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Gun free zones

gwhitegm60

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2012
Messages
26
Location
Moore,Oklahoma
Who here agrees that we need more gun free zones and why? At the time of all of the mass shootings that we have had where were the police. There is a video on youtube that I ran across called shooters grill in Rifle ,Colo. If you get a chance check it out. I really wish we had places like that in Oklahoma. Going back to gun free zones I think if people were allowed to carry everywhere we might just have less mass shootings in this country. I don't carry all the time because of what has happen and what people would think. We still have a lot of anti-gun people out there plus I'm scared of having some idiot calling the police on me if they see me carrying. What is your opinion?

A armed society is a polite society/

Gregg
 

kinggabby

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2013
Messages
84
Location
Duncan, Ok
One thing you must remember is gun control is not for the kids. Gun control is not to protect the people. Gun control is people control. As long as we can have weapons all other amendments are for the most part safe. Politicians use what shooting to try and convince people on the fence to back anti gun laws. Fear is a powerful tool. Fear used right in some people will blind people to the truth. We in the gun community know that criminals do not follow the law. We know that if guns were not allowed then they would use other means to complete there sentence of death on whomever they wish ( Timothy McVeigh, Bath massacre, Osaka school massacre in Japan, and Alton Alexander Nolen in Moore, OK ) None used guns to kill. But the media wants people to think otherwise. An old saying comes to memory. People who tell the same lie eventually believe those lies. That's why no matter what logic and factual data you bring up they will not listen. They already have their beliefs set. You would have a more productive time arguing with a wall. Hitler knew that gun control was people control. HE knew once he could take guns out of peoples hands he could do what he wished. Other dictators learned the same lesson.
 

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,936
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
One thing you must remember is gun control is not for the kids. Gun control is not to protect the people. Gun control is people control. As long as we can have weapons all other amendments are for the most part safe. Politicians use what shooting to try and convince people on the fence to back anti gun laws. Fear is a powerful tool. Fear used right in some people will blind people to the truth. We in the gun community know that criminals do not follow the law. We know that if guns were not allowed then they would use other means to complete there sentence of death on whomever they wish ( Timothy McVeigh, Bath massacre, Osaka school massacre in Japan, and Alton Alexander Nolen in Moore, OK ) None used guns to kill. But the media wants people to think otherwise. An old saying comes to memory. People who tell the same lie eventually believe those lies. That's why no matter what logic and factual data you bring up they will not listen. They already have their beliefs set. You would have a more productive time arguing with a wall. Hitler knew that gun control was people control. HE knew once he could take guns out of peoples hands he could do what he wished. Other dictators learned the same lesson.
I had a friend who was the ultimate macho man except for one thing; you even say the word snake, let alone show him a picture of a snake and this guy was on top of the table. He was in your total control, he was putty in your hands.

Now, replace the word snake with gun. There are those that will always believe that 2+2=5. But it is worse than that, it's politicians that pray on those fears to control the populous. And when you show the sucker why he is a sucker he will chime back with - how dare you insult their intelligence.

Remember, God-denying people are never content with what they have or who they are; their greed drives them relentlessly.
 
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solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
Gregg, you would enjoy the environment and the female wait staff all carrying...food kinda, sorta is eh...but it is like hooters...you don't go for the food but rather the 'ambiance' of the place.

as for swatting, you might review some of the discussions on this forum...it is a concern...but i don't live my life worrying about what some might, could, or will do when they see my SDefence tool on my belt cuz i know i haven't, to the best of my knowledge anyway, done anything to cause the nice LE to use deadly force against me.

keep carrying and mind your own business and the savants will see your behaviour isn't a threat to them ...

ipse
 

travr6

New member
Joined
Mar 13, 2015
Messages
63
Location
Louisville ky
Can you name me one mass shooting that has occurred by a lone gunman where the majority of people were armed?
Nra convention, gun range, police station etc...
Any of you?
 

skidmark

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
10,444
Location
Valhalla
The sight of a holstered handgun being carried by a Law Abiding Citizen needs to become normalized. The only way I know how to do that is to go about my daily activities with my handgun holstered at my side, just like my wallet is in my front left pocket and my handkerchief is in my left rear pocket and my eyeglasses are hung on my nose and ears.

There's always the chance of being SWATed - for having a gun or looking like a homeless Santa Claus or putting enough chile oil in my Chinese soup to make noses run at the next table over. Just like there is a chance of being flattened by a semi trying to beat the yellow light or the **&^#%( person ahead of me in the grocery checkout lane deciding to finish their cell phone conversation then dig around for their EBT card when half of the junk they have is not allowed so they send the kid to put it back - one item at a time.

Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

stay safe.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
Not a mass shooting and not in a place where the majority were armed.
Try again

your right travr6, three (two random souls plus the shooter) lost in a mall environment by a shooter using a rifle, shouldn't meet your criteria. i am glad you have defined the terms as there are quote:

There are mass murders and mass killings, active shooters and serial killers, mass shootings and mass public shootings.

The FBI, by contrast, doesn’t have an official definition of “mass shooting” on the books, but in 2014 defined a “mass killing” as one with three or more fatalities...

...Mass Shooting Tracker...defines a mass shooting as one with “four or more people shot in one event.”

...the Congressional Research Service (CRS) defined a mass shooting as a homicide in which four or more people are killed with firearms—a definition based on the FBI’s definition of a “mass murder” as opposed to a “mass shooting.”

But other statistics, including a Harvard analysis, show that mass shootings—in which four people were killed....

The difference between three dead and four dead might be statistically significant, but is morally negligible. Just hours after the Oregon shooting, a man shot dead his wife and two others, and injured a fourth person, in North Florida. On Friday, five people were shot outside a Baltimore shopping center.

unquote http://www.newrepublic.com/article/123027/heres-why-no-one-can-agree-number-mass-shootings

you're right, in my cite alledgedly one at least stood up with his firearm.

ipse
 
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travr6

New member
Joined
Mar 13, 2015
Messages
63
Location
Louisville ky
Not sure what you were trying to prove there. Your mall shooting example was neither a mass shooting nor a place where the majority of people were armed.
1 person with a firearm in a shopping mall full of people does not make a majority.

Even if there had been 100 people killed in your example it still didn't meet what I asked for.




Again, has there ever been a mass shooting by a lone gunman where the majority of people were armed? Ever?
 
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OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
... Again, has there ever been a mass shooting by a lone gunman where the majority of people were armed? Ever?
How about this instead:
Has there ever been a mass shooting by a lone gunman where the majority of people could be armed? Ever?
Then again, a mall may have a fair number of people armed and nobody knows they are armed.
 

Bernymac

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2013
Messages
415
Location
Las Vegas
Who here agrees that we need more gun free zones and why? At the time of all of the mass shootings that we have had where were the police. There is a video on youtube that I ran across called shooters grill in Rifle ,Colo. If you get a chance check it out. I really wish we had places like that in Oklahoma. Going back to gun free zones I think if people were allowed to carry everywhere we might just have less mass shootings in this country. I don't carry all the time because of what has happen and what people would think. We still have a lot of anti-gun people out there plus I'm scared of having some idiot calling the police on me if they see me carrying. What is your opinion?

A armed society is a polite society/

Gregg

I am sorry that you are afraid of idiots and what idiots think or might do. It is a really sad state of affairs once we let idiots do the thinking and if we let them dictate the course of our daily lives. Idiocy, I tell you, idiocy! :uhoh:
 

travr6

New member
Joined
Mar 13, 2015
Messages
63
Location
Louisville ky
How about this instead: Then again, a mall may have a fair number of people armed and nobody knows they are armed.
That has nothing to do with the point I was trying to make.

These mass shooters tend to pick places where the people are not allowed to defend themselves.

There have been a few times where a person had give into a police station shooting but they were meet with an immediate response and were unable to kill multiple people.

So again...

Can anyone find one instance where a lone gunman committed a mass shooting in a heavily armed area?

It seems to me that the most logical way to stop a mass shooter is to encourage people to carry not create more defenseless people.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
seems, trevr6, you also missed the point i was making that there is no clear consensus on terms, mass shootings, mass killings, number shot, or number killed...

your statement needs clarification...pure and simple.

and since your statement lacks clarity...OC's seems pretty clear to me...like the individual claiming to have a firearm concealed during the OR event.

ipse
 

Wstar425

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2014
Messages
570
Location
Tomahawk and Abbotsford, Wi.
In an unscientific survey of ONE, I've had more people than normal notice my OC firearm in the last two months, and quite a few more positive comments than normal, along with extensive questioning. I've always said people are not paying attention, but I think maybe some are waking up. I talked to one family from Cook County, (Chicago) for over an hour about firearms.

Outside of my immediate family, I don't much care what other people think of my activities as long as they are legal. I see plenty of things daily I don't agree with/like, but I've never called the LE on anyone. My limited experience with LE investigating me as an OC to be overwhelmingly positive. Probably varies by state and maybe even locale? Glad I live where I do!

I've been called on once, a few years ago. Called was told to not waste 911 resources, I was not even asked for ID. I realize it's not always like that.

I OC 100 percent of the time where legal. CC at church and if I need to wear a jacket. I don't see that changing for fear of offending someone, or insulting their sensitive feelings.
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
That has nothing to do with the point I was trying to make.

These mass shooters tend to pick places where the people are not allowed to defend themselves.

There have been a few times where a person had give into a police station shooting but they were meet with an immediate response and were unable to kill multiple people.

So again...

Can anyone find one instance where a lone gunman committed a mass shooting in a heavily armed area?

It seems to me that the most logical way to stop a mass shooter is to encourage people to carry not create more defenseless people.
Here ya go, I'm confident that the answer to your question can be found here. http://momsdemandaction.org/

Demanding a answer from a bunch of gun nuts who OC...oh kay...
 

travr6

New member
Joined
Mar 13, 2015
Messages
63
Location
Louisville ky
seems, trevr6, you also missed the point i was making that there is no clear consensus on terms, mass shootings, mass killings, number shot, or number killed...

your statement needs clarification...pure and simple.

and since your statement lacks clarity...OC's seems pretty clear to me...like the individual claiming to have a firearm concealed during the OR event.

ipse
No it doesn't. But here you go.

Lone gunman means ONE

Mass shooting means 4 or more as used by the fbi and most major news outlets. Hell, I will even give you 3.

Majority armed location means a place where the majority are knowingly going to be armed like a police station, gun range, nra convention, etc...

If you need even more specific terms let me know but you can begin with those.




This is why debates cannot be had. People get side tracked into debating semantics instead of answering a very basic question.
 
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WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
How about this instead: Then again, a mall may have a fair number of people armed and nobody knows they are armed.
In my experience this is true, it is a felony to violate GFZSA, and many state laws on government property. BUT in many states it is only a misdemeanor trespass offense on private property. Nut cases may be crazy but they are not always stupid.

I have known many CHP holders in NC who bragged that they carried on private property where they were not allowed, in fact every single one that I knew carried. I am sure the nut cases know some of the same people.

It is a shame that the FBI does not keep statistics for those almost mass shootings that were stopped, or prevented by a LAC. The only thing that has been proven to stop a mass shooter is force. That force sooner would keep the body count down considerably. But we all know that when seconds count, police are minutes away.
 
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