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Thread: OC/CC AR15 pistols in Michigan

  1. #1
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    OC/CC AR15 pistols in Michigan

    Okay I wanted to talk about this in a forum where people actually have a clue about this topic. So here it is.

    What is the legality, position, opinion, of open and or Concealed carry in Michigan and does anyone know of any pit falls caused by Law Enforcement or others in relation to this topic.

    I recently built and registered a AR15 Pistol on November 3rd. It was a bit of a fiasco because the local Sheriff Dept and dealer who sold me the lower receiver and all the parts were really confused as to how this would happen. But I did get a confirmation letter from the Sheriff Dept that it was in the system as of November 3rd 2015 which I still carry, and probably will for some time, just in case of a snafu.

    I would love information or ideas about carry in Michigan I do plan to have this with me a lot and carry in my truck when I travel from one end of my property using a county road to the other end ect.

    Thank you for looking.





    A little about the Pistol for those curious
    .300 AAC/ Blackout
    8.5 inch Melonite Nitrite barrel with A2 flash hider.
    Light quad rail 7.29 inch
    Spikes Tactical Nickle Boron BCG

    Lower
    Spikes tactical
    Velocity Trigger 3#
    Anti Walk pins which I found out later I didn't need when using the Velocity..

    A 500 round break in I kept a 3inch or less group at 100 yards without bench resting it and using a 2 moa red dot. Surprised me...

    This pistol was built to be a reliable Personal defense weapon with some hunting and fun shoot also.


    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by alphamale; 11-23-2015 at 05:52 PM.

  2. #2
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Legally it's a pistol, the end.

    Pitfalls with cops are always possible because many in this region are corrupt us against them *****.

    If you or anyone else who ever finds this thread needs further info I would suggest my extensive free guide book you can download from michigancarries.org
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 11-20-2015 at 08:20 AM.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    Legally it's a pistol, the end.
    And practically, if you look like Leonard Embody, you will upset some of the muggles (and 90% of the Elmer Fudds).
    Not sure how many cops will freak out, but I am sure the number is nonzero.

    I'd keep a copy of my registration record with me, the one you're supposed to be able to throw away 30 days after your pistol is registered with the MSP.

    "It's a pistol, officer, here's the registration. Are we done here?"

    "I don't know if this is legal. I'm detaining you while I investigate"

    "You just openly stated that you are detaining me while you investigate your personal ignorance of the law????
    Do you wish to change that decision, or do you wish to tell a judge why you believe you have the power to detain law abiding citizens while you investigate yourself?"
    Last edited by taxman; 11-20-2015 at 06:56 AM.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    I don't suggest trying to talk your way out of a wrongful police stop. At this point any cop in Michigan claiming confusion over handgun carry laws is either an idiot or thoroughly nuts. Bambuser and your lawyers cell phone number on your phone and memorized in your head are your best options.
    Last edited by Michigander; 11-20-2015 at 06:50 PM.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

  5. #5
    Accomplished Advocate BB62's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taxman View Post
    ..."You just openly stated that you are detaining me while you investigate your personal ignorance of the law????
    Do you wish to change that decision, or do you wish to tell a judge why you believe you have the power to detain law abiding citizens while you investigate yourself?"
    GREAT approach!

    No doubt you'll be free to go immediately.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BB62 View Post
    GREAT approach!

    No doubt you'll be free to go immediately.
    Hey, I figured it was better than going with my instinct to call him a @%%&sucking ********* before inviting him to blow me.

    Oops, I guess I can't say vaginal enema bag here. It's a term cops like to use on cops who enforce the law on other cops, so I use it on cops who enforce the laws that they make up on the spot.
    Last edited by taxman; 11-21-2015 at 07:57 AM.

  7. #7
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    Thanks, in my Blackhawk bag I carry it and extra magazines in is the BATF ruling letter on the pistol and the AFG (Angled fore grip) plus a signed and notarized copy of the registration by the person who put it in the system with date and time, yea she was a PEACH! She was all about helping me... So if they try the I don't know it this is legal crapology then I hand them all this. My vehicle has cameras and audio recording, plus Bambuser and a hidden digital recorder with 600+ hours capability... I been through this before just wondered if anyone had any experiences.....Picture included... Also have the BATF letter about the Thoredsen cheek rest on the gas tube.. Did lots of homework on this..Click image for larger version. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by taxman View Post
    And practically, if you look like Leonard Embody, you will upset some of the muggles (and 90% of the Elmer Fudds).
    Not sure how many cops will freak out, but I am sure the number is nonzero.

    I'd keep a copy of my registration record with me, the one you're supposed to be able to throw away 30 days after your pistol is registered with the MSP.

    "It's a pistol, officer, here's the registration. Are we done here?"

    "I don't know if this is legal. I'm detaining you while I investigate"

    "You just openly stated that you are detaining me while you investigate your personal ignorance of the law????
    Do you wish to change that decision, or do you wish to tell a judge why you believe you have the power to detain law abiding citizens while you investigate yourself?"
    Last edited by alphamale; 11-23-2015 at 05:27 PM.

  8. #8
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    have much more than Bambuser, have a DVR and cameras in my vehicle plus Bambuser and "other"


    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    I don't suggest trying to talk your way out of a wrongful police stop. At this point any cop in Michigan claiming confusion over handgun carry laws is either an idiot or thoroughly nuts. Bambuser and your lawyers cell phone number on your phone and memorized in your head are your best options.

  9. #9
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    I have the state law, BATFE letters that state everything on it is legal and a PISTOL. all in the carry bag the Pistol is in. I posted a picture in another reply.




    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    I don't suggest trying to talk your way out of a wrongful police stop. At this point any cop in Michigan claiming confusion over handgun carry laws is either an idiot or thoroughly nuts. Bambuser and your lawyers cell phone number on your phone and memorized in your head are your best options.

  10. #10
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    Pistol or Rifle doesn't matter, both are legal for OC in Michigan.

    Concealed carry is a different matter, Michigan's Concealed Carry Permit is actually a Concealed Pistol License and it ONLY applies to Handguns. Since your AR is technically a handgun under the law you are perfectly legal to carry it concealed. However I am really scratching my head on how you will ever be able to actually Conceal an AR15 Pistol, especially with a 30 round magazine mounted. Perhaps use a Circus Tent for an outer garment???

    BTW, I have a 300 BLK I put together last year on a Detroit Gun Works receiver set and just love the caliber. As a reloader I also appreciate that this particular caliber uses powders in the H110 burn rate class because H110 is the finest metering powder on the planet. Note, mine is a 16 incher because so it's registration free and the longer sight radius allows me to shoot 2 inch groups at 100 yards with irons when I really concentrate. Just wish the state DNR would certify the 300 BLK for Deer hunting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scooter123 View Post
    Just wish the state DNR would certify the 300 BLK for Deer hunting.
    Are you saying you'd like it treated like a .357 Magnum carbine in the shotgun zone?
    The part that I don't understand is that the way the guide book is written, I can use a 1911 in .45ACP but not a rifle in the same caliber, because .45ACP isn't big enough for a rifle.

    You can now use any centerfire rifle up north, even a .17 Hornet if you want.
    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dn..._7.pdf#page=16
    Deer may be taken with handguns, rifles, crossbows, bows and arrows, shotguns,
    and muzzleloading firearms, including black powder handguns. It is legal to hunt
    deer north of the limited firearm deer zone with any caliber of firearm except a
    .22 caliber or smaller rimfire (rifle or handgun).
    Last edited by taxman; 12-11-2015 at 07:43 AM.

  12. #12
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    The Sheriff dept person actually mailed me a notarized signed copy of my registration card saying the date it was entered into the system. That stays with the gun always just to be safe. I also have a copy in my wallet as backup in case they play games.




    Quote Originally Posted by taxman View Post
    And practically, if you look like Leonard Embody, you will upset some of the muggles (and 90% of the Elmer Fudds).
    Not sure how many cops will freak out, but I am sure the number is nonzero.

    I'd keep a copy of my registration record with me, the one you're supposed to be able to throw away 30 days after your pistol is registered with the MSP.

    "It's a pistol, officer, here's the registration. Are we done here?"

    "I don't know if this is legal. I'm detaining you while I investigate"

    "You just openly stated that you are detaining me while you investigate your personal ignorance of the law????
    Do you wish to change that decision, or do you wish to tell a judge why you believe you have the power to detain law abiding citizens while you investigate yourself?"

  13. #13
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    It is 24 3/8 inches long I am sure a trench coat would work fine.

    As far as carry my main motivation is in my truck carry, meaning loaded and chambered ready to rock. In Michigan we do not have to carry concealed with the CPL. So I could if need be carry it open carry. But again my motivation is truck front seat loaded carry.

    300 AAC does not need certification from the DNR, it is a 30 caliber round that is 16% more powerful than the AK 47 across the power band so to speak.
    With the 8.5 inch barrel I am at the design length minus a 1/2 inch, the 300 AAC was designed for the 9 inch barrel. I get 2 inch groups at 100 yards also, there is no difference with accuracy between the 16 and 8.5 inch barrel. The 16 inch gain is only 150 FPS on average over the 9 inch barrel. There is no measurable difference in the .5 inch between my 8.5 and the designed 9 inch barrel.

    I am now building another 300 AAC in a 16 inch, I will be experimenting with slower burn powder to gain FPS between the 9 and 16 inch barrels. My goal is 2700, I already get 2400+ with the 8.5 without pushing it. My favorite bullet for bad guys is the VMAX 110 grain at 2400 and over PFS

    I used it deer hunting in the really thick swamps we have and it is great for moving around in that crap, unlike a 3030 which hits everything with the barrel.


    Quote Originally Posted by Scooter123 View Post
    Concealed carry is a different matter, Michigan's Concealed Carry Permit is actually a Concealed Pistol License and it ONLY applies to Handguns. Since your AR is technically a handgun under the law you are perfectly legal to carry it concealed. However I am really scratching my head on how you will ever be able to actually Conceal an AR15 Pistol, especially with a 30 round magazine mounted. Perhaps use a Circus Tent for an outer garment???

    BTW, I have a 300 BLK I put together last year on a Detroit Gun Works receiver set and just love the caliber. As a reloader I also appreciate that this particular caliber uses powders in the H110 burn rate class because H110 is the finest metering powder on the planet. Note, mine is a 16 incher because so it's registration free and the longer sight radius allows me to shoot 2 inch groups at 100 yards with irons when I really concentrate. Just wish the state DNR would certify the 300 BLK for Deer hunting.

  14. #14
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    Yep exactly I used to use the 5.56/.223 to hunt deer now I prefer the 300 AAC. Unlike Ohio the 5.56/.223 is illegal for deer. I am way above that line and Mackinac bridge so I don't have the shortcomings of that area.


    Quote Originally Posted by taxman View Post
    Are you saying you'd like it treated like a .357 Magnum carbine in the shotgun zone?
    The part that I don't understand is that the way the guide book is written, I can use a 1911 in .45ACP but not a rifle in the same caliber, because .45ACP isn't big enough for a rifle.

    You can now use any centerfire rifle up north, even a .17 Hornet if you want.
    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dn..._7.pdf#page=16
    Deer may be taken with handguns, rifles, crossbows, bows and arrows, shotguns,
    and muzzleloading firearms, including black powder handguns. It is legal to hunt
    deer north of the limited firearm deer zone with any caliber of firearm except a
    .22 caliber or smaller rimfire (rifle or handgun).

  15. #15
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    We agree


    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    I don't suggest trying to talk your way out of a wrongful police stop. At this point any cop in Michigan claiming confusion over handgun carry laws is either an idiot or thoroughly nuts. Bambuser and your lawyers cell phone number on your phone and memorized in your head are your best options.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphamale View Post

    As far as carry my main motivation is in my truck carry, meaning loaded and chambered ready to rock. In Michigan we do not have to carry concealed with the CPL. So I could if need be carry it open carry. But again my motivation is truck front seat loaded carry.
    And since 'in vehicle' pretty much equals 'concealed' the way the laws are written, and it's a Concealed Pistol License, not a Concealed Firearm License or Concealed Weapon License, we pretty much can't 'truck carry' it unless it's a Pistol under MI law.

    And any cop who sees it on the truck seat it likely to yell "gun" while assaulting you with a gun of his own if it's on an AR chassis. "Felony Stop" first and ask questions later, is the reaction I'd be expecting.
    Last edited by taxman; 01-03-2016 at 10:04 PM.

  17. #17
    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alphamale View Post
    I recently built and registered a AR15 Pistol on November 3rd.
    Hello mate, several questions.
    Firstly, you said, "You built...." an AR15. Now did you lego it together with a lower you got from an FFL or did you cut your own 80% lower?
    The reasoning is this..a lower from a dealer(FFL) would have a serial number and would be "in the system". An 80% may not have any markings at all.

    Next q is registration. We do not do that here, what is needed to stay within the law?
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

  18. #18
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    Interesting question, how do you register a homemade pistol in MI?
    Do you put your name in both the seller and buyer areas of a RI-060 and put "none" in the serial number box?
    Last edited by taxman; 01-06-2016 at 11:23 AM.

  19. #19
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    True and when I was the CCW prior to the stupidity in 2004 I had a General CCW and carried an M4 in my vehicle and no problems. The most inconvenience was the cop drooling asking all about the weapon and wanting to feel it up. He wanted to carry one on duty back then when Detroit had a prohibition on rifles for cops.


    Quote Originally Posted by Scooter123 View Post
    Concealed carry is a different matter, Michigan's Concealed Carry Permit is actually a Concealed Pistol License and it ONLY applies to Handguns. Since your AR is technically a handgun under the law you are perfectly legal to carry it concealed. However I am really scratching my head on how you will ever be able to actually Conceal an AR15 Pistol, especially with a 30 round magazine mounted. Perhaps use a Circus Tent for an outer garment???

    BTW, I have a 300 BLK I put together last year on a Detroit Gun Works receiver set and just love the caliber. As a reloader I also appreciate that this particular caliber uses powders in the H110 burn rate class because H110 is the finest metering powder on the planet. Note, mine is a 16 incher because so it's registration free and the longer sight radius allows me to shoot 2 inch groups at 100 yards with irons when I really concentrate. Just wish the state DNR would certify the 300 BLK for Deer hunting.

  20. #20
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    I bought the stripped lower and the FFL listed it as "other" which is required for an unfinished lower. then when it was finished I let him know he made a CPL card for the Sheriff dept and I got back a photo copy of the registration card Notarized and signed with the date entered in the system mailed to me.
    I thought that was cool as they didn't have to provide me with that proof of legality and registration but they were concerned another officer might not know it was legal and did that for me.


    Quote Originally Posted by taxman View Post
    Interesting question, how do you register a homemade pistol in MI?
    Do you put your name in both the seller and buyer areas of a RI-060 and put "none" in the serial number box?

  21. #21
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    Mine was a stripped Lower (Spikes Tactical) and I built from there.

    80% does not require registration as a rifle. But I think would require for a pistol to meet the Pistol laws. here. (guessing)

    The local Sheriff dept was great on this. See my other post just made before this.



    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie View Post
    Hello mate, several questions.
    Firstly, you said, "You built...." an AR15. Now did you lego it together with a lower you got from an FFL or did you cut your own 80% lower?
    The reasoning is this..a lower from a dealer(FFL) would have a serial number and would be "in the system". An 80% may not have any markings at all.

    Next q is registration. We do not do that here, what is needed to stay within the law?

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