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Thread: Incomplete advice from self-defence "expert"

  1. #1
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Incomplete advice from self-defence "expert"

    How to survive an active shooter
    http://www.nbc12.com/story/31109872/...active-shooter

    Instructor Robby Beard of USA Karate leaves out/ignores carrying a gun as an option.

    Also sitting inside one's family (restaurant booth) is too restrictive and ignores other means.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Some of this training is useful for kids. They don't have guns. Adults, different story. But, I don't believe all adults should be carrying. I have some nice friends that I would never want them to touch a gun. For them maybe this training would be good.

    I have a neighbor totally afraid of guns, but he is very happy I'm his next door neighbor. Knowing his temperament I would not want him having a gun. So, I think these people need an alternative. I'm just say'n.....

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by color of law View Post
    Some of this training is useful for kids. They don't have guns. Adults, different story. But, I don't believe all adults should be carrying. I have some nice friends that I would never want them to touch a gun. For them maybe this training would be good.

    I have a neighbor totally afraid of guns, but he is very happy I'm his next door neighbor. Knowing his temperament I would not want him having a gun. So, I think these people need an alternative. I'm just say'n.....
    Your point is well taken.

    Still Mr. Beard does leave out the single most effective means of stopping the threat. Unfortunately, it appears to me that it does not fit his financial profile.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    While the martial arts seem to have less safety risks of collateral damage, they seem like they'd be harder skills to gain competence in than firearms. Can someone be "smart" enough to learn martial arts but not to learn how to carry and shoot safely and effectively?
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    quote: Because the goals are different, self-defense training is radically different than martial arts training. Just because you're trained in one, doesn't mean you can do the other. Having said that: Any martial art system can be used effectively for self-defense. You can create a successful self-defense strategy using traditional martial art movement and the proper mindset/ strategy. But that isn't going to happen on it's own.

    what aspects of your art you need to emphasize to deal with assaults and attacks. Self-defense has its own requirements. You cannot use the techniques and mindset of the sparring ring in a violent confrontation -- especially if you try to stand and spar. unquote. http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/

    (no DM, et al., i will not entertain discussion on qualifications on the authors capabilities or character!)

    ipse
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  6. #6
    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Your point is well taken.

    Still Mr. Beard does leave out the single most effective means of stopping the threat. Unfortunately, it appears to me that it does not fit his financial profile.
    The problem is that these NEWS stations feature Infommercials disguised as news.

  7. #7
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    If their were money in it he would've mentioned getting a gun. He does not seem to be a minion of the CC Industrial Complex.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    HELLO, Earth to Robbie whatever your name is:

    I'm +60 years old; the days of me using karate/jidu-jutso/judo/Chuck Norris/Jet Li/Bruce Lee-crap-kinda-stuff is long gone. Along with my non-arthritic knees and not-yet-broken-back!

    I'll stick with my S&W 329PD OC'd at 3 o'clock if you don't mind!

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    Run, Hide, Fight is fine for children and other incompetents.

    But as we have seen in almost every single mass shooter event (and no Robby, they are not a fact of life; in reality they are an extraordinarily rare event) it took a good guy with a gun to end it.

    It took my wife a couple years to finally grasp why I refuse to sit in a booth, or why I always face the entrance, why I wander around new places that we've never been locating the exits, kitchen entrances and bathrooms. I even pick up chairs and slide the table to see how heavy they are. I notice where fire extinguishers and alarms are.

  10. #10
    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FTG-05 View Post
    HELLO, Earth to Robbie whatever your name is:

    I'm +60 years old; the days of me using karate/jidu-jutso/judo/Chuck Norris/Jet Li/Bruce Lee-crap-kinda-stuff is long gone. Along with my non-arthritic knees and not-yet-broken-back!

    I'll stick with my S&W 329PD OC'd at 3 o'clock if you don't mind!
    +1

    I'm too old for Hong Kong Phooey moves and my firearm trigger pull is 6 pounds, delivering Muzzle Energy of 400 ft·lb. Being over 65 isn't after all that bad.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    Run, Hide, Fight is fine for children and other incompetents.
    Run, Hide, Fight is exactly what I intend to do in the unlikely event I find myself in or near violent criminal/terrorist activity. I'm not trained nor paid to run toward bad stuff. I don't have qualified immunity. And should anything at all go wrong, the same folks whom I would be trying to save wouldn't think twice about suing me into bankruptcy or as a member of a jury voting to impose whatever criminal penalties some prosecutor saw fit to bring against me.

    I carry a gun to protect my family, my other loved ones, and myself. I have zero intention of trying to stop a mass shooting event.

    If I and my loved ones can reasonably safely run away, that is exactly what we will do.

    If we can't safely run away, but can shelter in place (ie "hide") in a good defensive position, that will be our course of action.

    If I am forced to fight, I do so with something a little more effective than a chair, book bag, pencil, or bare hands. It will be the best fight I can mount, from the best position I can obtain.

    And if that happens to "end" a threat to the benefit of others, that is great. But make no mistake, that will be nothing but a happy side effect of my singular goal to protect myself and my loved ones from imminent, credible, grave bodily harm.

    But a big +1 on your situational awareness.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    Run, Hide, Fight is fine for children and other incompetents.

    .
    Or should it be call moving out of the line of fire, taking cover and fighting from a superior position.

    All are valid tactical considerations.

    Hands on martial arts are good to know but being able to perform them a very personal thing.

    Armed martial arts of various types impact weapons, edge weapons, firearms, improvised weapons are good skills to have also.

    Relying on just one tool, technique or how one might response limits your ability to react in what but be a more appropriate matter then just relying on your firearm.

    He is selling a product his product is unarmed self-defense take for what it is. One might learn something useful but stuff happens what are you going to do if your gun doesn't go bang for some reason.

    I prefer to have different arrows available in my quiver.
    Personal Defensive Solutions professional personal firearms, edge weapons and hands on defensive training and tactics pdsolutions@hotmail.com

    Any and all spelling errors are just to give the spelling Nazis something to do

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    An identified elite?

    Have we finally identified a proper elite, we seniors? Not everyone makes it, has made it or will make it.

    I see other venues treating ageism as any other discrimination, and those seeking any esteem gravitas graying their (as though balding shaved wasn't enough).
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  14. #14
    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Have we finally identified a proper elite, we seniors? Not everyone makes it, has made it or will make it.

    I see other venues treating ageism as any other discrimination, and those seeking any esteem gravitas graying their (as though balding shaved wasn't enough).
    I use every gray hair on my head to my advantage. Even every gray hair in my beard. When I encounter a young snot-nosed cop I ask them if their mother taught them to disrespect their elders. A few months back I confronted a cop that parked his cruiser in a fire lane to do his personal shopping in Home Depot. I confronted him over it and he decided to get smart with me. Not good. I filed a complaint.
    COMPLAINT

    Attn: Citizen Complaint Resolution office. 10/20/15

    On October 16, 2015, between approximately 1:30 p.m. and 1:45 p.m., officer Michael Ammann's cruiser was parked in the fire-lane in front of Home Depot, (6300 Glenway Ave., Cincinnati, OH 45211). No lights or siren were activated. The pavement was clearly marked with yellow diagonal lines and signs were posted indicating that the area was a no parking fire zone area.

    During the time noted above officer Michael Ammann was inside the store shopping and did make a purchase.

    After observing Michael Ammann's purchases, I asked the officer what authority he was relying on that gave him the right to park in a fire lane to conduct his own personal business. Officer Ammann started to make excuses for his actions with what ifs. His demeanor and actions clearly conveyed an attitude that he was above the law, entitled and privileged. Because of his flippant irreverence I informed him that I would file a complaint. His response was humorous in that he conveyed a see what that will get-ya deportment; implying that his attitude was proper and acceptable.

    Apparently officer Ammann believes the Cincinnati Police Manual 12.215 “CINCINNATI PARKING INFRACTION (CPI)” only applies to us law abiding citizens, specifically section 12.215(B)(4)(e). Of course, I would think not.

    If the above patronizing attitude is an example of officer Ammann's October 17, 2013 “Award for Exemplary Conduct” then Procedure 18.110, section E, needs to be totally revamped. In other words, Officer Ammann's attitude is clearly an inconsistent conduct expected of our public servants, in effect, failing to demonstrate a high professional manner or leading by example.

    And the Cincinnati police department wonders why there is such contempt for police officers' egotism.

    I expect this complaint be made a permanent part of officer Michael E. Ammann's personnel record and accessible through ORC 149.43.

    XXXXX
    He admitted to it and he was disciplined.

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    Definitely as one ages one slows down. I sure don't run, jump or fall down and get up as well as I did when I was 20.

    One needs to learn other ways then relaying on youth and vigor.
    Personal Defensive Solutions professional personal firearms, edge weapons and hands on defensive training and tactics pdsolutions@hotmail.com

    Any and all spelling errors are just to give the spelling Nazis something to do

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    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    Definitely as one ages one slows down. I sure don't run, jump or fall down and get up as well as I did when I was 20.

    One needs to learn other ways then relaying on youth and vigor.
    I rely on 6 pound trigger pull.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    Definitely as one ages one slows down. I sure don't run, jump or fall down and get up as well as I did when I was 20.

    One needs to learn other ways then relaying on youth and vigor.
    Other ways - see my signature line.

    Am reminded of the two bulls on a hill top over a herd of cows.

    Young bull says, "Let's run down their and surprise one."

    To which the old bull replied, "Let's walk down there and surprise them all."


    Be the Sir that gives the prize.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by color of law View Post
    I rely on 6 pound trigger pull.

    At the right time no problem used at the wrong time big problems.
    Personal Defensive Solutions professional personal firearms, edge weapons and hands on defensive training and tactics pdsolutions@hotmail.com

    Any and all spelling errors are just to give the spelling Nazis something to do

  19. #19
    Accomplished Advocate color of law's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    At the right time no problem used at the wrong time big problems.
    The older you get the shorter that wrong time list gets.....

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