National Gun Day Show

Is anyone attending the show this weekend at the expo center? I plan on heading up Sunday afternoon and looking for some deals. Does anyone know of the rules for OC/CC at the show? I've looked on their website with no luck.

travis1911 said:

Is anyone attending the show this weekend at the expo center? I plan on heading up Sunday afternoon and looking for some deals. Does anyone know of the rules for OC/CC at the show? I've looked on their website with no luck.

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travis...it's a gun show for goodness sake...so of course no sidearms, CC or OC will be permitted by attendees or vendors alike. even while it is probably allowed by statute the organizers will do there own thing due to "insurance" or "assure attendees 'comfort and safety' while attending our venue" or ?

i am reminded incident several years ago where the bloke stole firearms from the show in Denver not once but twice, a day apart, by out running the singular FAT OUT OF SHAPE security guard...

sigh...

ipse

solus said:

travis...it's a gun show for goodness sake...so of course no sidearms, CC or OC will be permitted by attendees or vendors alike. even while it is probably allowed by statute the organizers will do there own thing due to "insurance" or "assure attendees 'comfort and safety' while attending our venue" or ?

i am reminded incident several years ago where the bloke stole firearms from the show in Denver not once but twice, a day apart, by out running the singular FAT OUT OF SHAPE security guard...

sigh...

ipse

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I know that (rightly so in most cases) people on this forum like to see documentation behind claims made by fellow posters. This didn't happen lately so I have no proof to show but: Promoters of two different large events did let me see copies of their insurance coverage for their shows. Yes, the stipulation about 'no loaded guns except on duty law enforcement' was in there both times. And on another occasion the guy who owns a much smaller show/swap meet showed me the same language in his policy. This doesn't please me any more than it apparently does you, solus, but is it reasonable to expect a promoter to work without such protection?

Brian D. said:

I know that (rightly so in most cases) people on this forum like to see documentation behind claims made by fellow posters. This didn't happen lately so I have no proof to show but: Promoters of two different large events did let me see copies of their insurance coverage for their shows. Yes, the stipulation about 'no loaded guns except on duty law enforcement' was in there both times. And on another occasion the guy who owns a much smaller show/swap meet showed me the same language in his policy. This doesn't please me any more than it apparently does you, solus, but is it reasonable to expect a promoter to work without such protection?

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let's see, if the promoter(s) buying the policy says no i will accept the risk ~ based on my entrance criteria (essentially what gutshot laid out) the insurer should oblige. however, like insurance in toto, it is sold from the emotional standpoint ~ you could be wiped out, your family would be taken care of, etc.

please do not take my comments as saying we shouldn't have insurance, but...your medical, auto, etc. buttttt, who insurance who is benefiting from making the insured pay the high deductible and if medicos, auto repair, etc., knew it was coming out of the pocket of the individual...me thinks the costs would shrink.

(raising a hand) last time a mass killing occurred at a gun show? anybody?

open book question:

http://www.gannett-cdn.com/GDContent/mass-killings/index.html#frequency (decent article actually)

http://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-leads-world-in-mass-shootings-1443905359

http://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/mass-shootings-grab-headlines-but-others-go-under-radar/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...guns-and-mass-shootings-in-the-united-states/ (before OR shooting and fair article)

ok, time is up...see any mention of a mass killing at 'gun free' firearm/knife shows?

so the risk is negligible so why would promoter(s) fall for this extra expense cuz they are forced to...

ipse

btw...most large entities, vegas casinos, governmental bodies, large aerospace corps, walmart, other corps etc., are self insuring, meaning they have no insurance per se and accept risks and then litigate the issue till it dies.

That sounds like a recipe to make a nice sitting duck dinner.

Now how many of you really think that just because they have to have a zip tie on there gun that they also don't have a knife and a couple of mags in their pocket?

Sent from my ALCATEL ONE TOUCH Fierce using Tapatalk

gutshot said:

Why bother with all of that? The same person could just conceal a loaded gun. One is as easy to sneak in as the other and I am certain that there are plenty of undisclosed guns at every gun show. Not everyone obeys every rule and there are no searches. Its all on the "honor system".

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And so long as carrying is legal and there are no searches, the rule really amounts to a "keep it concealed and don't handle it" request than an outright ban.

gutshot said:

All of this talk of "mass shootings at gun shows" and "defending your life" forces me to point out that, IMHO, this policy has more to do with negligent discharges than with a person thinking it is a good idea to shoot up a gun show. Even with such policies in place, ND's are not uncommon at gun shows. I have almost quit attending gun shows over the number of times I have had guns pointed at me. I am not talking about just muzzle sweeps, but actually had the gun deliberately pointed at me. Some people don't see anything wrong with that behavior.

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Exactly. Gun shows are a unique environment relative to the handling of guns. For most booths, there isn't a safe "down range" at which a gun can be properly, safely pointed. If one were to be strict, it is all but impossible to get a gun off a table and pointed either straight up or straight down without sweeping someone.

Gun shows are one location where some of the most basic gun safety rules are most likely to be violated. Shooting ranges are far more strict. Even if rules about pointing guns at things you don't intend (or are willing) to destroy are obeyed, there is a tremendous amount of gun handling going on at gun shows.

A more appropriate rule would be what some gun stores have that: "Guns brought in for service/sale must be cleared and zip tied. Guns carried for self-defense must remain holstered unless needed for actual defensive use." But it would be all but impossible to keep track of whether a gun has been properly cleared or whether someone has decided that he really does want to see how well his loaded carry gun fits in that nifty holster that is on sale. So I can't fault an insurance company or show promoter who goes with the "no loaded guns (except LEOs)" rule, and who then does little to enforce it except to expel anyone caught violating it.

Those who suggest a gun show owner run a show without insurance protections should put their own assets at risk to run a show, sans insurance, before expecting anyone else to do likewise.

Charles

mate, the individual who advocated that course of action did a ROI analysis and discerned to be self insured was best course to proceed

ipse

I've never been to a gun show...

gutshot said:

No, it is an outright ban. It is just difficult to enforce. If you are discovered with any of the prohibited items, you will be made to comply or leave.

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Gut, as has been previously acknowledged by piper on this forum's threads, he sloppily CC's in COSTCO knowing it is against the property entity's express wishes...

so why on earth should a gun show change that mentality?

ipse

I agree with the idea of any firearm you intend to trade/sell/service be zip-tied and unloaded. That makes sense. On the other hand I think carrying a concealed firearm for self defense should be a non issue. What about the walk to and from the show? A criminal would know the policy as well as see you leave with a bag full of goodies they would love to get their hands on. I would hope that anyone carrying would know not to un-holster your defensive firearm unless needed and if caught doing so I would think that borderline constitutes wanton endangerment. That is my biggest pet peeve while hanging out at my LGS but I understand first hand it does happen. Nothing like being swept with a hi point some goofball yanks out of his pants to see if it fits in the $10 uncle mikes from the bargain bin.