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Plano Apartment Restricts Concealed and Open

Gage Nugent

Newbie
Joined
Jan 6, 2016
Messages
1
Location
Plano, TX
Woke up this morning to find a lease addendum on my front door demanding a signature agreeing that open and concealed carry is only permitted from my apartment to my car, and nowhere else on property. The addendum threatens criminal trespassing charges, even.

There is no 30.06 signage either.

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solus

Regular Member
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Aug 22, 2013
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here nc
gage, welcome to the OC forum...

first i'm not an attorney...but when and where are you going to move to?

ipse
 

77zach

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Feb 5, 2007
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2,913
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Marion County, FL
Assuming they can actually do this with the terms of the lease, I'd just carry concealed. Then move when it's up.
 

cjohnson44546

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2013
Messages
188
Location
Memphis, TN
lol... you have to acknowledge that they cannot guarantee a gun free zone or people's safety... they are basically saying that "gun free zone" is safe... what idiots.

You'd need to check with an attorney, but they'll probably try to force you to sign this by lying about you needing to. I'd decline. Whenever your lease comes up to renew, you won't have that choice anymore, so eventually you'll have to move... but really.. I'm glad I'm no longer a renter, buying a house is the best thing you can do.
 

MAC702

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Jul 31, 2011
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6,331
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Nevada
Agree that we need to know the terms and length of the existing lease.

There are several logical flaws with their letter. First, how do "the new Open Carry Laws" have anything to do with carrying concealed firearms previous or in the future? All it did was make them think about how they've not controlled this aspect of your life yet, and how could they have missed it. Sad people they are.

Second, how can they claim: "you will not be able to ... carry ... a handgun in any common areas?" I think they need a lawyer themselves on how to prepare lease terms and what their limits are in practical physics.

Third, they may now have researched Texas laws. You need to do so. They may not have the right to restrict the lawful wearing of arms from registered tenants.

I'm going to ignore the whole "just conceal anyway" debate. It's not the point. It's what rapists and murderers do, and it sickens me that your landlords don't care.

Get prepared. Do some research. Get the crime statistics for your neighborhood. Bury them in a debate. How well do you know your neighbors? How many are affected by this policy? Who was responsible for the policy? Is it someone that has the same power at other properties?
 

solus

Regular Member
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Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
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here nc
mac702, et al., the letter prob has absolutely nothing to do with any type of firearm activity per se, but rather is a ruse w/a hidden agenda as a reason to get folk to vacate (when lease is up or sooner) so they can raise leases to market level, tho seems already pricey to this humble southern hick...

bottom line OP, you smile & sign, or move either immediately or upon your lease expiration or spend $$$ for an attorney who will in all probability tell you to smile and sign or tell you to move either immediately or upon your lease expiration.

ipse
 

qednick

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Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
499
Location
Bandera, TX
Gage welcome to the forum! I seem to recall hearing about similar issue(s) and resulting lawsuit(s) in other states. Now IANAL but I'm really not sure they can do this or make you sign. You might want to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office about them trying to change the lease terms on you. As a tenant you have the right to peaceably enjoy the apartment, grounds and facilities for which you have paid under your lease.
 

Grapeshot

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Gage welcome to the forum! I seem to recall hearing about similar issue(s) and resulting lawsuit(s) in other states. Now IANAL but I'm really not sure they can do this or make you sign. You might want to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office about them trying to change the lease terms on you. As a tenant you have the right to peaceably enjoy the apartment, grounds and facilities for which you have paid under your lease.

Lease terms may not be changed during the term except by mutual consent - sign nothing.

Historically the AG is the state's attorney - he/she does not give legal advice or interpretations of law to commoners, only to governmental agencies and officials.
 

Citizen

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Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,269
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
SNIP Agree that we need to know the terms and length of the existing lease.

I was the victim of such a tactic by a large property manager on two occasions. Not about guns, but other stuff.

On one occasion, they sent a letter saying they were requiring all residents to re-sign their leases instead of converting to month-to-month at the end of the lease. My thought: "Uh...no. All you can do is cancel the month-to-month lease. You cannot require me to sign a new one."


On another occasion, they demanded mid-lease that all residents obtain renter's insurance. Of course, in the body of the letter was the little requirement that the renter name the property owner as an additional insured. My thought: "Uh...no. In fact, the already signed lease expressly said renter's insurance was not required but was strongly recommended. So, where do you get the idea you can unilaterally change the terms of a lease (contract)?"

I ignored them both times. On the first issue, they quit trying. On the second, they kept sending out the renter's insurance demand. I kept ignoring them. Until they actually threatened to not extend the lease for another year. Then I bought renters insurance, but only when they finally exercised a right they actually possessed.

I would never have believed a professional property management company would try such tactics. Then I saw it with my own eyes.
 

qednick

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Bandera, TX
Lease terms may not be changed during the term except by mutual consent - sign nothing.

Historically the AG is the state's attorney - he/she does not give legal advice or interpretations of law to commoners, only to governmental agencies and officials.

True. But the TX AG will take complaints regarding landlord/tenant issues and will contact the LL. They just won't file a lawsuit on your behalf.

Another free option is to file a complaint with the BBB about them wanting to unilaterally change the terms of the lease.
 

davidmcbeth

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Jan 14, 2012
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earth's crust
True. But the TX AG will take complaints regarding landlord/tenant issues and will contact the LL. They just won't file a lawsuit on your behalf.

Another free option is to file a complaint with the BBB about them wanting to unilaterally change the terms of the lease.

One may be able to contact the legislature for an explanation of a law. Most have research branches that will take legislator's questions regarding laws and give their opinion ~ their opinion is worth as much as an AG's.
 

Grapeshot

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--snipped--
On one occasion, they sent a letter saying they were requiring all residents to re-sign their leases instead of converting to month-to-month at the end of the lease. My thought: "Uh...no. All you can do is cancel the month-to-month lease. You cannot require me to sign a new one."
Actually yes they can if they have given proper notice of non renewal of existing terms and conditions. Either one signs/accepts or vacates - doing neither puts one in the category of being a Tenant at Sufferance....and you would be subject to all expenses to recover said property.

"A tenant at sufferance is a person who has been in lawful possession of property but who wrongfully remains as a holdover after his right to possession has expired. See ICM Mortgage, 902 S.W.2d at 530; Black's Law Dictionary 1604 (9th ed. 2009)"
http://causeofactionelements.blogspot.com/2011/06/at-will-tenancy-and-holdover-tenants.html
 

Grapeshot

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True. But the TX AG will take complaints regarding landlord/tenant issues and will contact the LL. They just won't file a lawsuit on your behalf.

Another free option is to file a complaint with the BBB about them wanting to unilaterally change the terms of the lease.
Cite please.

Contacting the LL would still be acting as your agent IMO.
 

qednick

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499
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Bandera, TX
Cite please.

Contacting the LL would still be acting as your agent IMO.

Here's the online complaint form:
https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/forms/cpd/form.php

Here's the downloadable printed complaint form:
https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/files/cpd/complaintform.pdf

The latter specifically says they may send a copy to the business. Like I said, they won't take action on your behalf, but the complaint becomes public record and no business wants that. If enough people make the same complaint, the AG's office may take legal action for the good of the public--you just may not end up being compensated.

It may not be the same as hiring a lawyer to file suit to settle a specific grievance. I simply suggested filing with the AG and BBB as quick and free ways to assert one's consumer/tenant rights.
 

Grapeshot

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Here's the online complaint form:
https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/forms/cpd/form.php

Here's the downloadable printed complaint form:
https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/files/cpd/complaintform.pdf

The latter specifically says they may send a copy to the business. Like I said, they won't take action on your behalf, but the complaint becomes public record and no business wants that. If enough people make the same complaint, the AG's office may take legal action for the good of the public--you just may not end up being compensated.

It may not be the same as hiring a lawyer to file suit to settle a specific grievance. I simply suggested filing with the AG and BBB as quick and free ways to assert one's consumer/tenant rights.

I like that - it is proactive consumer protection. At the least, it has the potential for being so.
 

stealthyeliminator

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Dec 29, 2008
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3,100
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Texas
You don't ask a question, but I am going to answer as if you did ask a question.

Get a lawyer. Period. Nobody on this forum is going to be accompanying you to or representing you in court. You need to find a reputable lawyer that can represent you and your best interest, and seek advice from them.
 

notalawyer

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2012
Messages
1,061
Location
Florida
They cannot make you read it or sign it, they also cannot do anything (except not renew) if you don't.

What they should have done is just post the 30.07 signs. Which in no way would have any impact your use of the common property (Concealed was and is still OK), then they should just wait and add the 30.06 signs after all existing leases expire) and put both the 30/.06 & 30.07 language in the new leases therefore avoiding any potential lawsuits for restricting your use of the common areas while armed.

Of course this all depends on their authority to do any of this under the laws of Texas.


ETA: Now that I think about it, the signs are going to be problematic. According to the law, they must contain specific verbiage. So I don't see any way to include/exclude certain portions of the property. The leasing office, maybe, but the common areas...I'm not so sure. If they put a sign up at the entrance, one would assume they mean to include the entire property, including inside the apartments - something I don't think they can do.

Time to find a good landlord/tenant attorney.
 

qednick

Regular Member
Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
499
Location
Bandera, TX
I like that - it is proactive consumer protection. At the least, it has the potential for being so.

I probably should've said "may contact the LL". Alas, I was going from memory after filling out one of these forms a while back with my own LL complaint.
 
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