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Thread: OC and or CC on the WWU Campus

  1. #1
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    OC and or CC on the WWU Campus

    Has anyone ever seen or read the below RCW ? In reading this RCW, it sounds to me like only duly appointed and commissioned law enforcement officers are allowed to carry on a college campus. Looks like not all gun laws are in RCW 9.41 as I thought they were.

    WAC 516-52-020

    Firearms and dangerous weapons.

    (1) Only such persons who are authorized to carry firearms or other weapons as duly appointed and commissioned law enforcement officers in the state of Washington, commissioned by agencies of the United States government, or authorized by contract with the university, shall possess firearms or other weapons issued for their possession by their respective law enforcement agencies or employers while on the campus or other university-controlled property, including, but not limited to, residence halls. No one may possess explosives unless licensed to do so for purposes of conducting university-authorized activities relating to building construction or demolition.
    (2) Other than the law enforcement officers or other individuals referenced in subsection (1) of this section, members of the campus community and visitors who bring firearms or other weapons to campus must immediately place the firearms or weapons in the university-provided storage facility. The storage facility is located at the university public safety department and is accessible twenty-four hours per day.
    (3) If any member of the campus community or visitor wishes to bring a weapon to the campus for display or demonstration purposes directly related to a class, seminar, or other educational activity, permission for such possession may be applied for at the university public safety department, which shall review any such proposal and may establish the conditions of the possession on campus.

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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
    Has anyone ever seen or read the below RCW ? In reading this RCW, it sounds to me like only duly appointed and commissioned law enforcement officers are allowed to carry on a college campus. Looks like not all gun laws are in RCW 9.41 as I thought they were.

    WAC 516-52-020

    Firearms and dangerous weapons.

    (1) Only such persons who are authorized to carry firearms or other weapons as duly appointed and commissioned law enforcement officers in the state of Washington, commissioned by agencies of the United States government, or authorized by contract with the university, shall possess firearms or other weapons issued for their possession by their respective law enforcement agencies or employers while on the campus or other university-controlled property, including, but not limited to, residence halls. No one may possess explosives unless licensed to do so for purposes of conducting university-authorized activities relating to building construction or demolition.
    (2) Other than the law enforcement officers or other individuals referenced in subsection (1) of this section, members of the campus community and visitors who bring firearms or other weapons to campus must immediately place the firearms or weapons in the university-provided storage facility. The storage facility is located at the university public safety department and is accessible twenty-four hours per day.
    (3) If any member of the campus community or visitor wishes to bring a weapon to the campus for display or demonstration purposes directly related to a class, seminar, or other educational activity, permission for such possession may be applied for at the university public safety department, which shall review any such proposal and may establish the conditions of the possession on campus.
    That is not an RCW, that is a WAC. There's a difference. RCWs are laws that apply to everyone in the state of Washington.

    WAC stands for Washington Administrative Code -- it's literally the official handbook for state employees. And just like the Walmart Employee Handbook can't be enforced against employees of McDonalds, the WAC has no legal weight if you're not a state employee.
    Last edited by Difdi; 02-15-2016 at 11:18 AM.

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    the WAC has no legal weight if you're not a state employee.


    False. Take
    296-54 WAC, SAFETY STANDARDS—LOGGING OPERATIONS, an example pulled at random.

    It establishes safety standards for logging operations, that private employers must comply with.

    There are plenty of other WACs that apply to private citizens as well.

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Dean, sorry the reference you mentioned ONLY provides those state employee(s), who enforce state level safety standards credibility and the ability to administratively cite, in this case logging operators. bottom line it is reinforcement of OSHA provisions at the state level.

    ipse
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    Nevertheless, "the WAC has no legal weight if you're not a state employee . . ." is false.

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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    Nevertheless, "the WAC has no legal weight if you're not a state employee . . ." is false.
    Oh? And what is the penalty for violating it? A state employee would be reprimanded or fired, someone in a state regulated job would be reprimanded or fired...since I am in neither, that leaves...?

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    Oh? And what is the penalty for violating it? ...
    No more using a government provided vehicle to run to Costco...or a casino.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    Nevertheless, "the WAC has no legal weight if you're not a state employee . . ." is false.
    you are, unfortunately, misunderstanding the Adm Code, there is no judicial penalty to the state employee, therefore the statement is true.

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    No more using a government provided vehicle to run to Costco...or a casino.
    fast food for a bite to eat...

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  10. #10
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    Oh? And what is the penalty for violating it? A state employee would be reprimanded or fired, someone in a state regulated job would be reprimanded or fired...since I am in neither, that leaves...?


    Your understanding is quite shallow, isn't it? No matter. You've admitted that the WAC applies to more than just state employees, counter to your original contention.

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    What are WACs?

    Washington Administrative Code is the Regulations of executive branch agencies are issued by authority of statutes. Like legislation and the Constitution, regulations are a source of primary law in Washington State. The WAC codifies the regulations and arranges them by subject or agency.

    In simpler rules, WACs are the rules/regulations designated by that specific agency while conducting business at their facilities that are expected to be followed.

    Since this thread is specific to Western Washington University, here is the WAC about firearms:

    WAC 516-52-020

    Firearms and dangerous weapons.

    (1) Only such persons who are authorized to carry firearms or other weapons as duly appointed and commissioned law enforcement officers in the state of Washington, commissioned by agencies of the United States government, or authorized by contract with the university, shall possess firearms or other weapons issued for their possession by their respective law enforcement agencies or employers while on the campus or other university-controlled property, including, but not limited to, residence halls. No one may possess explosives unless licensed to do so for purposes of conducting university-authorized activities relating to building construction or demolition.
    (2) Other than the law enforcement officers or other individuals referenced in subsection (1) of this section, members of the campus community and visitors who bring firearms or other weapons to campus must immediately place the firearms or weapons in the university-provided storage facility. The storage facility is located at the university public safety department and is accessible twenty-four hours per day.
    (3) If any member of the campus community or visitor wishes to bring a weapon to the campus for display or demonstration purposes directly related to a class, seminar, or other educational activity, permission for such possession may be applied for at the university public safety department, which shall review any such proposal and may establish the conditions of the possession on campus.
    [Statutory Authority: RCW 28B.35.120(12). WSR 93-01-080, § 516-52-020, filed 12/14/92, effective 1/14/93; WSR 90-17-031, § 516-52-020, filed 8/9/90, effective 9/1/90.]
    Last edited by mnrobitaille; 02-18-2016 at 12:59 PM. Reason: Added in the WAC pertaining to firearms on the WWU campus

  12. #12
    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanf View Post
    Your understanding is quite shallow, isn't it? No matter. You've admitted that the WAC applies to more than just state employees, counter to your original contention.
    [/COLOR]
    If you must lie about what I said to create your straw man argument, please at least choose a less transparent lie. All anyone needs to do to see you are lying is to scroll up.

  13. #13
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    No lies. Just a better depth of understanding than you.

  14. #14
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    There is apparently no statutory restriction in the Washington Code to carrying on college campuses.

    Administrative codes may have the force of law for the general population if the proper procedure was followed - normally public discussion and input is required. Quite often the only penalty for someone not directly associated with the school is a trespass charge if they do not leave when to instructed.

    Absenting the legal application of an administrative code, there is ka-ching in them thar hills.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    There is apparently no statutory restriction in the Washington Code to carrying on college campuses.

    Administrative codes may have the force of law for the general population if the proper procedure was followed - normally public discussion and input is required. Quite often the only penalty for someone not directly associated with the school is a trespass charge if they do not leave when to instructed.

    Absenting the legal application of an administrative code, there is ka-ching in them thar hills.
    Exactly my point. And since the school is operated by the state, when one of their regulations directly conflicts with the state constitution, the regulation has a severe problem.

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