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Thread: Red Rock Canyon: Restoring Loaded Carry

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    Regular Member garand_guy's Avatar
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    Red Rock Canyon: Restoring Loaded Carry

    Blog post here, because I'm lazy and don't want to do all the HTML mark-up here.

    TL;DR version
    • Rule is an administrative one
    • Bureaucratic processes made the rule and can undo it
    • Nat'l Parks and virtually all the other BLM land allows guns
    • We can write letters to the BLM and bug our Congressmen to get the rule changed


    For such a minor change in light of the circumstances, it's plausible. If not, another grievance to lay against the BLM. I think there are a lot of pissed off Nevadans who hate the BLM enough to lend their support when they might otherwise be disinterested in gun stuff.

    Your thoughts and input before I take it to a wider audience?

    Cross posted, FYI
    Last edited by garand_guy; 03-05-2016 at 06:49 PM.
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    As mentioned in the other forum, I'd do a paragraph addressing the safety issues involved with the necessary handling of a firearm before and after the visit in order to unload/load it, not to mentioned the absurdity of requiring someone to fumble around with loading a firearm during a time of stress when a firearm might be urgently needed.

    The safest place for a sidearm is left alone, in its holster, on your side.
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    Regular Member garand_guy's Avatar
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    Petition

    Sign the petition here!

    And my letter to the state director of the BLM, John Ruhs:

    As you are aware, the carry of loaded firearms not carried for lawful hunting is prohibited within the Red Rock Canyon National Conservation area. That firearms may be carried, yet unloaded (even with ammunition on the other hip) is rather ridiculous and serves no logical safety purpose. Requiring that firearms be unloaded is contrary to this purpose and infringes upon the right to bear arms.Visitors to Red Rock deserve the right to effective self-defense.

    I respectfully request that under the authority you possess that you remove Red Rock supplementary rules 3.2(a)(1),(3) and (b) regarding the possession of loaded firearms.

    There is no evidence to show that this rule has any benefit to safety. Criminals looking to victimize visitors would be undeterred by the rule. Loading and unloading a firearm introduces unnecessary variables that could lead to a negligent discharge. Additionally, due to its relative obscurity buried deep within the Federal Register, many visitors may unintentionally be in violation, though they are law-abiding citizens acting in good faith. Target shooting is already prohibited within Red Rock and the Las Vegas Valley so banning loaded firearms is not necessary to prevent this activity.

    Red Rock is only one of three conservation areas nationally to have a supplementary rule prohibiting possession of firearms. Loaded carry of firearms within the National Park System is explicitly permitted by the “Credit CARD Act of 2009” as long as state law is conformed to and no firearms are brought inside a federal facility. Nevada law allows for the loaded open carry of firearms and concealed carry with a permit.

    The supplementary rule in question is over 20 years old, dating from a time when American attitudes regarding carrying firearms regularly for self-defense was different. Today, many citizens are increasingly concerned about their safety and choose to protect themselves with a firearm. An outdated law, out-of-touch with local laws and modern attitudes should not be a deterrent to those who choose to legally arm themselves.

    Please act to amend the supplementary rules and eliminate this odd and pointless hole in Nevada’s self-defense landscape.

    Thank you,
    Nevada Carry and Frontier Carry

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    Regular Member rightwinglibertarian's Avatar
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    What even? Guys the BLM has no rights to the land they have in the first place. Constitution Article 1 section 8. Why in the world would you be playing games with someone who has invaded public lands illegally? Of course carry is legal. If you believe the Second Amendment that is. If not carry on asking permission from an organisation that has robbed, pillaged and murdered people like some inner city street gang executing people for 'disrespecting' their non-exsistant claims.

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garand_guy View Post
    Sign the petition here!

    And my letter to the state director of the BLM, John Ruhs:
    +1
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member garand_guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rightwinglibertarian View Post
    What even? Guys the BLM has no rights to the land they have in the first place. Constitution Article 1 section 8. Why in the world would you be playing games with someone who has invaded public lands illegally? Of course carry is legal. If you believe the Second Amendment that is. If not carry on asking permission from an organisation that has robbed, pillaged and murdered people like some inner city street gang executing people for 'disrespecting' their non-exsistant claims.
    No! I'm sorry, I really don't think the BLM invaded Red Rock Canyon, after Nevadans asked their senator to create the conservation area. I don't think the rule is an invasion and no, it's not 'legal' if there is a rule, backed by law, banning in. You want to help us with political pressure, signing petitions, and writing letters? Fine. But I do not and will not support anyone engaging in armed militia non-sense over this. As the OP, please please please leave this stuff out of here.
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    Regular Member rightwinglibertarian's Avatar
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    You would not support the deffense of your Constitutional rights? It's all very well to have a conservation area since the People asked for it but to add an unlawful regulation when the text of the 2A is in your face clear is no different than any other tyrant throwing his weight around. Why would anyone with 2 brain cells invite an entity to control more land when they already rule what 80%+ of NV? And people wonder why America has gone downhill so fast. We're seeing it right here on OCDO. Giving up rights as if they are a spare ciggarette or an hour of sleep.

    Sent from my HTC Desire 626s using Tapatalk
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    Quote Originally Posted by rightwinglibertarian View Post
    You would not support the deffense of your Constitutional rights? It's all very well to have a conservation area since the People asked for it but to add an unlawful regulation when the text of the 2A is in your face clear is no different than any other tyrant throwing his weight around. Why would anyone with 2 brain cells invite an entity to control more land when they already rule what 80%+ of NV? And people wonder why America has gone downhill so fast. We're seeing it right here on OCDO. Giving up rights as if they are a spare ciggarette or an hour of sleep.

    Sent from my HTC Desire 626s using Tapatalk
    Sooooo when was the last time you open carried in Washington DC? Or maybe a Federal building? If you haven't then why not?

    And fighting back with a petition and the ballot box is hardly giving up our rights for a smoke.

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    Regular Member rightwinglibertarian's Avatar
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    If I had enough real Americans who actually believed in exercising rights of course I would. But i'm not stupid enough to play lone ranger. Give me 100 Patriots and you bet i'd march in D.C. Rights are not given by the government. The People make the government respect the rights we already have based on the Constitution. Or should do. They've given up and all I hear are excuses.

    Sent from my HTC Desire 626s using Tapatalk
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    "Any and all restrictions on the bearing of arms in public places are nullified as per the Second Amendment"

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    I'm confused. You aren't stupid enough to play lone ranger, but he is a coward for not doing it? How in the world did this hijack happen? He's trying to make progress, and keeping us informed about it. What a loser, eh?
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Right, sell tickets for your grand march in D.C...would ya...i'll take two.

    been to TX or FL yet where you were going to assist those kind folk ?

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

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    Regular Member garand_guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegassteve View Post
    Sooooo when was the last time you open carried in Washington DC? Or maybe a Federal building? If you haven't then why not?

    And fighting back with a petition and the ballot box is hardly giving up our rights for a smoke.
    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    I'm confused. You aren't stupid enough to play lone ranger, but he is a coward for not doing it? How in the world did this hijack happen? He's trying to make progress, and keeping us informed about it. What a loser, eh?
    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    Right, sell tickets for your grand march in D.C...would ya...i'll take two.

    been to TX or FL yet where you were going to assist those kind folk ?

    ipse
    Thanks guys!
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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garand_guy View Post
    Thanks guys!
    we are here for ya garand...

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  14. #14
    Regular Member garand_guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solus View Post
    we are here for ya garand...

    ipse
    But will you help me occupy a Red Rock BLM outhouse in protest with me? Guys... Guys... Guys?
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    Regular Member solus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garand_guy View Post
    But will you help me occupy a Red Rock BLM outhouse in protest with me? Guys... Guys... Guys?
    uh, not sure garand I know you that well...

    'sides you prob want to be a (xxxCensoredxxx)

    ipse
    I'm only human; I do what I can; I'm just a man; I do what I can; Don't put the blame on me; Don't put your blame on me ~ Rag'n'Bone Man.

    Please do not get confused between my personality & my attitude. My personality is who I am ~ my attitude depends on who you are and how you act.

    Remember always, do not judge someone because they sin differently than you do!

    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by garand_guy View Post



    Done

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