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Thread: Fl Senate once again kills open carry, campus carry

  1. #1
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Fl Senate once again kills open carry, campus carry

    http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/the-bu...n-says/2264593


    When you pull that "R" lever in the voting booth regardless of who it is there will be consequences. Of course, the asshat is from Miami so it doesn't really matter, but it happens in other gun friendly districts too.

    And dishonorable mention to Representative Wood, who just HAD to have CC for lawmakers on the floor, right now. He made it harder to pass for no reason. When in session, the floor is crawling with well trained armed security, not to mention the metal detectors at every entrance.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/the-bu...n-says/2264593


    When you pull that "R" lever in the voting booth regardless of who it is there will be consequences. Of course, the asshat is from Miami so it doesn't really matter, but it happens in other gun friendly districts too.

    And dishonorable mention to Representative Wood, who just HAD to have CC for lawmakers on the floor, right now. He made it harder to pass for no reason. When in session, the floor is crawling with well trained armed security, not to mention the metal detectors at every entrance.
    Especially in light of the fact that they can do that now.

    790.25(3)
    The provisions of ss. 790.053 and 790.06 do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:
    . . .
    (n) A person possessing arms at his or her home or place of business
    . . .
    The capitol and their district offices are their place of business.

  3. #3
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    Especially in light of the fact that they can do that now.

    790.25(3)


    The capitol and their district offices are their place of business.
    Huh. Never thought about that. Add that to the list of clusters in Floriduh ' s "gun control" scheme.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Wow! Diet Castro comes right out and says that he is blocking it because he's afraid the people might get their way if he "allows" a vote.

    This is precisely why we call it Floriduh.

    Sad little king of a sad little hill. Call me if anyone interesting shows up...
    Last edited by ixtow; 02-12-2016 at 10:20 PM.
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    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    Regular Member ADulay's Avatar
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    That article brings up a good point.

    Perhaps we should hit the governor hard with emails and letters to force the bills out of their "holding areas" to bring them up for a vote.

    Too many people hanging on to the Republican name but when called out to actually do something, they are all hoping to just have the bills die without any of them having to actually put their name on something.

    Pitiful.

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Why is he so afraid of the will of the people getting a chance?

    Even bills I oppose, I want to at least be heard and voted upon, not mired in tyrannical Banana Republic BS and inflammatory lies and slander used as the excuse...

    He's made it clear what he thinks of Gun Owners... We're all just itchin' for an excuse to go "wild west" in his eyes. We can't be allowed to carry a gun in public... Even though we already do... So... Yeah. Something. There was a lot less violence in the "wild west" than there is in his district! It would be a significant improvement!

    I was thrilled to see the article cover the BS argument about tourism. The overwhelming majority people visiting from other states are coming from a State that already has Open Carry. He knows this and flat-out lied about it. Plenty of extra-national tourists come here specifically to see what a free society is like. Gun Tourism is a thing, you know...

    It's easy to find "the vocal minority" barking about how they'll boycott Florida... They must be boycotting 45 other states, too... Do you think these loudmouth fools even know that almost every state in the country has open carry already? They don't even notice that they already live in an open carry state... They're just hateful, idiotic, paper tigers. But, there are plenty, including myself, who won't go places where they have to give up a right. I do my best to spend my money up in Georgia, even though I live in Florida, because I can Open Carry there. Only 2 times has something "negative" happened, and it was a fraudulent 911 call from some @sshole liberal trying to get me SWATted for OC. Both times the Cops who responded were professional, and one hung around talking guns for about half an hour so the dirty libtard could watch and see.

    People who are not aware of, and do not want, their rights, can't and don't follow through with their idle chatter. People who are aware, and do value their rights, do follow through.

    It's been years since I paid fuel tax in Florida, because I buy my fuel in Georgia. What impact has the loud-mouthed anti-gun welfare leach, who lives in an open carry state and doesn't even know it, who doesn't take vacations to Florida anyway and never will... A boycott from people who have no jobs... Wow, so scary.

    A boycott from people who actually have money, who are unwilling to give up their rights just to go to a beach... There are plenty of beaches in Texas, North Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi...

    Oh hell, how many times has the TSA missed an accidental/forgotten PT738, LCP, or P-3AT?

    Go to The Bahamas, they don't even notice... Have you ever had your bags actually searched on a cruise liner? I've carried guns I forgot I had across borders plenty of times. X-Rays and everything... You think security theater is only bad here in the USA? Have you never seen how lazy they are in The Bahamas? Even if they knew for a fact that you were smuggling a crate full of AKs, most of them probably wouldn't get off the chair to do anything about it...

    The major point is that it is not up to one man. But he learned well from his nicknamesake. He's Castro Lite for a reason. He has spoken falsehoods to a complicit press that repeats those falsehoods, while simultaneously forbidding anyone else to have a voice by blocking the vote. Why block the vote? Why prevent any and all discussion? Why tell lies to a complicit media? These things add up to anti-republic, anti-democratic tyranny. Why is he so afraid of a vote? He would stop any election if he could. Why risk getting ousted when you can simply be a dictator?

    Why harass Rick Scott about it? It's his place to sign bills, not dissolve the separation of branches, overstep his place, and boss the legislature around. Sure, we want this to pass, but haven't we seen enough of that sort of corruption, especially on the Federal level? Why should we expect/demand the same degree of corruption we see elsewhere. It's become so commonplace we forget that it's corruption to violate that separation of powers...

    How can we claim to denounce the flagrant Legislative corruption of Portilla and Gardiner as we request Executive corruption in the same breath? No. I'm not cool with that. Take the High Road, or don't. Don't cherry-pick it at convenience.
    Last edited by ixtow; 02-13-2016 at 01:24 PM.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
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    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    ixtow, I appreciate your point of view, but anything in politics can have a good side and a bad side. That doesn't mean you throw out the baby with the bath water. Separation of powers doesn't mean the Governor must sit on the sidelines, and wait passively for bills.

    The Governor already cherry picks what he wants by working with the legislature, sometimes in public ways, to get bills passed that he wants to sign. And he doesn't mind telling people about it when they work together to get it done.

    If he really respects our rights, should he be shy to say even if just once, "Hey, you know folks, open carry and campus carry could benefit our citizens."

    Would that be him acting like a corrupt politician or dictator? I don't believe so.

    He doesn't have to use an iron hammer here. All he needs to do is to cheerfully advocate for us, even once. Has he? Why not?

    The very question of why not, is exactly why everyone should be calling, emailing, and sending letters to him. Yes?
    Last edited by phil1979; 02-13-2016 at 01:23 AM.

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil1979 View Post
    He doesn't have to use an iron hammer here. All he needs to do is to cheerfully advocate for us, even once. Has he? Why not?

    The very question of why not, is exactly why everyone should be calling, emailing, and sending letters to him. Yes?
    I see your point, but I prefer strict precision. To defy the separation of powers for "good reasons" leads to setting the idea that it can be done, and then stretched to any purpose. As we already see abounds... The example of how yet another slippery slope can not only be slid down, but already has been... It's like standing with the evidence in hand and still acting like it's not there... You may say it's unimportant, and that "togetherness" is worth it... But it takes little to twist that into a weapon against the very principles it claims to stand for.

    From another perspective, Rick Scott does not lose his right to have his own personal options and interests just because he is Governor. In that capacity, I see no reason why he shouldn't speak his mind, or not. It appears that he has already selected that position. If you wish to get out your tinfoil hat, it wouldn't be far-fetched to say that he's the one emboldening the blockage... By the converse, Dubyah said he'd sign an "assault weapons" bill, if congress put it on his desk, because he knew it wouldn't happen... This could easily be the same deal, and it is SOP, so....

    I think the most useful points here are that Tourists are not scared away by guns. More often than not, they come here FOR guns. Those who already have open carry, do make other plans when they realize Florida will strip them of their rights.

    Have you not heard the rhetoric about the USA already being the Wild West? Yet they still come here, no? Millions even cross the border illegally... Because it's a horrible blood bath and they all have a death wish? Really?

    As far as this false violence argument about the "Wild West" is concerned... The entire concept of violence in the "Wild West" is statistically minuscule compared to what happens in Portilla's district alone. Think about it. I've heard the stupid argument so many times: "Now the criminals have to wonder who has a gun and who doesn't!" Really? You think they have such deep thoughts? Why rely upon the alleged philosophical musings of borderline brain-dead animals beset with a desire to rape, rob, and murder? In what universe does that even sound like a good idea? Do these criminals seem like enlightened thinkers to you? Why wonder against wonderment whether or not they're wondering? Make sure they know by letting them see it!

    I'm reminded of Obummer's little comment about "places with guns have shown the least reduction in violent crime" comment... Dur, it's hard to reduce below zero! Of course the places which barely had X to begin with are showing the least reduction in X... My house shows absolutely no reduction in rape, murder, and robberies, because I have guns here and everybody knows it. Therefore, those things don't happen!
    Last edited by ixtow; 02-13-2016 at 01:45 PM.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  10. #10
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    I still think Portilla is just the fall guy. We have only to blame but ourselves. I predicted before the session started all we'd get is "gun control". I was correct. The shooting range bill is on the governor's desk and he will sign it shortly. It's truly pathetic and beyond outrageous. Alas, there's nothing I can do. I'm a life member of Fl Carry now and a NRA member, nothing really remains. If the numbers stay the same in both chambers, it may very well go through next year with pro gun Neg ron as Senate President.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Thanks for your excellent analysis, ixtow! You make some very good points!

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    Georgia Colleges Could Soon Attract More Florida Students


  13. #13
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    I doubt that very much.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  14. #14
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    I think the governor would sign the OC bill, it's just not very important to him. Politically speaking Gardiner must not be that smart. He might have little to lose by not sending the bill to the floor, but he certainly could gain something if he did. He'd be a hero to the 2nd amendment crowds. There are very few people who are passionately anti gun. The anti gun media would forget about open carry a few months into it because we know nothing dramatic or very interesting would happen. He stands to gain a lot from the conservative crowd here if he wants to run for other offices.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    'Interesting' idea. And yes, I put interesting in quotes to mock the suggestion.

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    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    A big Bloomberg win in fake pro gun Florida.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Why thank you for taking an interest in the article! :-)

    Well, my thinking on this is that if I were a 21 year old who was licensed to carry a firearm, and carried daily as a matter of course for my personal protection, and if I were about to enter college, and had the choice of going to one in Florida where I'd be a sitting duck on campus, or Georgia where I could carry if HB 859 passes (and it looks like it will), what choice do you think I'd make?

    But you don't suppose there are others that think this way in Florida? I'm not mocking that or anything. ;-)


    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post

    'Interesting' idea. And yes, I put interesting in quotes to mock the suggestion.
    Last edited by phil1979; 02-17-2016 at 11:31 PM.

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    Accomplished Advocate BB62's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil1979 View Post
    ...if I were about to enter college, and had the choice of going to one in Florida where I'd be a sitting duck on campus, or Georgia where I could carry if HB 859 passes (and it looks like it will)...
    When will it be known whether HB859 is going to pass or not (and get signed by the governor)?

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    My inside feelers give it a great chance of passing this year. If Gov. Deal either lets it sit on his desk for 40 days or signs it before then, it will be law come this July 1st.


    Quote Originally Posted by BB62 View Post
    When will it be known whether HB859 is going to pass or not (and get signed by the governor)?

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    Portilla Pulled The Plug On Open Carry


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    Regular Member hammer6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phil1979 View Post
    Why thank you for taking an interest in the article! :-)

    Well, my thinking on this is that if I were a 21 year old who was licensed to carry a firearm, and carried daily as a matter of course for my personal protection, and if I were about to enter college, and had the choice of going to one in Florida where I'd be a sitting duck on campus, or Georgia where I could carry if HB 859 passes (and it looks like it will), what choice do you think I'd make?

    But you don't suppose there are others that think this way in Florida? I'm not mocking that or anything. ;-)

    i think you'd choose whichever college your parents said they would pay for.
    Last edited by hammer6; 02-19-2016 at 07:24 AM. Reason: spelling

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    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammer6 View Post
    i think you'd choose whichever college your parents said they would pay for.
    Lol, true. I went to UCF. Concealed meant concealed.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  23. #23
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by phil1979

    Why thank you for taking an interest in the article! :-)

    Well, my thinking on this is that if I were a 21 year old who was licensed to carry a firearm, and carried daily as a matter of course for my personal protection, and if I were about to enter college, and had the choice of going to one in Florida where I'd be a sitting duck on campus, or Georgia where I could carry if HB 859 passes (and it looks like it will), what choice do you think I'd make?

    But you don't suppose there are others that think this way in Florida? I'm not mocking that or anything. ;-)
    Quote Originally Posted by hammer6 View Post
    i think you'd choose whichever college your parents said they would pay for.
    That would likely depend on how strongly one feels about personal protection. Many people have acquired their education w/o help from parents.

    There are people with the "it won't happen to me" mentality - some of them were at Virginia Tech when the infamous shooting occurred there on April 16, 2007.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by phil1979 View Post
    Why thank you for taking an interest in the article! :-)

    Well, my thinking on this is that if I were a 21 year old who was licensed to carry a firearm, and carried daily as a matter of course for my personal protection, and if I were about to enter college, and had the choice of going to one in Florida where I'd be a sitting duck on campus, or Georgia where I could carry if HB 859 passes (and it looks like it will), what choice do you think I'd make?

    But you don't suppose there are others that think this way in Florida? I'm not mocking that or anything. ;-)
    In reality, I would suspect nearly zero. Especially due to the 3x more expensive out of state tuition?

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    The old desk drawer veto at work again.

    If the folks in his district won't remove him, can the GOP leadership remove his chairmanship or send the bills through a different committee?

    Are there any procedural moves that can resurrect the bill or did 1 person just torpedo the whole thing?

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