what? I don't favor the state ever.

    The corporate entity was allowed to pollute by the state.

    The state then polluted greater than the private company ever would have without state protection.

    In common law courts private companies were sued and lost for pollution and had to pay damages to those they harmed. Nothing like that happens now.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Um what? I don't favor the state ever. The corporate entity was allowed to pollute by the state. The state then polluted greater than the private company ever would have without state protection. In common law courts private companies were sued and lost for pollution and had to pay damages to those they harmed. Nothing like that happens now.
    Only the state defines, and calls it, pollution. Harm, where is the harm? From here, you're talkin' to da han'.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 08-11-2015 at 07:08 PM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  25. #25
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Only the state defines, and calls it, pollution. Harm, where is the harm? From here, you're talkin' to da han'.
    Well as long as you are fine catching fish and drinking water from your homestead downstream, there is no harm.....
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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