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Thread: Going to New Mexico.

  1. #1
    Regular Member Phoenix David's Avatar
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    Going to New Mexico.

    Iím going to New Mexico for a IDPA match later this month and want to make sure I didnít miss anything on New Mexico gun laws. I have a Arizona CCW permit

    I have no intention of going to any of the prohibited places that are listed.

    Normally when driving I ďcarryĒ a gun that is in a holster that is attached to the center console, not sure if the counts as CC or OC. It canít be seen from outside the vehicle

    I canít OC at like a restaurant that serves alcohol but CC is legal if it is not posted? Like Texas Roadhouse

    I canít OC at like a Wal-Mart but can CC if not posted?

    Other than that I plan on hanging around the pool at the hotel reading a book or a good Tobacco shop

    Thanks guys.
    Freedom is a bit like sex, when your getting it you take it for granted, when you're not you want it bad, other people get mad at you for having it and others want to take it away from you so only they have it.

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    Regular Member qednick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix David View Post
    Iím going to New Mexico for a IDPA match later this month and want to make sure I didnít miss anything on New Mexico gun laws. I have a Arizona CCW permit

    I have no intention of going to any of the prohibited places that are listed.

    Normally when driving I ďcarryĒ a gun that is in a holster that is attached to the center console, not sure if the counts as CC or OC. It canít be seen from outside the vehicle

    I canít OC at like a restaurant that serves alcohol but CC is legal if it is not posted? Like Texas Roadhouse

    I canít OC at like a Wal-Mart but can CC if not posted?

    Other than that I plan on hanging around the pool at the hotel reading a book or a good Tobacco shop

    Thanks guys.
    The biggest thing for me (while in NM) is making sure I don't OC into ANY establishment that sells (not just serves) alcohol. That includes just about every gas station and grocery store.

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    Daughter lives in ABQ. Do not recognize a WI license. They have the "three foot rule" around your car, so you can pump gas while OC, as long as you use a credit card and don't go inside the store where alcohol is sold.

    You also need to be aware of reservations, I believe. OC is legal, but without a recognized permit of some sort they seem to have a lot of restrictions, IMO. Almost to make it not worth it. From what I have seen and read, ABQ Police do not have much patience, nor a sense of humor.

    Good luck at the match!
    Last edited by Wstar425; 10-08-2015 at 08:30 AM.

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    AFA restaurants go- you can CC only in places that are "beer and wine establishments." Not places that have a full liquor license and serve liquor. And that place must also not be posted.

    Easiest to just call from the parking lot before going in to ask about license type. I would not ask about posting so as not to give anyone any ideas, if they're not actually posted. If you get my drift.

    AFA the vehicle goes- your holster setup would probably be considered concealed if it can't be seen from outside. Regardless, you can do what ever you want in your vehicle- it is considered an extension of your home and you do not need to have a CC license to CC in your home or on your own property.

    Enjoy your time here.

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wstar425 View Post
    Daughter lives in ABQ. Do not recognize a WI license. They have the "three foot rule" around your car, so you can pump gas while OC, as long as you use a credit card and don't go inside the store where alcohol is sold.

    You also need to be aware of reservations, I believe. OC is legal, but without a recognized permit of some sort they seem to have a lot of restrictions, IMO. Almost to make it not worth it. From what I have seen and read, ABQ Police do not have much patience, nor a sense of humor.

    Good luck at the match!
    uh, excuse me, (raising my hand) but do you have a cite for your statement bolded above?

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    oh dave was on the forum last year to tell us he was involved in a match in new mexico...

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ing-New-Mexico

    and advised by locals where to eat...

    and the question raised was similar...

    ipse
    Last edited by solus; 10-08-2015 at 08:48 AM.
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

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    Regular Member qednick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AH.74 View Post
    ... Regardless, you can do what ever you want in your vehicle- it is considered an extension of your home and you do not need to have a CC license to CC in your home or on your own property.
    ...
    Yup! And that includes riding a bicycle...if you feel like getting some exercise! :-)

  9. #9
    Regular Member Phoenix David's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    oh dave was on the forum last year to tell us he was involved in a match in new mexico...

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ing-New-Mexico

    and advised by locals where to eat...

    and the question raised was similar...

    ipse

    Yep just wanted to make sure nothing had changed since then.
    Freedom is a bit like sex, when your getting it you take it for granted, when you're not you want it bad, other people get mad at you for having it and others want to take it away from you so only they have it.

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    There is absolutely no "three-foot-rule" or anything like it, whatsoever. I have heard of this and other similar misinformation being passed around before. As soon as you are out of/off of your vehicle, you must "un-conceal"- unless you are licensed of course.

    Yes- the vehicle is any form of personal transportation; be it bike, motorcycle, or horseback. Don't know if you could push the limits to other things.


    "You also need to be aware of reservations, I believe. OC is legal, but without a recognized permit of some sort they seem to have a lot of restrictions, IMO. Almost to make it not worth it."

    NO, NO and NO again. NO CARRY at all on reservations. Be very, very careful about passing on bad information.
    Last edited by AH.74; 10-08-2015 at 11:53 AM.

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    Newbie fish1552's Avatar
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    So definitive answer?

    So open carry through the state is okay at rest stops and gas stations while traveling through the state to AZ? I know they do not honor GAs CC (only state on my planned routes), so I can lawfully carry in my vehicle and OC while refueling, correct? Play it safe and unarm when entering restaurant to eat in case of alcohol sales. That is what I take from all the above.

    The link to the State law I found to research is dead.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by fish1552 View Post
    So open carry through the state is okay at rest stops and gas stations while traveling through the state to AZ? I know they do not honor GAs CC (only state on my planned routes), so I can lawfully carry in my vehicle and OC while refueling, correct? Play it safe and unarm when entering restaurant to eat in case of alcohol sales. That is what I take from all the above.
    ...
    Don't forget the issue of Indian Reservations. They are semi-sovereign nations and for purposes of firearm laws (among other laws) they have to be considered as a separate State from the State in which you are traveling. The Navajo or Apache reservation in New Mexico does not necessarily have the same gun laws as New Mexico, isn't required to recognize a New Mexico permit, etc. When entering an Indian Reservation, it is as if you have crossed a State boundary and entered a different State. In most cases, the reservation will be far more hostile to RKBA than will the State in which the reservation is located.

    When driving on a State or US road through the reservation, you are still in the State. But once you leave that road, you enter the reservation and are subject to their gun laws. This includes leaving the State/US road to get gas or a meal, or to do some gambling. Be very aware of whether you are traveling through a reservation or not before leaving the main road. For example, the little town of Shiprock, NM at the intersections of US 491 (formerly US 666) and US 64 is on the Navajo Reservation. So long as you are on 491 or 64, you are governed by the gun laws of New Mexico (Reservation police can still make stops for traffic issues). But if you pull off of those roads into a gas station parking or restaurant parking lot, you are now government by the far less gun friendly laws of the Navajo Nation.

    I do not know what laws govern the shoulders of the roads where you often see vendors hawking Indian art and crafts. I've never cared to be the test case of where the State/federal right-of-way/easement ended and full Indian Nation control began.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fish1552 View Post
    So open carry through the state is okay at rest stops and gas stations while traveling through the state to AZ..... so I can lawfully carry in my vehicle and OC while refueling, correct? Play it safe and unarm when entering restaurant to eat in case of alcohol sales. That is what I take from all the above.
    Generally, yes- but take into account the info provided by utbagpiper above. If you want to avoid all that, it is possible to do so by staying off the reservations/pueblos- which you can do for the most part with some good planning.

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    Newbie fish1552's Avatar
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    Thank you

    Quote Originally Posted by AH.74 View Post
    Generally, yes- but take into account the info provided by utbagpiper above. If you want to avoid all that, it is possible to do so by staying off the reservations/pueblos- which you can do for the most part with some good planning.
    Ok, thanks for the heads up both of you. I'm planning on staying on I-10 or I-40 so I'll just play it safe.

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    Regular Member qednick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fish1552 View Post
    Ok, thanks for the heads up both of you. I'm planning on staying on I-10 or I-40 so I'll just play it safe.
    +1 about the reservations. Driving thru on the highway is fine but whenever we go thru I plan my gas stops, eating, etc. so I don't have to stop in a reservation area off of I-40. Gallop caused me some issues last time I was there because for all intents and purposes it looked like I was within a reservation area (native art shops everywhere, stopped at a Cracker Barrel and we were the only none-native Americans in there). I played it safe and didn't carry during our stops there but found out afterwards that Gallop isn't in a reservation area (although very close).

    I found out there's maps on google images that show Indian Reservation boundaries for NM and other states. A good idea to print some of those off prior to your trip so you know what you're dealing with.

    Other than that, absolutely no issues OC'ing in NM.

  16. #16
    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    BTW...the NM's Native Americans do not live on reservations as their land is referred to as either their tribal lands or their Pueblo.

    enjoy your time in the land of enchantment.

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    BTW...the NM's Native Americans do not live on reservations as their land is referred to as either their tribal lands or their Pueblo.
    Or as the "Navajo Nation" or less flattering things. Most I know who live on or near the Navajo Reservation in New Mexico (or who have family there) refer to it simply as "The Rez" (or Res).

    I consider the Reservation to be the most cruel crime perpetuated against the American Indians, exceeding even the mass slaughters. To vanquish a man or a nation in battle is one thing. To condemn that man or nation to perpetual poverty, dependence, addiction, etc, is even worse. I don't think anyone intended to inflict such a crime, intentions were good. But the effect is horrific. It is silly to think a nomadic people can maintain their prior lifestyle and culture on a relatively small chunk of land.

    It would have been far more merciful to have treated the American Indians as individuals rather than as members of a group. Each individual should have been given citizenship, and encouraged to make a successful life within the dominant society. Integration has worked great for the Irish, Welch, English, Germans, Vietnamese, and virtually every other group that has decided to integrate. Among those that have declined to integrate, I think only the Amish can be considered to be successful at maintaining a healthy, respectable culture.

    Most importantly to this group and discussion, the reservations in New Mexico are rather hostile to RKBA. Know where borders are.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    Quote Originally Posted by utbagpiper View Post
    Most importantly to this group and discussion, the reservations in New Mexico are rather hostile to RKBA.
    In terms of the context of this discussion- for "us" as outsiders, yes. But I do know of several native Americans living within tribal lands who own many guns. So for them as insiders, it may not be that different.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by AH.74 View Post
    In terms of the context of this discussion- for "us" as outsiders, yes. But I do know of several native Americans living within tribal lands who own many guns. So for them as insiders, it may not be that different.
    According to this post at handgunlaw.us most tribes do not post their tribal laws on line so research is difficult. What little is posted suggests that many tribes are discriminatory issue at best. I suspect that in many cases here in the West at least, tribal members would face different (ie less severe) penalties for carrying on reservation land than would non-Indians. I also note that some tribes enjoy hunting or fishing rights on tribal or even non-tribal lands that are not available to non-Indians.

    Remember though, that as semi-sovereign nations with vastly different cultures and heritages, many things we take for granted are different on the Res. At least the Navajo reservation has very limited private property rights compared to what you'd find in the USA proper. It is often more difficult for a bank to write a mortgage against land on a reservation than elsewhere because of legal limits on mortgaging or otherwise placing the property at risk. The theory is that we don't want Indians defrauded from their lands (again). In practice, this also often has the effect of impeding economic development.

    My sister teaches nursing at a community college in a community adjacent to the Navajo Reservation. As they teach their students each year they have to remind them, "While we are a first world nation, we are living next door to and provide service to many persons living in, a third world nation, with all the personal and public health challenges third world nations face."

    The Navajo Reservation (and other large reservations in the West) is a whole different world. Many residents lack electricity, running water, or sewer or even septic service. It is not uncommon to have cases of Bubonic plague. STDs run rampant. Navajos often don't care for the service provided in the reservation hospitals and so go into non-reservation hospitals to give birth. A labor-deliver nurse from such a town told me, "Around here we consider a woman with zero prenatal care, preeclampsia, and fewer than 3 STDs to be a routine delivery." They have to move into diabetes, the really nasty STDs, or some major physical trauma before the delivery is considered unusual or high risk.

    Most of this is off topic here. But to begin to understand the vast difference between State and Indian laws on RKBA, one needs some insights into the vast cultural differences that pervade almost all of life between those on the Res and those not on the Res. And in some cases, this includes Indians who have very deliberately rejected the Reservation lifestyle and instead integrated into "white" society. The issue is not one of race/ethnicity, but one of culture.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  20. #20
    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by utbagpiper View Post
    SNIP...

    Most of this is off topic here.

    Charles

    OMGoodness, mate, did you just stereotypically trash the entire native american community talking that trash with this post?

    are bloody kidding me...

    truly you are a piece of work in every sense of the word.

    truly sad thing...you do not even recognize you have done anything wrong...

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

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