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Thread: Heavily armed ["automatic rifles"] Oath Keepers inject unease to riot-hit Ferguson

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    Heavily armed ["automatic rifles"] Oath Keepers inject unease to riot-hit Ferguson

    " FERGUSON, Mo. (Reuters) - Four civilians carrying automatic rifles and sidearms patrolled a riot-torn street in Ferguson, Missouri, early Tuesday, saying they were there to protect a media organization but drawing swift criticism from police and protesters alike.

    The appearance of the four men, all white, quickly drew stares in the mostly black neighborhood, which exploded into violence again on Sunday night as protesters marked the police killing of an unarmed black teen a year ago.

    The men identified themselves as part of a group called "Oath Keepers," which describes itself as an association of current and former U.S. soldiers and police who aim to protect the U.S. Constitution.

    The Southern Poverty Law Center, a non-profit civil rights organization, has described the "Oath Keepers" as a "fiercely anti-government, militaristic group," and St. Louis County Police Chief Jon Belmar condemned their appearance in Ferguson.

    [ ... ]"

    https://ca.news.yahoo.com/heavily-ar...085709866.html

    ETA http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...y-armed-forme/
    Last edited by Nightmare; 08-11-2015 at 09:19 AM.
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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    A group that is pro constitution is labelled as anti government. The constitution is the map for our government, liberalism is a disease.
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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    I'm not going to bother looking up the laws on personal protection agents and just presume that these guys do not meet the minimum requirements.

    I had almost no heartburn last year when White Folks With Gunz showed up in front of a few businesses to discourage notions of looting/arson. But a moving square of folks moving through or on the edges of a highly dynamic situation calls for a set of structured rules of engagement. (Most PPAs that I know or have studied AARS from stress moving the principal away from the kill/threat zone and only shooting to remove an obstacle to that objective. From the one time I role-played PPA I noticed that it was a biotch moving/guiding the principal while trying to swing a rifle around. It was not that much easier with one hand encumbered with a handgun.)

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    I don't think they were getting paid as personal protection, they were just a armed presence, the same as they were on the Bundy ranch. LAC only need to meet the minimum requirements for state law to be LAC. Many member here has expressed that one of their reasons for carry is public protection, not my cup of tea, but as far as I know legal.
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    Despite the misgivings of the County Chief of Police, SPLC and the protestors there was no looting or burning in the area the Oath Keepers patrolled.

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9026543 View Post
    Despite the misgivings of the County Chief of Police, SPLC and the protestors there was no looting or burning in the area the Oath Keepers patrolled.
    The protestors are mostly democrats in Ferguson, the police everywhere do not want to lose their job security by citizens taking responsibility.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
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    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
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    the group has a website, and I've followed it cause they usually have news as to the going on's in ferguson that isn't the mainstream media prior to the mainstream actually putting any articles out.

    although I think the group isn't much better then the current LEO/GI mentality from the commentary I have read. like "oh citizens who haven't been trained like LEO or Military should just leave their guns at home" yeaaaaaah.. how about NO, there is also follow up of how they are essentially the organized militia according to the constitution by a guy named "cal" which he conveniently forgets the outlines that are also for the Unorganized militia are also in the constitution.

    I also highly doubt they actually had full auto weapons, they where probably just black rifles, like an AR-15 and the media is creating sensationalist propaganda.

    either way, who really cares? if the area they are in is left alone, that aloen should speak VOLUMES about an armed presence.

    and besides they are NOT protesters IMO they are CRIMINALS, especially if they are shooting at police and tossing Molotov cocktails.

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    Odd how the "former military and police" they say make up this group instantly became untrained when they ceased being active military or police. Now that they are simply "civilians" they are incompetent nincompoops who want to compensate for something by carrying a big scary rifle that I doubt were fully automatic. The only ones there that did have full auto weapons were the police I bet. You just can't beat the reporting of the mainstream media now can you.

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    Regular Member Griz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken56 View Post
    You just can't beat the reporting of the mainstream media now can you.
    St. Louis, and immediate surrounding area, is very democrat. The local rag and TV news, especially FOX 2, follow suit, pandering to the lowest common denominators of sensationalism and commercialism. Enough so you can almost hear Don Henley's "Dirty Laundry" as their theme song. Don't look for any reporting of the simple facts without skew.
    Last edited by Griz; 08-12-2015 at 07:44 AM.

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    STLCPD Chief is no friend of liberty...a fitting bookend to STLPD Chief.

    skid skips right past the laws of the state to his personal views...who wudda thunk it.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

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    I have the "pleasure" of spending the night in Hazelwood, Mo kind of across the airport from Ferguson. I'm at a big warehouse complex, think I'm good but no gun policy in the truck is honored. Boss said he would check with the Insurance company about that, but a majority of our business is hazardous, and those are all posted, so it would probably be more of a pain than it's worth.

    Anyone in the area wants to swing by for a visit, let me know here and I'll check back. Just got back from Subway, going to bed I a couple hours. Tomorrow reload at Schaeffers petroleum down on the river about a mile south of the Arch.

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    Regular Member Griz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wstar425 View Post
    I have the "pleasure" of spending the night in Hazelwood, Mo kind of across the airport from Ferguson. I'm at a big warehouse complex, think I'm good but no gun policy in the truck is honored.
    Hazelwood was OK during last years frolics. The only issue of late was a man getting "craigslist" killed at a truck driving school.

    But I don't blame you. I work in the area and dislike being unarmed, too.

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    MSM lies and propaganda as usual:
    Oath Keepers: The heavily armed white vigilantes in Ferguson, explained


    I believe as I have spoken with several OK'ers that there is all creeds and colors in this fine organization color of skin has NO bearing on membership!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Renegadez View Post
    MSM lies and propaganda as usual:
    Oath Keepers: The heavily armed white vigilantes in Ferguson, explained


    I believe as I have spoken with several OK'ers that there is all creeds and colors in this fine organization color of skin has NO bearing on membership!
    Yes, they do try to paint any American as a terrorist. But the author completely missed the point of the Oath Keeper's presence; it was not to highlight anything to do with race relations but to keep people safe and that is something that the government was clearly unable to do.

    Not being an Oath Keeper member, I support and understand their intentions. The Oath Keeper's main focus has previously been about protecting people from government agencies. Are they branching out to unpaid "guards" to protect people from looters?

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    ... Are they branching out to unpaid "guards" to protect people from looters?
    All ya gotta do is ask one of them and your question may receive a answer. Or, you could use the same computer you use to post here on OCDO and go to the below website and learn for yerself.

    http://oathkeepers.org/oktester/about/
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Renegadez View Post
    MSM lies and propaganda as usual:
    Oath Keepers: The heavily armed white vigilantes in Ferguson, explained


    I believe as I have spoken with several OK'ers that there is all creeds and colors in this fine organization color of skin has NO bearing on membership!
    i find it interesting the OKeeper shown on first page of the article appears to have his finger inside the trigger guard...

    from the article, quote: ...who purport to uphold an oath taken by police and military to "defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic." unquote.

    the nice LEs in NC and if mem serves, several other states, do not utter any such an oath or statement!!

    ipse
    Last edited by solus; 08-17-2015 at 03:22 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    i find it interesting the OKeeper shown on first page of the article appears to have his finger inside the trigger guard...
    What photo are you referring to? I only see 2... one has the back of the guy in the red hat (so you can't see his finger position and the other guy's hands aren't anywhere close.
    2nd photo has the guy in the red cap, with a clear shot of his finger position on the side of the lower receiver well above the trigger, exactly where it's supposed to be positioned. Is there a third photo I'm not finding?

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    No finger in trigger seen by me on any photo from the links provided...my eyes ain't as sharp as they used to be though.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    No finger in trigger seen by me on any photo from the links provided...my eyes ain't as sharp as they used to be though.
    My guess some liberties are taken when viewing the first picture. The first picture, at the top, could possibly potentially elude to a finger on a trigger; however, IMO there is not enough of the picture visible to judge one way or the other.
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    Chief Belmar blows smoke at Oath Keepers

    Chief doesn't know the law so he lets his lawyers handle it. His words not mine. Oath Keeper tries to explain to him that they are legal under RSMO 44.101 but he will not listen. Video explains it all.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BP_HgKWrTYU

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    Regular Member Freedom1Man's Avatar
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    If they are not being hired and are simply volunteers who choose to defend others, then how could a security license be required?

    I have not read your laws but how can the police chief rely solely on a lawyer's opinion and not read the law?

    If only lawyers can understand a law then how are us "peasants" supposed be to able to follow it even if we did read it?

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    The good Chief has little time for the law. He is very busy with PR and carping about idiot judges. I gotta admit, I'm with the good Chief where idiot judges are concerned, nothing much beyond that though.

    Every now and again a blind squirrel will find a nut.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Im what I call a silent supporter of Oath Keepers, got some materials from them and love the concept but chose not to enlist. If the time came I'd gear up and go with but I did see the presence in Ferguson as a potential agitator for all parties involved and that's why I kinda looked down on the whole thing. The image they presented was all wrong for the situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VinnAY View Post
    Im what I call a silent supporter of Oath Keepers, got some materials from them and love the concept but chose not to enlist. If the time came I'd gear up and go with but I did see the presence in Ferguson as a potential agitator for all parties involved and that's why I kinda looked down on the whole thing. The image they presented was all wrong for the situation.
    they where a volunteer security detail for infowars journalists.. ( as if that isn't bad in and of itself).

    but if you have kept up with them, they are/have armed 50 black protesters for a legal LGOC march.. this makes me look down even more when you consider the fact many protestors have engaged in criminal activity, including shooting at the police. now you arm them with some 5.56 rifles with an effective kill range of 500 meters if they are using xm855 Ammo? Yeah, DUMB.

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