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Thread: Governor to BAN OC in Executive Branch Buildings

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    Governor to BAN OC in Executive Branch Buildings

    http://wsls.com/2015/10/15/gov-mcaul...-current-laws/

    McAuliffe’s executive order will also ban all firearms in all state buildings. This will not apply for law enforcement officers.


    “The actions directed in this executive order will help our Commonwealth better enforce Virginia laws designed to keep guns away from people who would use them for harm,” said Governor McAuliffe, in a written statement.

    Why am I not surprised? Guess Bloomers told him to start harassing gun owners.
    '
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 10-16-2015 at 11:54 AM. Reason: Title changed per request

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    Regular Member The Wolfhound's Avatar
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    for the moment

    He is only banning "Openly Carried Firearms" in State Executive buildings. How do we challenge this? It feels unconstitutional.
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    Guess he thinks increasing the number of Gun-free Slaughter Zones will some how decrease the number of shootings.

    Sure as Hell has NOT worked for LA, Chiraq, NYC, Baltimore, Cleveland, ...........

    And I would love to ask him or the AG when was the last time either saw a criminal open carry?

    Maybe Bloomers saw an open carrier while he was attempting to make another straw purchase in Virginia and he wet himself again?
    Last edited by va_tazdad; 10-15-2015 at 12:31 PM.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wolfhound View Post
    He is only banning "Openly Carried Firearms" in State Executive buildings. How do we challenge this? It feels unconstitutional.
    Concealed carry is governed by law - OC is not. That's the first thing that comes to mind.

    This might be a good time to find out if "license holders" can be differentiated from other lawfully armed citizens. Especially lawfully armed citizens who are not burdened by the legislative restrictions of a CHP. Might be a decent 14th Amendment issue in there.

    Might be time to do some action by those who OC but also have a CHP - go OCing to any of the places he is including in his executive order, walk right up to the door, pull your shirt out of your pants or otherwise conceal your handgun and go inside. Then go outside and revert to OC. Lather, rinse, repeat until you get tired or some doofus tries to stop you from coming back in. (Just have be sure you are not impeding access to the entrance/exit.) I have the notion that this could easily be seen as political speech.

    Who might be our allies? GOA? CRKBA? First Amendment Foundation? Rutherford Institute? VCDL?

    Time to talk among ourselves and make some decisions.

    stay safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Concealed carry is governed by law - OC is not. That's the first thing that comes to mind.

    This might be a good time to find out if "license holders" can be differentiated from other lawfully armed citizens. Especially lawfully armed citizens who are not burdened by the legislative restrictions of a CHP. Might be a decent 14th Amendment issue in there.

    Might be time to do some action by those who OC but also have a CHP - go OCing to any of the places he is including in his executive order, walk right up to the door, pull your shirt out of your pants or otherwise conceal your handgun and go inside. Then go outside and revert to OC. Lather, rinse, repeat until you get tired or some doofus tries to stop you from coming back in. (Just have be sure you are not impeding access to the entrance/exit.) I have the notion that this could easily be seen as political speech.

    Who might be our allies? GOA? CRKBA? First Amendment Foundation? Rutherford Institute? VCDL?

    Time to talk among ourselves and make some decisions.

    stay safe.
    It has worked in other Places they so tired of dealing with it they stop.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Concealed carry is governed by law - OC is not. That's the first thing that comes to mind.

    This might be a good time to find out if "license holders" can be differentiated from other lawfully armed citizens. Especially lawfully armed citizens who are not burdened by the legislative restrictions of a CHP. Might be a decent 14th Amendment issue in there.

    Might be time to do some action by those who OC but also have a CHP - go OCing to any of the places he is including in his executive order, walk right up to the door, pull your shirt out of your pants or otherwise conceal your handgun and go inside. Then go outside and revert to OC. Lather, rinse, repeat until you get tired or some doofus tries to stop you from coming back in. (Just have be sure you are not impeding access to the entrance/exit.) I have the notion that this could easily be seen as political speech.

    Who might be our allies? GOA? CRKBA? First Amendment Foundation? Rutherford Institute? VCDL?

    Time to talk among ourselves and make some decisions.

    stay safe.
    I'm not sure that will work. From the text of EA50:
    We must take every precaution to protect our citizens and state employees from gun violence. We cannot wait until a tragedy occurs to decide to address it. Prevention requires us to address areas of concern before they are realized. Accordingly, I hereby declare that it is the policy of the Commonwealth that open carry of firearms shall be prohibited in offices occupied by executive branch agencies, unless held by law enforcement, authorized security, or military personnel authorized to carry firearms in accordance with their duties. Within 30 days of the date of this Executive Order, the Director of the Department of General Services (DGS) shall issue guidance prohibiting carrying weapons openly in offices occupied by executive branch agencies.

    I further order the Director of DGS, within 30 days of the date of this Executive Order, to propose regulations to ban the carrying of concealed weapons in offices occupied by executive branch agencies, unless held by law enforcement, authorized security, or military personnel authorized to carry firearms in accordance with their duties.
    He's targeting both open and concealed carry.
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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Wanted to put this separately -

    Most of our business with State Government" takes place in Executive Branch facilities. Look here http://www.statelocalgov.net/state-va.cfm under "Executive" and "Boards and Commissions".

    Can you say "screwed"? I knew you could.

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    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grylnsmn View Post
    I'm not sure that will work. From the text of EA50:He's targeting both open and concealed carry.
    Oh, [bad words]!

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    TMac thinks he is now president.

    I know we don't discuss CC much here, but in a legislative sense, do regulations require approval of the general assembly?


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    Last edited by homestar; 10-15-2015 at 01:13 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Wanted to put this separately -

    Most of our business with State Government" takes place in Executive Branch facilities. Look here http://www.statelocalgov.net/state-va.cfm under "Executive" and "Boards and Commissions".

    Can you say "screwed"? I knew you could.

    http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...psziaw39mp.jpg

    stay safe.
    I'm thinking a different kind of ******* and w/o a kiss.
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    Well this ought to be interesting. Perhaps this full on attack by the Governor will finally bring out those who've neglected involvement in a while and we'll get some central focus again. With a statewide election coming up shortly I suppose we'll know soon. It would do my soul well to see the legislature go so pro-gun that the Governor and the anti-rights crowd not only gain no ground, but see devastating losses. Then again, statewide gun and ammo sales may just go up with few people turning out at the Capitol.

    I suppose I'm surprised it took this long for Governor McAuliffe to take off the gloves.
    Last edited by jmelvin; 10-15-2015 at 01:50 PM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by homestar View Post
    I know we don't discuss CC much here, but in a legislative sense, do regulations require approval of the general assembly?

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    There is a regular procedure for implementing agency regulations involving public notice and meetings etc.
    http://register.dls.virginia.gov/process.shtml

    Executive decisions/directives not so much. Such might not be legal in some instances, but who here wants to volunteer to argue with the nice officer when he presents the shiny, but previously used, wrist jewelry and gives you a gray and forbidding place to sleep. Your employment, home, bank account, children's college fund, and marriage will be in jeopardy.

    The camel is head and neck are inside the tent.........and his breathe stinks!!
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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Well damn....I spent most of the day filming in a state building while ocing. ...then come out to read about this.

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    sounds like user need to weigh in with an opinion to provide guidance...

    NC's emergency power's crap was challenged and won, but they were statutes...not sure about governor declarations.

    do they have the affect of statutory law? don't they need enacted by your legislation to be put into statute?

    ipse
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmelvin View Post
    Well this ought to be interesting. Perhaps this full on attack by the Governor will finally bring out those who've neglected involvement so in a while and we'll get some central focus again. With a statewide election coming up shortly I suppose we'll know soon. It would do my soul well to see the legislature go so pro-gun that the Governor and the anti-rights crowd not only gain no ground, but see devastating losses. Then again, statewide gun and ammo sales may just go up with few people turning out at the Capitol.

    I suppose I'm surprised it took this long for Governor McAuliffe to take off the gloves.
    As it stand now, we do not have enough votes in both houses of the GA to override a governor veto.

    Yes elections matter - both on a national level and on a STATE level. We must stay motivated and educate all others about the loss of freedoms - antis nick, slice, and chip away from what makes life so dear. It must stop - we must reverse the acts of the antis in office. Throw the bums out!
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    sounds like user need to weigh in with an opinion to provide guidance...

    NC's emergency power's crap was challenged and won, but they were statutes...not sure about governor declarations.

    do they have the affect of statutory law? don't they need enacted by your legislation to be put into statute?

    ipse
    See my post #12 above and read the link.

    But this has not been done through the regulation process, but Executive Directive.


    As an example:
    "The power to control state operations also allows governors to issue executive orders related to state employment and facilities. Governor Kaine used this power in 2006 to issue a GEO that, with few exceptions, prohibits “smoking in offices occupied by executive branch agencies and institutions, including institutions of higher education,” buildings operated by the executive branch, and state vehicles “to improve the health of employees and minimize health risks in the workplace.” In so doing, Governor Kaine relied on powers derived from both the Virginia Constitution and relevant state laws. Until Virginia enacted legislation addressing environmental smoke in state and local government buildings in 2009, this GEO protected state employees and visitors in state buildings and vehicles from secondhand smoke exposure."

    Power to do this is claimed under Va. Const. Art. V, §1. &. Va. Code §§2.2-100-135 (2011).
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3560871/

    There are 3 branches to our state government: Executive, Legislative, and Judicial. The governor is the CEO and Chairman of the Board of the Executive branch. He can hire or fire a director or move his office to the bathroom.......well almost.
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 10-15-2015 at 02:17 PM. Reason: added
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    See my post #12 above and read the link.

    But this has not been done through the regulation process, but Executive Directive.


    As an example:
    "The power to control state operations also allows governors to issue executive orders related to state employment and facilities. Governor Kaine used this power in 2006 to issue a GEO that, with few exceptions, prohibits “smoking in offices occupied by executive branch agencies and institutions, including institutions of higher education,” buildings operated by the executive branch, and state vehicles “to improve the health of employees and minimize health risks in the workplace.” In so doing, Governor Kaine relied on powers derived from both the Virginia Constitution and relevant state laws. Until Virginia enacted legislation addressing environmental smoke in state and local government buildings in 2009, this GEO protected state employees and visitors in state buildings and vehicles from secondhand smoke exposure."

    Power to do this is claimed under Va. Const. Art. V, §1. &. Va. Code §§2.2-100-135 (2011).
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3560871/

    There are 3 branches to our state government: Executive, Legislative, and Judicial. The governor is the CEO and Chairman of the Board of the Executive branch. He can hire or fire a director or move his office to the bathroom.......well almost.
    Grape, two attaboys in the same day...nice and please i certainly appreciate the in depth, at least to my 1/8 in depth of needed explanation...interesting to see it apparently took 3 years to get the legislative to catch up on the smoking ban...

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

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    Regular Member rscottie's Avatar
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    McAuliffe signs executive order on gun control measures - Bans OC in State Buildings

    Last edited by rscottie; 10-15-2015 at 03:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    Grape, two attaboys in the same day...nice and please i certainly appreciate the in depth, at least to my 1/8 in depth of needed explanation...interesting to see it apparently took 3 years to get the legislative to catch up on the smoking ban...

    ipse
    No attaboys deserved - I'm flopping like a fish on the pier looking for something to help and not finding it.

    I have seen some thoughts from User on this - I'm going to see if he will share them here. Think it would be presumptive of me to do so and and not fair to him.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    The more we think and talk about this, the more I have to wonder how McAwful will look to ban CC in state agencies. The concealed carry laws are black letter, statute law and are the purview of the General Assembly, the legislative branch.

    Because Bloomie's puppet governor doesn't like a law, doesn't give him the authority to change it......but he is looking for a way. He said so.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by homestar View Post
    I know we don't discuss CC much here, but in a legislative sense, do regulations require approval of the general assembly?


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    No, regulations do not require legislative approval. But as Grapeshot mentioned, they have to go through a formal process before they are implemented. Executive orders are not regulations.

    My first impressions are that because there is statute law regarding where CC is permitted and prohibited there needs to something in the Va Administrative Code (similar to what public universities have done) to enact this restriction. My guess is that if every comment received was against this and every even barely gun-friendly legislator wrote opposing this it would still happen.

    Someone on another board wrote about the chances of getting this reversed:

    Nothing like a complete abandonment of the Republican gubernatorial candidate by his so-called party to put a loathsome Democrat in office. (By this I am applying the adjective to this governor specifically, not all Democrats in general. Not all are loathsome. Some are even tolerable. )

    Beaten by 2.5 percentage points in a race where the Republican party spent almost nothing to support "their" candidate compared to what they spent to elect their candidate (the currently imprisoned Bob McDonnell) last election.

    Thanks again, traitors!
    McAuliffe is going to go down in history as the first Governor who actually Did SomethingTM.

    stay safe.
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  22. #22
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Now being discussed here: http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...80#post2164380

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    See my post #12 above and read the link.

    But this has not been done through the regulation process, but Executive Directive.


    As an example:
    "The power to control state operations also allows governors to issue executive orders related to state employment and facilities. Governor Kaine used this power in 2006 to issue a GEO that, with few exceptions, prohibits “smoking in offices occupied by executive branch agencies and institutions, including institutions of higher education,” buildings operated by the executive branch, and state vehicles “to improve the health of employees and minimize health risks in the workplace.” In so doing, Governor Kaine relied on powers derived from both the Virginia Constitution and relevant state laws. Until Virginia enacted legislation addressing environmental smoke in state and local government buildings in 2009, this GEO protected state employees and visitors in state buildings and vehicles from secondhand smoke exposure."

    Power to do this is claimed under Va. Const. Art. V, §1. &. Va. Code §§2.2-100-135 (2011).
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3560871/

    There are 3 branches to our state government: Executive, Legislative, and Judicial. The governor is the CEO and Chairman of the Board of the Executive branch. He can hire or fire a director or move his office to the bathroom.......well almost.
    Thank you for this post, I've got some reading to do.

    I will start by saying that while the governor is granted power under Article V, Section 1 of the Virginia Constitution, his power is restrained (as is all powers granted by that document) by Article I, Section 13:

    That a well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defense of a free state, therefore, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed; that standing armies, in time of peace, should be avoided as dangerous to liberty; and that in all cases the military should be under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power.

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    Also - he doesn't think he's President, he thinks he's Emperor.

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    What is this "open carry" that you speak of, Guvnah? Please show me the legal definition from the Code so that I may know what law not to break....
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