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An example of why I dislike "hate crime" laws

Citizen

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Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,269
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
Without motive and malice, murder is not murder. Making hate toward a class of people a distinct "kind" of murder is not criminalizing thought. There should certainly be nothing wrong with considering a person's hate for the victim's race when considering a homicide by that person.


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True as far as it goes. However, hate-crime laws are not about statutorily enshrining racial prejudice or any other prejudice as a motive accepted by the courts. If malice establishes motive, it establishes motive. Doesn't matter whether the murderer killed out of a motive of jealousy or a motive of hate. Murder is murder.

The point is there is no justification for making a separate class of crime when the existing classes already cover it.
 

Citizen

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Messages
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Location
Fairfax Co., VA
The Icemen had no emotion when killing. It was still murder.

Wait. What!?

No, no, no.

One of the premises offered is that it is valid to increase the offense for certain attitudes or emotional states. Well, then, it necessarily follows--and fairness requires--a reduction of the offense for certain other attitudes or emotional states. If the Icemen had no emotion while killing, then it is hardly fair to categorize them as murderers.

And, what of Jeffrey Dahmer? He actually liked the people he killed--the same way hunters like venison. Surely, fairness requires that a killer who actually likes his victim have his offense reduced to, say, voluntary manslaughter.

These are perfectly rational conclusions based on the offered premise. Why, they just naturally follow. I'm not sure what to do under the offered premise with a cannibal who loves his wife as a spouse, and likes her as a snack. But, I am sure the offered premise will have the breadth to compass the question.

:)
 
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nonameisgood

Regular Member
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Dec 4, 2008
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Location
Big D
The misinterpretation is that malice is hate. Malice is an intent to do harm, which might not include hate.


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DrakeZ07

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2011
Messages
1,080
Location
Lexington, Ky
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/malice

DrakeZ07 is a liberal singularly comfortable in his misery, willing to drag any of us, or all of us, into his misery...for it, his misery, dearly loves company.

Hate crimes are nothing more than white guilt ridden liberals dragging all of us into their misery.

I'm not a Liberal. I just don't really give two sh*ts when it comes to the political side of things, and vote, or not vote, however I want. I mean crap, I voted for Gary Johnson for President in 2012. Besides, I kinda want Dubya Bush to be president in 2016, because that dude was a hilarious president, and easy to make fun of, without being called a racist. Like if Hildawg got elected, making fun of her would leave me being called a sexist! We need another stupid president in office. Dubya 2016!
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
I'm not a Liberal. I just don't really give two sh*ts when it comes to the political side of things, and vote, or not vote, however I want. ....
Based on your posts, of course you are a liberal. Your vote (and non-vote obviously) is of no consequence, just as a liberal with a gun, who votes for liberals, claiming to be a staunch 2A supporter.

Single issue voter I see. Gary Johnson's views on gay issues.

Nothing wrong with single issue voters...per se.

Example: 23% national sales tax?

Just to place his policy in perspective.

Sales Tax Breakdown:
National: 23% (Gary Johnsons' desire)
Missouri State: 4.225%
Saint Louis County: 2.888%
Saint Louis: 1.566%
Total: 31.679%

Gary Johnson would not respect the rights of citizens or work to restore individual liberty.

http://www.ontheissues.org/Gary_Johnson.htm
 

Freedom1Man

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
4,462
Location
Greater Eastside Washington
Hate crime laws. If a white straight man kills anyone who is not a white straight man it is a hate crime. If any other group kills him for being a white straight man it is simply murder. That is why these laws are bad. They are very subjective (at best) and down right awful on the good side.

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